One of those little, irritating N moments

[sunblue]

This post is really not all that significant but I couldn't help but vent about it.  We all have tons of stories, big and small, we can share about the behavior of the Ns in our lives......We are all dealing with the big issues of being on the receiving end of Ns...but sometimes, the little behaviors are what can ruin your day.

Today, I had one of those.  It is nothing earth-shattering.  If anything, it is absolutely, positively typical of Ns.  Mine had to do with my Nmom.  This morning, I discovered by accident that my phone/answering machine broke.  I called the manufacturer's tech support and tried to resolve the issue, but in effect, I was told it was broken and I had to replace the whole thing.  This was really important because I just sent out a slew of resumes in response to job ads and I list that phone number as well as an e-mail address.  My phone's answering system indicated there were two "new" messages but I was told by the tech support person that there was no way I could access them.  All of my stored messages and the new messages were lost.

Hence, the importance of rushing out and getting a new one.  My Nmom needed to run some errands so I agreed to go with her on the condition we can go to a store where I could pick up a phone.  My co-dependent Dad also accompanied us.  When we got there, my Nmom immediately went her own way, refusing to accompany me to the electronics department or to help me in the selection (I was a bit overwhelmend when I saw row upon row of phone models and features).  My co-D dad immediately ran to my mom's side in a different section of the store.  When my mom was done with what she was looking for, she immediately wanted to leave, not caring about what I needed to do.

I was mad, hurt, sad and disgusted.  This was usual behavior for her.  But I couldn't help thinking that when I accompany her somewhere shopping, I carefully go from rack to rack of clothes, helping her find items, pick out things she would like, offering my opinion on styles, etc.  But she can never return the favor.  My dad equally just goes along with my mom.

So, there I was, in the electronics aisle, hoping once again for a little help and support, and getting none. 

Ns just are not capable of thinking of the other person.  The world revolves around them.  This way of thinking is just so foreign to me.  I also find that Ns are so quick to judge others.  They can identify another person's faults in a millisecond but really and truly believe they are perfect. 

I also sat and told my Nmom how disappointed and hurt I was that I was not going to get a job that I had spent the last two months interviewing for, working with HR, etc.  I tried to explain to her how difficult the market is right now and how much work I have to put in before getting any offers.  She literally sat there and said NOTHING.  It was like she hadn't heard me.  Not one comment.  Instead, she changed the subject to talk about something of interest to her.  I just thought, "Wow!  She really and truly has ZERO interest in her own daughter."  Feels like a sucker punch sometimes.  Sometimes, it's just so sobering to realize that you will never have anything resembling a normal or even semi-normal relationship with your parents.

No wonder I've always felt so invisible.  It's because I AM invisible.....Really a weird feeling to know that if I passed in the next hour, not a single soul would take interest......

Oh well, like I said.  One of those typical N behaviors.  I really think it gets worse as they age.  They just don't even put up a pretense of caring about other people.

[Lupita]

Sunblue, as I read your post I get disgusted and triggered. I relate to that so much.

But, the good thing, here on my side, it has been a long time since I suffered that. I do not espect almost anything from my mother. Zero. I write her cold trivial e mails and I prepare mys self everyday to read her e mails which are always complaning and accuing me of being a bad daughter.

So, my advise to you, go to the store alone. YOu do not need their company. Somebody in the board told me here:

You do not go to the home depot to buy bread. So, do not expect empathy from your mother.

That wasy, she told me.

If you do not expect love from her you will not be disappointed.

OK, not true, I always dream that one day my mohter is going to love me the way I wish. NO, that is not going to happen. We know that.

But I tell my slef what I just told you and was told to me.

I hope it works for you. It has not worked for me yet, still feel lonely, but I am doing better that I used to..

Love to you.

[Violet]

This post is really not all that significant but I couldn't help but vent about it.  We all have tons of stories, big and small, we can share about the behavior of the Ns in our lives......We are all dealing with the big issues of being on the receiving end of Ns...but sometimes, the little behaviors are what can ruin your day.

Thank you so much for reminding me of this. 

Also, I don't know how long you have known you mom is N, but remind yourself of the FACTS about Nness OFTEN!  For me just knowing she is NEVER going to be able to be there for me emotionally and my finally accepting that, is immensely freeing.  It has taken me more than 50 years to GET it, though, oh well, better late than never....  Try not to beat yourself up.

