Relationship/s

[lighter]

M told you who he is, Hops.  I wouldn't hope further than that, for sure.

Lighter

[Hopalong]

Tupp, you're right about the two new males I've met. Quirk seems like someone who wouldn't toy with another person's heart or situation. Storyteller seems more flighty but is charming and creative. I have already been hearing from Quirk fairly regularly, nicely spaced (slow) contacts. He is feeling like a likely friend already. Storyteller doesn't get in touch and so far doesn't connect very consciously, so I'll enjoy him if I feel like it if he gets in touch again. I don't want to do pursuit though. (He may be dating around like mad, just gives off a restless vibe.)

Thanks, Lighter. Your grounding reminders are helpful.

Our meetup will be a good opportunity to internally reinforce my decision. (It's actually solid--I'm not doubting it.) But I'm looking forward to finding out if I/we can have cake (fun company now and then) and eat it too (without harm to either).

Hopefully it'll be a happy catchup of friends who can adjust together to the change.
Maybe, it'll be a small-flags reminder of a wise choice made or even a recognition of necessity for a permanent end to contact. (I'm curious as to whether he's continuing T.)
 
IF simple friendship with occasional meets works for us both, cool.
If it's not feeling like that's possible for me for any reason, I'll back away again. Although we've both offered to help the other in an emergency in future, "being friends" beyond that is open to individual interpretation. Will be curious what M's notion of that is. Mine is: nothing ritual or assumed about the other's time or attention, occasional invites, whatever. Perhaps some "podding" during winter if that feels mellow (a movie, escaping to each other's homes during housecleaning). But NOT, if it doesn't. I'm continuing to seek out new companionship regardless.

For me this meet isn't a "oh whew, now we resume with a few minor modifications" but a chance to talk over things and be honest about what we each are capable of, and not, and whether we each want to "try" committed friendship. He will likely be on autopilot, so relieved that he's not thinking. Remember when he wrote, "Don't be so serious"? That suggests to me it'd be quite difficult to get him to focus on making our communication go well or be more meaningful than me listening to his woes for two hours. But that won't halt my own focus (self-care and growth). Getting into his work is his choice, not mine. M ain't my project. I am my project!

hugs
Hops

[Hopalong]

Spent two hours today yakking with Quirk in his weedy back yard; had fun talking with him as always. Can't imagine romantic feelings for him but I'm really valuing his friendship. He's kind and eccentric and his house looks neglected and woebegone. Could be his widowhood or how he actually interacts with his surroundings. He's so passionate about each green thing he said, "I love weeds."

I am fetching him in a couple weeks to come here for a patio sit, and am very happy to have him as a friend. He's clearly sooo isolated that he's pleased about it too.

Not a peep from Storyteller for over a week since we met (I had decided that since I'd reached out more than he did I'd hold my water and wait). I wrote him a very kind, simple message saying how much I'd enjoyed it and realizing it was a one-time thing I'm still delighted we met. And thanks and all good things to him, etc. Felt good. It is just a "conscious behavior practice" for me, because I find ghosting or silence hurtful, so regardless of what anybody else chooses to do, that's not what I do. I'm pleased with what I said and do wish him well. No grief.

All is well in Hops land. I am not alone in this universe. Close poet friend came as usual and we had a lovely visit, talking about joy in color and her paint-my-rooms fantasies. Peaceful and fun on the patio during a GLORIOUSLY beautiful afternoon.

hugs
Hops

[Twoapenny]

Quirky sounds nice, Hops, and male company sans concerns re marriage/relationship/house etc could be a really nice way to pass the upcoming lockdown winter.

I'm slightly disappointed to read that ghosting occurs at any age!  Kind of think it's the thing people should grow out of by the time they're about 19.  Good that you took the initiative to draw a line on it.  A date of any kind needs some sort of close, I feel, it's just polite to say "it was nice to meet you" if nothing else.  I'm glad all is well in the land of Hops xx

[Hopalong]

Well, M and I had our promised "early October catch up" meet.

