Voicelessness and Emotional Survival > Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board
Friendship Moments: good or bad
lighter:
Hi, Hops:
I wanted to put my thoughts, about your messages to Poet, here.... they're just my gut feelings. Not right, or on target, mind you.
You extended your little monkey paw, for connection and healing....bc you're whole enough and healed enough to do so.
The Poet sniffed your paw, and whatever is ticking and tocking within her ....shame, mostly, I think .....turned her away, and bragged about herself instead.
You see it. We see it. She can't see it. She can't see the peace, healing and serenity beyond available through accepting responsibility for her actions and connecting with you to figure it out.
It feels like she holds some higher ground, in her mind. As though must be right, so you must be wrong, the apologizer, the one letting her off hooks, to stomp boundaries and be the only one with feelings she cares about.....and that might be true. Might not.
I used to wonder about people who believe taking any responsibility will destroy them....how terrible it must be to live under that heavy wall, unable to accept a piece of their shame, bc there's years and years and years of it, piled on, ready to crush them, should they let their guard down.
It's a lot, but I also believe they, on some level, might understand it won't actually kill them. Some part of them would rather keep working to hold up the wall, rather than stand naked and vulnerable,in the messy rubble, falling all around them.
Those darn coping strategies
::shaking head::.
And you wouldn't shove her nose in it...shame her....proclaim a win. You'd listen and support.....I know you would.
Maybe she knows too, on some level, and that scenario so misaligns with her self image, as you've described, she can't reconcile...
can't believe peaceful juice is worth the squeeze.
And the squeeze, for those unfamiliar with surrendering.....those unfamiliar and fearful of what comes next....find holding up the wall less stressful, maybe. So they hold, refuse their monkey paw and live in the emotional turmoil they've created....piling it higher....more overwhelming.
After family visit, we joke about interactions feeling like monkeys tending to each other, being alarmed together or at odds...so sorry for the references.....but they seem to fit, imo. Insert little monkey ooo ooooos, and you have the full picture.
Your Poet doesn't have the ability to honestly self reflect.....at least, not yet, and that's ok. You're still ok. You're considering responses, reaching out, willing to gently connect. That's a gift Poet might not be able the receive.
Is it co-dependent when we need something, from someone, who just can't give it? Is it co-dependent to miss the signs, this will never happen.....miss the important exit for acceptance? To change paths ...maybe not give up, but travel a parallel paths, rather than the same path? Just....honor oneself more.....and see if dynamics change.
I do want you to know, there's no shame in how you're feeling. Labeling yourself "needy" hurt me, to read it.
You're human, have old wounds and what feels like a huge loss will ping and echo down childhood corridors, of course it will.
The word codependent-ish pops up....as it does for myself recently, and I think it's OK if we're authentic.....speak our truth and gently state boundaries.....hold them......back ourselves up, rather than betray ourselves, kwim?
I feel you were all of the above. The ball is in Poet's court. She'll rise and engage, respectfully, or she'll bounce back into your life, sans any insights......and forge on, expecting you to play the role her image has prescribed you.
I've done it, but there have to be limits......one must stop sacrificing to the point of betraying self, IME.
Truthfully, the Poet is the needy one....she neeeeeeeds you to play your supporting role in her.....
her......
manufactured self image? The part she plays isn't an authentic whole being, aware and self reflecting, imo.
I'll stop at the point I'm guessing what age she might be operating at, bc truthfully, I have no idea about any of it. Just expressing how it's feeling, to me, based on my experiences.
You have options.....how do you feel about them today, ((Hops?))
Lighter
Hopalong:
I'm feeling SO much better the last couple days, and it was the first time I realized her chilly-shoulder response actually helped me step back more, a safer distance behind my own boundary.
I can't swear cause and effect, but I slept well two nights running and had unexpected energy during the day that I used to tidy up a lot. I also walked a bit and met friends. Suddenly out of my cave and hungry for simple peace and simple pleasure.
Could be there is a connection to releasing my grief-scraps over Poet and just watching her sail her own boat. Now I feel zero inclination to try to persuade or help her navigate, and all my anger, feeble as it was, has dissipated. I even feel liberated from a weight I hadn't realized I was carrying, and that was too heavy to keep lugging around. I'll see her in the monthly poetry workshop and that's fine. I always respond with authentic feedback (we each do) which she's seemed to appreciate, and I won't be sulking. She'll look for purpose in her poetry-publicity efforts and I'm glad for her. Anything's better than the dark, sodden despair she's often been stuck in. I can hold compassion and space for her, but from a less co-D perspective I hope.
Your thoughtful, realistic-but-positive analyses have really helped too. Thank you so much. Particularly, every time you talked about seeing shame in her, I recognized it even more and see the truth of it. It's so sad to see someone so unhappy when you know there are ways through. But only we can clear our own paths. Everybody's personal jungle is different. I can only wish her well. Thank you.
hugs,
Hops
lighter:
I was thinking ......
the concept of limiting exposure, to certain people,in order to maximize joy, and limit chaos, is a valid one.
The Poet's chaos is within herself, imo.
She carries it within her ...... it's perhaps rubbing up against your stuff, but it's still hers to own,and feel responsible for, imo.
I'm curious.....as you moved through the Poet's visit.....did you auto-assume or feel responsible for her dysregulation....
OR
was Poet blaming you, sans your buy in?
The blame only works IF we buy into it, at least a little, on some level, IME.
If we're clear on the facts..... there's no pain/confusion/shame/feeling we can/should fix something, during the chaos, IME.
It's nice to read you've created emotional distance. That's where perspective and choice come into focus, IME.🪷
Lighter
Hopalong:
She was blaming me for something that did not happen (me being a "bad host") w/o my buy in. On the other hand, no state of mind (even blamelessness) is 100% pure, so she tried to poke me in my own shame store. (Vulnerability about the house.)
But it didn't go deep. Her verbal attack was so unfair, irrational and just plain MEAN that I felt shielded by my own refusal to buy in. Still do.
Off to visit pre-conception friend with the recovering dog we both adore, and friend and I will sit outside and watch them run each other ragged. Peaceful evening coming up!
Pup got into a nest of baby bunnies (rabbit mama didn't learn the lesson last year and made it in the same crowded perennial bed) again, and their helplessness made me sad and upset. Chased Pup off the patio and gated him out, hoping Mama bunny will get back to them. But the nights are chilly now.
He really is a terrier. Sigh.
I'm bingeing Band of Brothers as my Memorial Day contemplation. Had never seen it and think it was so well done.
hugs
Hops
Hopalong:
So...you prescient ones. How do you read this? She wrote that her partner (the jerk) is away for three weeks, and it's triggered everything about abandonment. I realize it's hard for her. But I really could use your perspective on how this lands:
Hope all's well with you and [Pup]. You have him, the sweetie!
I'm just hoping I don't get too depressed but I feel it coming on unless I pull myself out of it. It'll be a test of my ability to handle life alone in the house. That little abandoned child without friends or people around her. ..The monster of the empty sky, the silence. And my friendship with you, not feeling the same either.
Hell or death is being cut off emotionally or physically from all.
I tried to respond kindly but without too much detail, "you're sitting with some very tough feelings," kind of thing. Then suggested a small sweet older dog might be a warm companion. That was about it, but as you've pointed out, it's a pattern, and I'd like to stabilize my part of it. Or be sure I'm going in the right direction.
I think I am. Just looking for support I think.
I had a lovely time today at a picnic with lots of good folks I haven't seen in a while.
hugs
Hops
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