Your anecdote reminded me of the time my mom came to visit me and me (then) Nhusband.  I had an 18 month old toddler and was 8 months pregnant and she made me take her shopping at a different mall everyday of her week long visit.  She did not one thing for me, she purchased not one thing for me or the baby.  I just remember how completely exhausted I was every day and how much my back and legs hurt and how I just took it, I never even questioned it....  Wow, so glad those awful days are behind me! 

Sunblue, I know the kind and caring people on this board WOULD notice and care if you "passed away."  I can honestly say it would matter to me, even though I don't really know you yet.     Here is a hug:  ((((((((Sunblue))))))))  Violet

[Lupita]

Hi, Sunblue, how have you been?

Hey, I had one of those days yesterday.

We miss you here.

[Leah]

((((( Sunblue )))))  (((((( Violet ))))))  ((((((( Lupita ))))))

[Hopalong]

Hi Sunblue...

I am sorry you had such a rough time, and can't get what you want from your parents.
I noticed this:

my Nmom immediately went her own way, refusing to accompany me to the electronics department or to help me in the selection (I was a bit overwhelmend when I saw row upon row of phone models

I understand that you wanted some company and guidance. At the same time, I was thinking, this sounds as though Sunblue does not see herself as an adult woman.

Do you feel that way? Helpless? Unable to be independent?
If you do, do you think seeing yourself that way has anything to do with your difficulties finding work?

Is there any way we could help you with that here? Like, for example, could we role-play with you some conversations,
or read some job letters, etc? I know I can help with that kind of thing, and I'd be glad to. You could PM me a job letter or post it here, and I'd be happy to work over the language for you...

I hate thinking of you stuck in eternal dependency and imagine the one way out of your depression is going to be
letting go of Mom and Dad. Hard as it is...

with love,
Hops

[Bella_French]

Dear Sunblue,

I am sorry that you felt unsupported through this stressful time. At least you're really noticing exactly *how* you are made to feel invisible. Its almost like being brainwashed, don't you think?

Sunblue, your mother may not change very much in her life-time, but there are people in the world who will not disregard your needs. It can be so empowering to spend more time with such people, and less with the N's we love.

hugs to you

X bella

[teartracks]

Hi Sunblue,

Yep.  Typical behavior of N.

I relate somewhat to what Hops says, but then I think N abused children (even when they become adults) spend a lot of time wanting, needing to catch up.  Just to find a starting place between them and the N parent where something that resembles a relationship has a beginning and there is an opportunity to fill in the empty spaces that went before.

I understand how you feel.  It took many exercises in detachment to get me where I simply stopped expecting anything.  Anything! 

tt

 

[Hopalong]

Thanks, TT....

((((((((Sunblue)))))))))) I'm sorry if I sounded critical. I didn't mean it that way.

I would like to help!

love to you,
Hops

[sunblue]

Hi all....Hops, Tears, Bella, Leah, Lupita, Violet (Hope I didn't miss anyone!)

Thanks for all your comments.  I did not find any of your thoughts critical or offensive in any way.  I understand why you would say what you did.  Regarding my silly little experience with the phone purchase, I did, of course, end up making a decision and buying the phone, as I would have if my parents didn't accompany me.  I didn't expect them to make the decision for me.  I just had hoped they could offer some input.

Technicaly, I'm not independent now (at least in the sense that I'm not living on my own).  But I feel I'm independent since I do everything by myself and I have no one who takes an interest in or input into my life in any way.  I do and have done everything alone---from traveling to movies to dining out to every day decisions to everything in between.  Sometimes, though, I get so tired of doing everything alone...of not having anyone who can offer information or input or suggestions or just be a sounding board.

I am realizing that neither of my parents ever were that or ever will be.  They simply don't care.  My dad is seriously, extremely co-dependent on my mom.  She is his whole life.  I always thought it would be natural for a dad to want some kind of relationship with his kids...but my dad really doesn't.  Unless my Nmom okays it, or it is something she wants, he doesn't care about it.  To never have had a real conversation with your dad about anything that's important to you is sometimes so sobering.  And my  mom, well she is a true N.  Gets worse all the time.  She no longer even has any pretense that she cares about anyone but herself.  She quite literally "tunes out" people if it doesn't interest her or isn't about her.  She'll physically walk away from you, pretend you never said anything or change the subject back to her.  Thus, I...am....invisible.

