Not sure what to put for a title!

[Hopalong]

Hi ((((Tupp)))) --
I had your posts rolling around my mind today, but couldn't get time to answer.

What kind of rises up for me, is that I wonder...perhaps you are lonely.
(Lord knows I often am.)

The approach of the holidays (hell, EVERYTHING about the holidays) makes it so much harder.

If you kind of set aside the whole Hollllllllllllllllllllllllllliday frenzy/expectation/cultural trigger to start feeling some FAMILY happiness...could it also be true that you need more dear, good, reciprocal friends in your life?

I think that whole question means (plus the feelings you're having in a lot of friendships you do have) that it just hurts more, when FOO members bang on bruises, hurt or hurt with neglect, etc.

I hear you about your awakening to a lot of your relationships being NON-reciprocal. Good for you for noticing that, this is huge. Really. I think it has enormous impact on one's future happiness when one begins to see that an adequate measure of reciprocity is what characterizes healthy relationships. Even if one hasn't had many, spotting that, and learning to instinctively retreat when it's all one-way...is what people WITHOUT N-scars do!

Who knew!!!!

I salute you for this realization. Some of your struggles also remind me a bit of what gets labeled "codependency" -- and some of the classic literature on that might lift your spirits, and boost your self-esteem, right about now....

With love to you,
Hops

[Twoapenny]

Hi Hopsie,

Thank you.  The co-dependency stuff is spot on.  I feel like I've drifted back into a situation I got myself out of, at least partially.  I am terribly, terribly lonely and now being honest about the fact that I have very few real, healthy friends is feeling difficult.

I kind of feel tied to people if they've helped me or been nice to me in any way in the past.  I feel like I owe them.  I always feel like I'm getting above myself if I start 'making demands' (when really I'm setting boundaries).  I've had so many friends over the years who've simply stopped calling once I'm no longer useful.  I'm in that sort of place where you clear out the bad bits and then you're left with nothing for a while.  I don't meet many people, and certainly not many who I want to spend much time with. 

I also find it impossible to ignore people who are feeling something that I've felt before - loneliness, fear, isolation etc.  I know how bad it felt for me and I can't bear to think of anyone else feeling that way.  I find it hard not to be likeable, even if people only like me because I'm doing things for them.  I think I read something about that being a fear of intimacy as well, not being able to connect on an emotional level so keeping it safe with practical help rather than bearing your soul.  I have my library of self help books, it seems it might be time to start leafing through them again!

[Twoapenny]

Tupp:

You're gifting your friends and family a part of yourself when you're authentic and share your fears, and hurt with them.

You can provide an opportunity for understanding and better communication.

You can listen to their response and make informed adult decisions about where you really want to file that person in your life based on facts, and not fear.

IF you decide to put healthy boundaries in place surrounding visitors, it doesn 't have to be viewed an an act of aggession.... it can be a simple request with consequences stated rationally.  Nothing personal, no anger, no blaming, just you taking care of your own needs appropriately which can feel so wrong or bad if you don't know what boundaries are or feel you're worthy of them.

Time to start practicing.  It gets easier my dearL: )  I like writing things like that out too, and the reader can go back and re read as needed without any unintended inflections getting in the way, kwim? 

Heck, I think a letter is fine, not too formal at all.  (besides I peck out texts v e r r r r y  s l o w w w ly; ) Not to mention editing is a PITA.

Love,
Lighter

Thank you, Lighter   It's really bothering me again now, I felt alright about it earlier today.  Part of me wants to be honest and say how I feel, the other part just wants to cut them out completely and not have to deal with it - fight or flight response, I suppose.  I think dealing with it is healthier.

