Author Topic: Comments non-N's say  (Read 7721 times)

OR

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Comments non-N's say
« on: April 16, 2005, 12:39:00 AM »
Hi to all,

Not dealing with the emotional rollercoaster for just over 1 month has been such a relief.

I don't want to sound insecure when my H comes out with his crazy lies.
I feel that if I had a better response. than repeating what the N is saying to me, I would not be questioned about my lack of confidence.

I just wanted to know if this is a common reaction when you repeat what the N says.

MY PROBLEM: I repeat what the N says and people will say:

"Why do you listen to him"?,
 "You know he lies"
You need to stand up to him, don't let him intimidate you.
You don't believe him.?
"If you believe that one"
Don't worry he is only saying that to scare you.

Does anyone else get this when you reapeat what someone says?
or is it just with the N's. I have been so sheltered.

Do you feel like when you say what an N will tell you, that somehow it's a refelction on you?
Or do you really believe that other's just don't understand all the crap that is behind the N's way of thinking. That maybe you should be worried.

What do you think?

OR

vunil as guest

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2005, 05:59:28 AM »
I just think it's easier for people outside the situation to see when the N is being ridiculous!  That's why I like this board-- I can repeat something an N in my life said, and get back a lot of disbelief and "wow, that is amazing" and "don't let it bother you" and etc.


Also, folks do reflect back what you already think-- they take cues to do that.  So, it also means you are moving away from him in your mind!  That is great news, too.

All in all it seems ok-- I don't think they are diminishing your pain, they are just reflecting back what's going on.  And he DOES lie, for sure.

As for the involvement you feel with him that they don't feel, that's normal, and is something for you to work for (not feeling so involved).  It's pretty tough, I know.

hang in there :)

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2005, 10:26:59 AM »
Hi OR

The big thing is the nonverbal part of what the non-Ns are saying to you.

One person can say "why do you even bother with him?" and they are looking into your eyes and have a genuinely concerned expression.

Another person can say the same thing, and they are half turned away from you looking at ANYTHING else they can find to look at, with a sneering expression around the nose and mouth.

Only the concerned ones are worth your time. They may be unable to give you a lot of their time, because of other obligations, but what they can spare will be worthwhile. The others - well. They just don't give a rat's patoot, or they enjoy feeling superior to people in trouble. And they certainly won't be a very present help.

Not all Ns are obviously mean, and not all meanies are obviously N. It can be very confusing......

One thing that does inflame me, and I'll try to keep that off to the side enough, is when people encourage you to stand up for yourself. A lot of the time, what you need is others standing behind you, either directly (as in an office bully situation) or emotionally. A lot of the time, the people who are encouraging you to "stand up to" someone are really stirring the pot, and instigating, and they get some kind of entertainment from watching other people fight. Watch out for these clowns, they are incredibly destructive, and most people don't recognize them.

(((((OR)))))

longtire

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2005, 11:05:43 AM »
(((((OR)))))

I think that people who haven't been through a similar situation cannot understand how hard it is to detach from someone who acts this way.  I think they *believe* that they would simply walk away with no connection and go right on with their lives.  Some of them are probably right.  I suspect that more of them would have the same issues and difficulty many of us here do, they just haven't been placed in that situation yet.  From the comments you listed, I could believe that most people are genuinely trying to help, they just can't really comprehend people acting like this and the damage it causes.

As for a better response?  I believe that most people you encounter are more interested in what OR has to say.  I know I am, though I do enjoy the dark humor of comments on "The Most N Thing Ever Said" thread. :evil: You might slip in some of his comments and check other people's responses.  If they understand, you can open up more in this area.  If they give some flip response like below, then they probably will not be able to understand.  You can choose how much to share with each person based on their experience and response.  I still favor hearing OR's opinion, though. :)
longtire

- The only thing that was ever really wrong with me was that I used to think there was something wrong with *me*.  :)

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2005, 11:17:51 AM »
OR:

Good Morning:

Ah, the residual effects of living with an N for so many years.  If you stop and think about it N's kept us in line with us questioning our reality or the realness of any given situation.  I think after a while you begin to internalize the fact that the mirror image N's give off is not a mirage but a fact.  

When you finally dispose of the N and live life on a day to day basis, I think OR it is only going to be natural that you question yourself and the conversations.  I'm with the others here, only deal with people who are actually concerned about you.  It is easy enough for everyone else to say "Oh just ignore him" or "You know that this is just a conversation you are repeating that  you heard from him".  Deprogramming  yourself is not going to happen overnight from those internalized tapes and conversations.  

I was able to get past it somewhat by just dealing with the here and now.  Is this real or isn't it?   Limiting my email time and lack of opportunity time with N also helped.  It just happens gradually over time the reality you are now living replaces the internalized brainwashing that has occurred.  

You are doing a marvelous job of starting over.  Just give yourself the leeway necessary to keep on keeping on.  Limit the "opportunities" of the N as much as you can.  You will not be able to completely get rid of him because of your D, but you can minimize his opportunities with you.  

Much love,
Patz

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2005, 11:27:39 AM »
OR:

Read your post from the other thread on the divorce papers.  My thougts and prayers are with you.  Please keep us all posted on how things are going.  

Love again,
Patz

bunny

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2005, 11:52:20 AM »
hi OR,

How do you know the people who said this to you aren't N's?  :D

My suggestion is choose your audience with discernment. Some people are more "with it" than others. I wouldn't share personal stuff with people who are ignorant. They'll just add to the problem. I'm glad you have this group who understands.

Good luck with the divorce. I'm glad you'll be free of that loser.

bunny

vunil as guest

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2005, 01:55:48 PM »
Oh, thought of something else that may or may not help you, OR--

When I started realizing that my family was pretty nutty, as had been my very-N exboyfriends (some of whom it took me years to get over), then I started talking about it with my friends.