While I recognize it, I still find it hard to understand that no one in my family thinks of others.  They really don't.  Even my "healthy" brother, although he is certainly more caring, his "help" always comes in a version of what HE deems to be helpful.  No one ever said, "what do you need?  How can I help you?"  I know this may sound selfish.  I don't mean it to.  I do appreciate any help I get...but when I try to help others, I always think first of what THEY need, not what I think they need.  It's a difference in how you think.  Do you think of yourself first or others first?  I think those of us who are on the receiving end of Ns think first of others.

I am very depressed right now, I admit.  I have been trying so hard to find a job and just can't.  I'm getting interviews...but either they end up putting a hold on hiring, I'm overqualified, not qualified in a very specific area, or some other reason.  I've spent the last two months working on a particular position.  They ended up contacting my references whom I know gave me very excellent references...and I hear nothing...not even a ding letter.  So it is extremely frustrating...because I'm caught in a trap.

I think, ultimately, I'm learning that I am alone and always was.  Someone said here that not everyone ignores your needs or disregards you.  But that hasn't been my experience.  I guess just accepting that is key.  I'm trying. 

The other thing I've noticed about Ns and family of Ns...is that if you grew up around an N, you not only are forced to focus on the N, but you lose all sense of yourself.  You have no dreams, interests or wishes of your own when your entire family has focused exclusively on the Ns.  Combined with depression, this effect leaves you feeling extremely empty and with interest in nothing in this world....

Right now, any good thoughts and prayers in terms of employment would be wonderful.  I continue to pray and sometimes I wonder how I keep going considering all the disappointments and rejections I've had to endure.  I've tried to communicate to my brother just how difficult it is to keep sending out applications, going on interviews, doing all the work involved in that and getting rejected over and over again.  Even when it's a good reason, the end result is still the same.  Right now, I'm feeling like a total failure.....and since my Nmmo and FOO family judges people only in terms of how much money they have, how big a house they live in, or how big a job they have, it is really demoralizing.

Anyway, just explaining a bit.  I do appreciate all your thoughts and comments.  I know I'm not alone in how hurt we all have been by Ns.  It is a life-damaging thing....All you can do I guess is try to keep your head above water.

Thank you for throwing me a life line....

Sunblue

[SilverLining]

This post is really not all that significant but I couldn't help but vent about it.  We all have tons of stories, big and small, we can share about the behavior of the Ns in our lives......We are all dealing with the big issues of being on the receiving end of Ns...but sometimes, the little behaviors are what can ruin your day.

I sure understand where you are coming from.  The little behaviors can ruin your day and a constant stream of them can ruin your life.   I believe some N's are skilled at keeping the abuses "little" so the victims can't figure out what is really going on.  Then when the victim reaches the breaking point and can't take it anymore, the N can accuse the victim of making "something out of nothing".   The pattern is the important thing, not the size of the offense. 

If I had a dollar for everytime one of my FOO, particularly my father, flipped a conversation topic back to themselves without listening to anything I had to say, I could retire right now.

[Certain Hope]

This post is really not all that significant but I couldn't help but vent about it.  We all have tons of stories, big and small, we can share about the behavior of the Ns in our lives......We are all dealing with the big issues of being on the receiving end of Ns...but sometimes, the little behaviors are what can ruin your day.

I sure understand where you are coming from.  The little behaviors can ruin your day and a constant stream of them can ruin your life.   I believe some N's are skilled at keeping the abuses "little" so the victims can't figure out what is really going on.  Then when the victim reaches the breaking point and can't take it anymore, the N can accuse the victim of making "something out of nothing".   The pattern is the important thing, not the size of the offense. 

If I had a dollar for everytime one of my FOO, particularly my father, flipped a conversation topic back to themselves without listening to anything I had to say, I could retire right now.

Absolute truth, there.... all of it. In my family, if you protested anything in the least, you were accused of being too serious-minded. But don't dare try to make light of some little thing over which one of them was in a snit. oy. Sure does help to make sense of why invisibility was a preferable option.
Always appreciate your comments, tjr.

(((((((Sunblue))))))))  their anti-life-force has been vacuuming you empty for so long... I just hope you'll keep trying to fill yourself with Light and Truth. You are loved.