[teartracks]

Hi Twoapenny,

"You can please some of the people all of the time.  You can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time."
Abe Lincoln

A teensy weensy cliche - and it only addresses a teensy weensy part of your situation.   )

tt


  

[Twoapenny]

Hi TT,

Thank you, I know what you mean and it does help so thank you for posting   I feel better now I've slept on it; I'm just going to tell her (and some others) straight and if they get upset/angry etc then that is just how it is.  I work really hard with my son, I've every right to expect people to visit when it's convenient for me, not just for them and also to expect them to see me as a person with thoughts, feelings, emotions and not just as a skip they can dump all their stuff into.  I've realised that most people I know are like this, really I've known for ages but the prospect of admitting how lonely I am and how I have very few real friends (and the ones I have are miles away) was just too much to cope with.  It's out now though, and I'm dealing with it so it's onwards and upwards from here.  Thank you xx

[Twoapenny]

Just thinking about loud again.  Some of the friends I am complaining about only visiting when they have a problem will do me favours if I ask them to, but there's no two way socialising between us.  I'm wondering if they have a co-dependency thing going on with me as well?  Perhaps that's why we're drawn to each other?  We help each other out when necessary but then flounder a bit when it just comes to spending time together and enjoying ourselves?

[lighter]

Exploring, educating ourselves, and discovering our own truths is so much more interesting than dwelling on the flaws of others, or repeating unhealthy patterns with the same unsatisfying results. 

Wouldn't it be wonderful to add and experiment with additions and subtractions to our lives every week? 

We could decide to replace one thing/activity with something uplifting, interesting, engaging and totally something we'd normally never consider..........

then DO IT!

I don't know why that's so exciting to consider, Tupp. 

I think bc it might be like cracking the closet door and finding unexpected sunshine and lollipops for some of us.

MMMmmmm, Jolly Rancher Watermelon lollipops!

Light

[Twoapenny]

Lighter I've no idea what Jolly Rancher Watermelon lollipops are but you've made me want to try some   Excitement is the way forward

I've sent my text, the reply back is that she didn't come to my house with a problem.  All the stuff I wrote about people turning up unannounced, how busy I am with my son, how it would be nice to see people for good times and not just when things are bad has been ignored.  Her text to me yesterday was apologising if she upset me, now I've explained what I am upset about she is denying it.  I am too tired for these relationships now.  I will text back that I thought she had come with a problem and just leave it at that.  Now I'm off to hunt for lollipops

[Twoapenny]

Sorry, this is turning into a bit of a stream of consciousness now, I'm just jotting things down as I think of them!

Something that I've been thinking about a lot this morning is that virtually no-one spends any time with my son.  He is the loveliest, sweetest, cutest little man, yet no-one in my family wants much to do with him, and some of my 'friends' don't bother either.  I hadn't really thought about this much before.  But now I am, I'm realising I really must spend time with people who do want to be around him and not keep letting other people take up my time - they take it away from both of us and don't give it back.  So I need to clear those people out so I can make space for more people who love him as much as I do.

[Twoapenny]

And another one from me!

There have been a couple of texts back and forth with me and my sister this morning.  I don't want to argue about it - particularly not over text - so I've just said fine and don't worry about it.  I've said my bit and been honest about how I feel and now I'm just not going to let anyone in if they turn up unannounced or give out tea and sympathy to anyone that I don't see for any other reason.  Now she's sent me another text saying she is worried about it and me and she's going to let me have time out?  I've no idea what to make of it so I've just put my phone away, I'd be interested in what you all make of that?  I think my mindset now is it's done, I've said my bit and there's no point discussing it, it now needs to be down to me changing my behaviour and being more assertive, putting myself first and so on.  So I think I'm going to just leave it as it is and do nothing now.

I've also just been to see my friend whose daughter died a few years ago, it's the anniversary today and I just went to take some flowers to her grave and stood there while my friend sobbed in my arms.  She's still in so much pain and probably always will be, it made me think that life is too precious to waste it on people who don't appreciate you xxx

[Hopalong]

Hi Tupp--
I'm wondering if a way to derail yourself from an intense "rescue people so they'll love me" approach to 1-on-1 relationships,
which backfires in your not being appreciated and feeling lonelier...would be to begin to approach relationships that are more
about COMMUNITY BUILDING than they are, at least at first, about 1-on-1 intimacy or bonding?

