A friend of mine past away this weekend. Hurt to think

[bkkabri]

I am posting because its been three months and I still feel the effects from my experience with my ex N.  A good high school friend of mine died from a heart attact this weekend at the age of 35.  He has two daughters and a wife.  Losing my dad makes me realize the pain those girls are going to feel knowing they wont be able to share a life with their dad.  I am glad they have a supportive family to help them thru this.  The problem I am having is that my ex N told me that I should get over my dad dying because it was seven years ago and she wants to talk about diseases at night that affect her patients.  She basically condemned me for making the request to tone down our conversations about people dying because I am not a medical professional and sometimes talking about death strikes a cord inside to open old wounds.  Instead of being an understanding person from the medical profession, she told me she doesnt care about her patients personal stories.  She is there to diagnose the disease.  I wish I understood her behavior, I didnt tell her to throw it in my face or make me feel bad.  I told her because I wanted her to know that sometimes I need a break from the detail of somebody having their legs cut off.  I feel like she thinks I was a weak person for having feelings for the loss of my dad to AIDS.  I hope these young woman find a person in their life to support their down times like the holidays because when you lose a parent-it hurts like hell forever.  You move on, but you know thinking about it will make you feel sad.  My ex talking about people being sick all the time made me feel sad.  I dont understand why making that request was a problem.  I miss the person(fascade) I met.  I guess I dont understand why she wanted me at all.  Thanks for letting me vent.  I have this funeral tonight and I know its going to open wounds and feelings that I know these poor girls are going to know.

[mum]

bkkabri:  
  I am so sorry for your loss (both).  I agree, it is so hard to lose a parent even as an adult, and most adults I know (and me) see dying while our children are young, as certainly one pain we never want for our children.
It is perfectly understandable to me why this brought up your own pain.  It's called empathy.  Most people feel it.

As far as understanding your ex....the "N" sums it up.  You did say EX did you not? That is another operative letter (grouping).  Do you HAVE to deal with her (as in children shared?)  I maintain civility with my ex for that reason, but we NEVER converse about anything other than what must be discussed logistically for the kids.  If I did not have children with my ex, he could fall off the face of the earth and I wouldn't know or care.
 
It sounds like you are doing what sane people do when they feel sad...feeling it. Your ex is (dare I say it?) a bitch.  Um, once again, she is your EX, right?  Seems like there is a good reason for that.
Go ahead and feel. And consider whether conversations with her are worth your time.

[bkkabri]

thanks mum, she is a bitch.  The problem I have is that she has really taken my self esteem away.  I tried so hard to be a good man to her, and in the beginning she made me feel like I could do no wrong.  Then she slowly drifted away with being cruel and avoiding me.  I am hurting inside because she made me feel ashamed to mourn the loss of my dad to a disease like AIDS.  I cant help how he died.  I only asked her to respect the fact that I didnt want to talk about deadly diseases in the evening after working all day.  I wanted to share my life with her, and think about a future.  I feel so bad for these girls.  I know this is going to kill them inside for years to come.  My ex told me she didnt want kids because she was selfish with her time and wanted to do things for her.  I guess that was the red flag I should have watched out for because looking back, this girl never was very affectionate.  I remember one time I was Santa Claus for a group of 15 kids and they loved it.  It was a great day.  I look back now because I realize that she didnt come because she was finishing up work at home.  Now all I think about is how she could care less that I was trying to bring in the Christmas spirit for these families and for us.  She wouldnt even give me a family.  To make things worst, on Christmas morning she bought me pornos because she said I like sex.  It was the most heart wrenching feeling  knowing that an intelligent woman would go to a sex store, buy these videos, wrap them up and put them under the tree thinking that this is what I would like as a gift.  Like I said, she has screwed up my self esteem pretty bad.  I dont feel like I can talk anymore to women because I feel like they will rip me apart because I said hello inside of hi.  I am on egg shells.  I wish I could find me again.  I miss the old me.  I thought I had a lot to offer.  She makes me feel like I am weak person for having feelings.