Carolyn

[Bella_French]

Dear Sunblue,

I have felt very depressed at times in my life too, and it often coincided with those times where I was too close to an N, such as living with one, or going through an `adjustment' phase after moving away from them. The times that were the best were when I lived with someone stable and kind. I have lived with other women when I  was single, and the daily kindness and communication was like healing balm. I've had a couple of partners, too, who were also gentle and kind, and the depression lifted after a couple of years of that.

Because I've had that history, if I were to live with my parents again and fall into a  deep depression, I would know that the feeling would eventually pass once I was living away from them again. I never used to `know' that, because I hadn't had many good experiences before.

I feel that you will be happy Sunblue, and that you are doing all the right things to achieve that happiness. Eventually you will get a job. I can relate t how hard it is sometimes. I've been through that too, and it was one of the hardest phases of my life to date.

I am thinking of you, Sunblue. Hang in there, OK?

X Bella

[seasons]

((sunblue))

but sometimes, the little behaviors are what can ruin your day.

My heart feels for you. I think their little behaviors are more damaging sometimes than one big out squabble. Being plucked little by little is so damaging to our heart and soul. It's not fair or right or REAL.
They make you feel invisible, I understand. The TRUTH you are VISIBLE, you are smart, kind, loving, hard working etc.
It would be an honor to share your presence.
I would of enjoyed going through the hundreds of phone/answering machines with you. So much to pick from today, something that use to be so easy is now so difficult. lol

I think, ultimately, I'm learning that I am alone and always was.  Someone said here that not everyone ignores your needs or disregards you.  But that hasn't been my experience.  I guess just accepting that is key.  I'm trying

Can I just tell you I have felt soooooo alone in my life. Even when I had loving people around me, I couldn't see, hear or feel their presence.
N's rob of us of so much, the results of the venom is hazardous. We have to fight back, fight for OUR LIVES.
You deserve new experiences, sunblue don't give into them. This would be their victory. You are worth so much. You are worth fighting for, be your new BEST FRIEND.
God loves you, we love you, you are visible, beautiful and our friend.
sunblue I pray for a job, I pray for you, your future and for your freedom to go live and love life without them.
With love and concern for you. seasons





[u  Lupita
But, the good thing, here on my side, it has been a long time since I suffered that. I do not espect almost anything from my mother. Zero. I write her cold trivial e mails and I prepare mys self everyday to read her e mails which are always complaning and accuing me of being a bad daughter.

So, my advise to you, go to the store alone. YOu do not need their company. Somebody in the board told me here:

You do not go to the home depot to buy bread. So, do not expect empathy from your mother.

That wasy, she told me.

If you do not expect love from her you will not be disappointed. [/u]

((Lupita))
Thank you for sharing, it was very helpful to hear your accomplishments as many of us embark on a journey of freedom from our N's. I'm happy you are protecting your heart, expecting nothing while it sounds like you have found a level of peace from that. Very comforting and hopeful. seasons

[Lupita]

Dear Sunblue, Imagine a little thorn from a rose stocked in your finger, if you do not take it out, that little thing of one milimeter, very very small, will cause an infection, the infection can get to the lymph nodes and cause fever and make an invasion to your whole body.
What you have just said is not a little thing. It is a constant thorn stoked in the tip of your finger and every time you touch something, Gosh, it hurts.
I really hope for you to work on detachment. I am very sorry that you are so sad right now, but I promise you that it gets better. Need to work on detachment.
I remember when I was very sad and I was told here that I should not buy bread in the home depot store, and also that I had to volunteer, lol, I work three jobs, and felt so lonely!!! I was told many things, that other people were in worst situation, many things that far from helping, were damaging more.
But, I promise that it gets better. I have been working on detachment, so much, if you just could do that. Meditation, do meditation every day, concentrate, think on detachment, little by little it comes, and one day, ta da!!!!  You do not feel that much pain.
Listen to CD for positive thinking, read something positive everyday, put posters all over your house or your room, about positive thinking.
I will pray for you. You will receive a job, from God, God will send a job for you. Work on your interview skills, visit a web page about how to impress in your interview, ask about resumes. See if somebody can help you improve your resume. And when that happens, I hope that you can have some physical distance from your parents. That helps a lot.
And, do not expect anything from the, that is the clue for not to be disappointed.
Love to you, You will be in my prayers.
God bless you.