It was a relaxed and so pleasant several hours. We'd really
missed each other. Same kinda thing--he talked about himself
for a solid 30 minutes+ before he caught it and asked
me, what about you? (He had a looooong list of what he'd
accomplished, academically. But nothing about self-
exploration or insight, which I didn't really expect.)
That said, I have so much affection for him (and vice
versa) that it was very poignant to hug him again.

He kept saying, I'm FINE! I'm GREAT! etc. So I said,
wow, I was really grieving. Just being moi. Toward the
end he hinted a little bit more that the breakup was hard.

I think he still holds a half-lit torch but he seems to have
accepted that there's no guarantee. Lord knows how well
he's understood my decision...at one point (without anger)
he used "unconscionable" as one adjective for me blindsiding
him at a therapy appt with my decision. I said, you know why
I did that with our T? He had no idea. I said, it was the only way
I thought I could tell you without being interrupted. "Oh" he said.

Anyway it was GREAT to see him. And when I mentioned I
knew I didn't want daily emails and calls, he said "You contact
me" and I said okay. At one point when I was describing meeting
friends he said, oh thought you meant you were "back on the internet"
and I said "no comment" and he realized I might be dating again. So
that may cool his ardor. I don't know.

Anyway, it was great to see him, bottom line. He is who he is.

I was tense before meeting him but as usual we drank a lot of
wine so I really did enjoy him. Shame it takes mild inebriation
to relax around him. There were some great dogs at the winery.

hugs
Hops

[Twoapenny]

I'm glad it went well, Hops, and it will be nice if you can add someone else to your safe pod to get through the winter - a couple of hours here and there to catch up, without pressure or drama, will be good, I think.  I'm glad you had a good time xx

[sKePTiKal]

So.... a little closure to that episode Hops? Permission to move on and live your life, finishing grieving at your own pace? Until you're ready to take another chance?

[Hopalong]

Thanks, Tupp. I hope it might be, but I am not sure about the "safe" part. He looks at me as the one that got away; I look at him as the one I got away from. Yet for me there's still pain around the loss of him and the dream of having a loving partner. I'll have to sit with things a while more before I really know.

He was so not-tuned-in to anything much deeper about himself or how things went, far as I could tell. I didn't ask, but hope he's still talking to a T. I think he's avoiding pain by not going there, but he's also blocking intimacy. He can whirr on the surface indefinitely and that's depressing for me. (Then again, I might be a drag with my predeliction for probing my own and others' innards.)

Amber, you're right. I am still grieving some over M. Last night it was hard to wind down and I felt both sorrow and some anxiety. So I think doing nothing is the right thing. (I am finding nobody on the online site so have a feeling I'll be alone a lot longer.) I worry a little that I'll start missing him even more, slippery slope, etc. Who knows. He's pretty special (just ask him! LOL) and it might be that he'd open up more in time. Maybe I'll wait a month and invite him over to sit around the fire pit. Or maybe I won't.

I need to take it gently or gently set it down. It'll help to talk to my T Wednesday.

hugs
Hops

[Twoapenny]

I get what you're saying, Hops, I meant safe as in 'virus safe' (as you said M was taking precautions and being very careful).  Were you thinking about a relationship with him again?  I'm not sure if I got the wrong end of the stick as I thought it was a 'company only' situation but does he think you're getting back together?  It was from you saying he looked at you like the one that got away.  I might have got this all muddled lol, I'm listening to too many podcasts and confusing myself with things xx

[Hopalong]

No, you're not muddled, Tupp! It's just a bit of a muddling situation, to try to forge a non-romantic friendship when our plans were once so big and the feelings so intense. The idea of being friends is both enticing and comforting, and also painful. Because my guess is time with him as "just friends" would amount to more of him absorbing my care and listening, and me staring at the loss of my dream of a fully shared life while knowing he can't really connect with me on a deeper level.