[mum]

Oh, Boy.  What an ordeal.  You just married/got involved with the wrong person, that's all. To me it looks fairly simple (though the effects are complicated, I know).  You seem like a nice guy.  (and yes, nice guys do get girls).  She seemed like a nice person.  She was not.
     Honestly, you sound like my fiance.  The nicest guy on the planet.  He also had attracted women who did not turn out to be what they "presented" to him.  Not honest.  He is.  He deserves honesty... and in that way, you seem alike.
     Here is a (hopefully hopeful) story.  Twenty four years ago, this nice man and I were engaged to be married.  Because of my own poor self image (realized that much later), I left him (far too nice, not enough "sparks", he was Jewish, I was Catholic....and a hundred other lame reasons). I dumped him horribly, moved 2000 miles away. Made a consious effort to forget him (never quite managed as my recurring dreams for a good 15 years were of him, not acknowledging me..... we don't need Freud for that one).
 I married a selfish, abusive baby/bully.  Had two kids with him.  He treated me horribly.  I divorced him, married another, less overtly abusive, but nonetheless Narcissistic man. Evidence and semi-horror stories of both men's "labels" could fill a book, but that's not the point of this abreviated life tale.  I woke up....divorced wrong man #2 and set out to take care of myself, find out what was driving my choices...lots of work and well worth it.
      A few years ago, I was "reintroduced" to this nice man.  Thinking he would never have forgiven me, I was reluctant.  But for him, there was nothing to forgive.  I simply had to take that path away from him.  He was and is, not only "nice" to others (sometimes to a fault of believing in someone's goodness even if it is not real evident....we share that trait at times) but secure enough in himself to allow people he loves to be where they are and to do what they need to do...  Not at all a control freak....(funny how I married two of them).
He had married and become a father, divorced, got into another not so great relationship, etc.  Long story short, we are "together" again.  Even though we are not living on the same coast (my first ex has prevented me from moving back home with my kids so far), we couldn't ever see ourselves with any other partners.  
       I now, finally, truly love myself enough to see in me what he always saw.  My life has come full circle.  If he and I are not evidence of miracles and reasons to keep faith, I'm not sure what is.
       Now, how could this tale apply to you?
      If you are a kind, feeling, sensitive man, as you appear to be, please do not feel this is a fault.   You may have to wait a while to find a sensitive, caring woman who is secure enough about herself, who loves herself enough to accept such genuine love from another.  That's all.  Give yourself a break.  I know it looks like women are looking for the "dangerous" guys.....a lot of them are, I know I was.  But I was a self hating mess, looking for someone(s) to validate my self hatred (it's not like I knew it at the time, mind you).
      The world needs kind, sensitive men.  So you wear your heart on your sleeve?  So you are offended by porn (ug, what a horrible Christmas!)....?  So what?  Be who you are.  You sound awesome to me!
    And perhaps after you process your pain over your losses, you could truly divorce your ex, as in emotionally.  Really, what kind of cold heart do you have to have to: A) tell anyone how they should feel about thier father dying and B) have anything at all to say about HOW someone died? (Is homophobia another one of her endearing traits?)
    See, sometimes anger is ok.....it's telling us something.  Staying angry or making a habit out of us just makes life suck.
Your feelings around her certainly tell you something.  Dump her again and again in your head and heart.  Best to you.

[bunny]

I'm very sorry to hear about your friend. It is tragic.

bunny

[bkkabri]

thanks mum.  I have to be honest, I am not really considered "nice" by people.  I am a genuine guy who shared a moment because she was opening the wound with her talk of medicine and people's disease.  It just became too much because I didnt want to relive the past.  Seeing someone you care about rot from AIDS is unbelievable.  I have no medical training and the hell I went through is nothing compared to my dad.  My problem is that I did show that I had a heart and that I do care for people.  I trully thought being a medical professional she could understand my loss and relate to the fact that this is not a normal situation.  Unfortunately, she admitted in the end that she doesnt date guys like me because I was the only guy who made her feel she could let her hair down.  Now she is with guys who she feels superior to and doesnt feel threatened.  One of our biggest problems was she always thought I was interested in other women.  I could never do anything to make her see that I was there for her.  She actually bought me the porn to be cruel.  On valentines day she went off on me because I mentioned the Surreal Life on VH1.  She told me that she wanted the night to be about her and no other women.  She was mad about the bay watch woman on the program.  I never said anything about her.  Its like she just freaked out.  When she left me she was so cruel telling me that I dont make enough money for her, that I should be over my dad dying, telling me that her family knows I am envious of them, and that she didnt like me helping her with her finances because I knew too much about her.  She actually had the nerve to yell at me about a bruise on her leg from last year because I questioned what happened.  It looked like it hurt.  Like I said, I miss the fascade.  I wish I understood how this could happen.  How could you love me and say and do the most wonderful things and then just freak out on me for a year?  I am truly messed up by this.  I wish she cared.  I know she doesnt, and that is what hurts.  She wont even acknowledge the things she did.