IOW, though I know I bang on this like a broken record...what if you and your dear boy got involved in an existing, positive
community? I'm always mentioning how for me, it's the Unitarian Universalists, but it could be Quakers, or any liberal denomination,
or a well-run and very well reputed organization of volunteers that embraces family rather than only individual participation.

I think if the focus on other people that you try for a while is "focus on other people while doing something TOGETHER for something
ELSE -- e.g., a cause or purpose or creative endeavor or social change issue" -- THEN, you are more likely to make friends in a
healthier way.

Community really, truly...is healing.

love
Hops

[Twoapenny]

Thank you Hopsie, that is definitely something I will think about and try to get into.  I like the suggestion very much.  Thank you xx

[lighter]

And another one from me!

There have been a couple of texts back and forth with me and my sister this morning.  I don't want to argue about it - particularly not over text - so I've just said fine and don't worry about it.  I've said my bit and been honest about how I feel and now I'm just not going to let anyone in if they turn up unannounced or give out tea and sympathy to anyone that I don't see for any other reason.  Now she's sent me another text saying she is worried about it and me and she's going to let me have time out?  I've no idea what to make of it so I've just put my phone away, I'd be interested in what you all make of that?  Did you feel a pang of rejection/panic/fear when you read your sister would be giving you a time out?  I'm thinking she's either using a terrorist tactic to get you back in line, or she truly doesn't know what you're talkinga bout (bc she's insensitive/clueless or any number of other reasons) and doesn't want to make things worse, or deal with trying to understand.  Honestly, it sounds like everything's about your sister when she's involved in anything.  What really clues me in is her refusal to invite her brother to large festive gatherings....... and she doesn't invite you either.  WTH?  That's cold, thoughtless and selfish conduct, and she isn't able to see that?  Something's busted inside her, Tupp.  She can't do any better, and that leaves you adjusting your expectations, and doing what you have to do. 

As long as you care about how sister views you.... as long as her accusation get the knee jerk reaction she's used to getting from you.... as long as she's able to control your behavior bc you're afraid of being viewed as a cold, heartless, mean person you won't be able to make better choices without terrible guilt/shame and discomfort.  Time to have a come to Jesus with yourself.... I suggest journaling this all out till you've internalized it all and can discuss it with anyone without becomoning triggered by anything anyone says.  THAT is when you start valuing what you think more than what others think of you.  That is when you can make better choices with serenity.  It's not about punishing others, or being cruel.  It's about self care and modeling that for your son.  It's about having a life with reciprocal relationships that require you and your son have your needs met as well. I think my mindset now is it's done, I've said my bit and there's no point discussing it, it now needs to be down to me changing my behaviour and being more assertive, putting myself first and so on.  So I think I'm going to just leave it as it is and do nothing now.

I've also just been to see my friend whose daughter died a few years ago, it's the anniversary today and I just went to take some flowers to her grave and stood there while my friend sobbed in my arms.  She's still in so much pain and probably always will be, it made me think that life is too precious to waste it on people who don't appreciate you xxx  You're right, life is too short.  Now is the time to make the decisions you wouldn't normally make, IMO.  Now is the time to effect change for the better, bc you know better, Tupp.  Lighter

[Twoapenny]

Lighter, thank you again, I'm feeling fine with it now.  It's funny how you just get to that point where enough's enough.  I'm just leaving it where it is.  If she calls sometimes and wants to meet up for coffee or something that's fine, but I'm not doing any more running around or agony aunt duties and I'm not going to ring her to check she's okay with this (which I think is what she would be expecting).  The phone works in both directions and it's always me that rings so I'm getting on with life and she (and a few others) can do whatever it is they want to.  It feels a bit uncomfortable but I know it's right so I'm just sitting with it.  Thank you xx

[lighter]

Tupp:

You sit with it for a while, bc you don't want to fill that discomfort with familiar unhealthy things out of habit.

Once you decide what you won't continue doing, then it's time to decide what you'll replace those things with, which is just as difficult, IMO.

Coming up with new habits is difficult but can be done.

What becomes habits, becomes pleasure; )

Lighter