As the virus alone, he'd be a great "pod partner." (He was not only masked but GLOVED at the winery! I persuaded him that hand sanitizer was a reasonable substitute.) I just don't know yet how it would affect me to keep hanging out with him. I'll have to sit with this for a while, and talk to my T, to sort out how emotionally risky it is.

hugs
Hops

[Twoapenny]

Okay, I get it now, I wasn't sure if I was getting my wires crossed.  Yes, I understand.  I had a 'one that got away' years ago.  We stayed friends, I still adored him and hoped we'd get back together but I found it very difficult not to keep thinking about how it might have been and the fact that he didn't feel the same.  It's tough and I do think the current Covid thing makes it tougher - it's just harder when you can't get out and about to take your mind off things (or meet new people more easily).  At least you know yourself you can hold back, think about it, talk it through with the T (and here!) and not put yourself in harm's way xx

[sKePTiKal]

Hops, I think your awareness of a past tendency to slip back into relationship with anyone; with M, when it's not going to be any different, is proof to yourself - that this isn't likely anymore. Some people just don't WANT to change, and all we can do is wish them well and take care of ourselves by giving explicit permission to feel love again... under different circumstances.

You could even put in your profile, that you're looking for a high level of giving/receiving of care for each other, without it sounding like too high a bar. (You'd probably find better words than that, and I'll support it!)

[Hopalong]

I like that, ((((Amber))).

Somehow wording something about this in a dating profile.
I will ponder! Thanks.

hugs
Hops

[Hopalong]

....tendency to slip back into relationship with anyone; with M, when it's not going to be any different, is proof to yourself - that this isn't likely anymore

PS Not entirely sure whether this is defensive or accurate, but I don't think the first part, slipping back into "relationship with anyone" is quite true. I've never been that desperate and have broken up with several people without second thoughts.

I think you're RIGHT that this one isn't likely any more. It's just a bit more difficult to let go of M entirely because he did make his way into my heart (despite all my complaints here). And THAT said, I'm calm again. Passed the test of an initial exploratory meet. I may try another outdoor meet (say, by my new fire pit) in a month. Just to see if it's more comfortable (the aftermath) after that one.

Meanwhile, still checking dating online and doing due diligence there.

Very much looking forward to my T appt on Wednesday. I wonder if I'll wind up still her client in my 90s. Fine with me!

hugs
Hops

[Hopalong]

Predictably, I'm struggling again a little. Not too much for sanity, just....

Visited M to return something and then once again because I was in the neighborhood (and because he'd injured his knee).

We had squabbled over email once, as I was as usual drilling into feelings and he was as usual saying "Don't wanna!". Before I left he'd called me "too introspective" (which I don't regret) and also "too self absorbed" -- which stung because I think it's true.

Anyway, came home feeling really sad and realizing that I do miss his company and also that nothing has changed. So although I still have a little hope for friendship, I'm not sure it'll work out.

I don't have to know a final outcome this minute. But it's just painful. For him too I'm sure, although he won't acknowledge anything.

I was thinking his love of talking is really limited to a few subjects: himself, academics, history and sometimes politics. He really does NOT want to explore the self (feelings, history, layers). And I can't help it, but I do.

I want a real and not-shallow connection with a loving partner. He wants to avoid all exploration of the heart (and I get it, because that's scary and painful).

Anyway, just a discouraging episode in the attempt to make a friendship.

I know y'all will counsel me to let him leave my life entirely. I'm just not completely ready to, or just finding it a struggle with isolation and pandemic and more months alone in this building....

But I do know that's the likely outcome.

In the good-news department, I'm not giving up, still open to dating (though pickings are SLIM online, maybe also because of the pandemic), and not withdrawing from anything social. Still maintaining outdoor visits with friends old and new while I can. So it'll be okay and we'll all crawl through it.

hugs
Hops