[mum]

Hi, Again.  Since you found your way to this board, maybe in the same manner I did, do you think she has NPD?  If so, perhaps finding out more about it may help you.  When I made first made that connection about my ex, I could've sworn, everything ever written about NPD was his life history!
     If she is a narcissist, trying to figure out why she would do anything may prove futile.  Possibilities: She did it because she is a train wreck you can't save.  She did it because life is always about her and she will manipulate others to get her point across/voice heard.  She did it because she was not capable of loving you as you deserved to be loved.  
     You may get sick of feeling like this, and for your sake I hope it's sooner than later, but when you do....and whatever you find out....it will all come down to your choice.  Your life is utimately your choice.  You will move through this.  It can be done.  At some point you will be able to focus on what you want to feel, instead of what you don't.  That was a turning point for me, but I had to get through a lot of stuff first (oh, and then I have to still get through it again and again, but now I know I can).
 Learn and then let it go....it can be done.
I still think you are a nice guy.

[mum]

Just another simple thought.  You can always hang up the phone/walk away.

[Anonymous]

hello Brian, like Bunny, I am sad to hear about your friend.

Are you also a friend to his family? I hope so. Maybe they need his friends to help them now?

Tragic things happen to people for no reason, it is sad. Take care, portia

[bkkaBRI]

I broke the rule and tried to contact her.  She wont respond.  I guess what I dont understand is why she wanted me so bad in the first place.  Why make our relationship so story book and then dump on it as soon as you get a promotion.  I supported her fully and all I get from the experience is that I will divorse her because she is on call two weeks a year and I wont go to pharmecutical parties because I wont understand and be bored.  How can a sales party be more important than being home with people you care about and care about you.  I am regular guy with dreams of owning my own company.  It started out slow, but I have a good job that pays the bills and she tells me she wants a man who makes at least as much as her.  I make more, but how is that a criteria after two years.  Her only excuse for getting weird is that she says she is insecure and that she doesnt want me because I am the only guy who let her feel she could let her hair down.  She makes me feel ashamed to miss my dad telling me to get over it.  I mentioned it one time in two years because her graghic talk of disease was bringing me down.  Why cant you tell me any stories about your day with the staff and stories of patients that were amusing once in a while.  I miss the fascade, it unbeleivable that person doesnt exist.

[Anonymous]

ah Brian. I'm really sad that you stopped the stand up comedy (it was stand up wasn't it?). Were you good?

How's your friend's family, how was the funeral? A tough time for them hey. Portia

[mum]

Hey, Brian.
I have a good friend who is currently divorcing her husband.  He has been having sex with men for years and years, and then lying to her about it.
She has been devastated, emotionally (they have grown children) and he continues to lie and want her to feel so sorry for him, blah blah bla (I've no of tolerance for this type of man...not the gay thing, but the lying, berating thier partner as a smokescreen and then the "feel sorry for me" thing!)

Anyway, she still struggles with wanting what they "had", even though she knows it was all a lie/"facade".  I don't think she is crazy or you are crazy.  It is hard to let go.  She knows it was a delusion (most of it) but it is what she told herself to believe that is so hard to release.  
She has some good friends who are helping her find a better view of herself, as he damaged it pretty extensively.  She admitted to me that she wasn't sure she could ever find anything better.  She is coming to see that this kind of thinking is not her true self talking...instead it is the remnants of abusive brainwashing.

Once again, Brian.  You are a good person. Accept and work with that as your bottom line.  Find out what you want....not just what you don't (it may take time) and you will break free of her.  She has told you she wants out rather crassly, but there it is.  Cut the dead weight off.  You don't need it, no one does.  Hurt does not equal love....ever.
Attachment equals suffering.  Mull that over and see if it isn't true.

It's ok to focus on yourself, it doesn't make you selfish (like her)... but your life needs to be about YOU.  My friend constantly talks about HIM, wanting him to hurt, wanting him to change, have remorse, whatever.  When she starts to focus on herself, that is when the light goes on, and she sees happiness as possible.  Try it.  Best to you.

[Anonymous]

Brain,
Very sorry to hear of your friend's untimely death. Tough as it must be for you, I can only imagine how his wife and kids are doing. Here is an opportunity for you to turn a negative into a positive and help yourself at the same time. When you get caught up in obsessing about your ex-N, why not send the family a card, give the wife a call, see if the kids need anything? Having experienced the untimely death of my 25-year-old brother 7 years ago, I cannot tell you how much expressions of care and concern mean at a time like this.

Best,

bludie

[bludie]

Ooops - I meant Brian, not brain. Sorry!  

[Anonymous]

ROTFLOL!

Hmmm~  I can see where such Freudian slip might fit though.