In the course of that I realized that some of my friends either were themselves N or were fatally attracted to N's in a way that made them really blind!  They were either really dismissive, or worse encouraged me to "forgive" the N behavior and "get over it" and "realize everyone has problems."  Now, with some perspective, I am realizing why this is so:  I picked them because I could relate to them.  So of course I was around folks with my same blind spots and inability to really look things square in the face as I had had.

Sometimes growth is lonely :(  The good thing has been that every bit of emptiness left by my reducing time with those friends has been filled with new friendships or renewed friendships with people I had forgotten about or lost touch with (perhaps because they weren't feeding my need to ignore my issues).   And I made good use of the quiet space left by not having people tell me how to feel!  I figured out how I myself feel.

I have no idea if this applies to you, OR.  It's just another thing to keep in mind.  My new motto is to talk to and spend time with people who run their lives in a way that I admire and trust.

OR

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2005, 10:50:46 PM »
Thank you all for responding, I already feel better.

V,

 
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I just think it's easier for people outside the situation to see when the N is being ridiculous! That's why I like this board-- I can repeat something an N in my life said, and get back a lot of disbelief and "wow, that is amazing" and "don't let it bother you" and etc.


Quote
The big thing is the nonverbal part of what the non-Ns are saying to you


I think this is so true. I wish I could meet you all some day.
sometimes the simple looks  from those that don't truley understand, lacks the healing I get from the board.

I try and picture what each of you must look like, trying to picture a human by the words they use is difficult. I guess looks are not important just funny how your mind tries to picture love and kindness and what it looks like in the human face and  eyes.




Bunny, I am so spooked about an N, I see a good looking guy and I want to run the other way. I hear a comment that sounds N , I want to just get run so fast. I have learned alot about how to deal with them. Im learning about their  weak areas and how to go for what makes them feel insecure so they will run away. I will gain some power over this and use it in my upcoming Divorce. Some of the other threads have some great insite on dealing with the N's.


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How do you know the people who said this to you aren't N's?  


Im surrounded with N's in my family. I get this type of comments from my family and hearing it now from my Hs family. They are helping me but may not fully understand. They want me to be confident and I don't always come across as such.


Long:  I think this is a great answer. I will try and weave my comments in while making note, a very small note, what the N is saying. I like that.
This is something living with an N can eliminate from your life. Your my hero Long, thanks.
 
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As for a better response? I believe that most people you encounter are more interested in what OR has to say. I know I am, though I do enjoy the dark humor of comments on "The Most N Thing Ever Said" thread.  




Guest :I will take this in consideration, its a great point. My sister and his brother have both said this one several times. This one gets me sometimes, I feel like they look at me as insecure about myself.
I don't always feel like this about myself but when I hear it I start to think it.

I don't know sometimes how I feel but insecure is some one who could be mean because they are insecure. I'm not mean, not a bully, but always found myself sticking up for the underdog. Not afraid of the bully.

Quote
what you need is others standing behind you, either directly (as in an office bully situation) or emotionally. A lot of the time, the people who are encouraging you to "stand up to" someone are really stirring the pot, and instigating, and they get some kind of entertainment from watching other people fight. Watch out for these clowns, they are incredibly destructive, and most people don't recognize them.



My H just e-mailed me, I responded with "got your e-mail," and give me your attorneys name.
He is telling me to change my married name back to my maden name.
How he is a nice guy and everyone thinks so.

Im working on responding to the court papers. My SIL is helping me and she has a lawyer friend calling us back.  

Quote
I
Quote
was able to get past it somewhat by just dealing with the here and now. Is this real or isn't it? Limiting my email time and lack of opportunity time with N also helped. It just happens gradually over time the reality you are now living replaces the internalized brainwashing that has occurred


[/quote]

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2005, 11:20:03 PM »
Quote from: Anonymous
Hi OR

One thing that does inflame me, and I'll try to keep that off to the side enough, is when people encourage you to stand up for yourself. A lot of the time, what you need is others standing behind you, either directly (as in an office bully situation) or emotionally. A lot of the time, the people who are encouraging you to "stand up to" someone are really stirring the pot, and instigating, and they get some kind of entertainment from watching other people fight. Watch out for these clowns, they are incredibly destructive, and most people don't recognize them.

(((((OR)))))


Gee, I just realized this could be really confusing. I didn't mean that people on this board are troublemakers. I meant the kind of people who won't look you in the eye when you're talking about the N, the kind of people who keep a fight going at the office by carrying tales back and forth. They just like to watch other people fight, and they aren't really trying to help at all.

If someone HERE says 'stand up to him' they have a good reason, and they will stand behind you. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2005, 10:01:18 AM »
OR:

I still have this problem:

I see a good looking guy and I want to run the other way. I hear a comment that sounds N , I want to just get run so fast. I have learned alot about how to deal with them. Im learning about their weak areas and how to go for what makes them feel insecure so they will run away.

Somehow after 5 years I have not gotten past "editing" what people say to me.  Am I being paranoid or what?  Especially with men.  It can be even the non-verbal messages that they send.  This is the residual damage I still deal with after the N.  At what point in time does this become pathological in me?  I am sure everyone has N tendencies, it just having been burned so bad that I guess I am just hyper about it.

There is one particular gentlemen that goes to the same gym as I do.  Every time he comes in all the women just roll their eyes in disgust.  He is such an N.  The way he walks, talks, everything..........so it is just not me.  Sometimes I feel really damaged for future relationships because of my attitude toward this "editing" problem.  Am I crazy for feeling this way?   Patz

write

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I once had a work situation like this
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2005, 10:42:58 AM »
A lot of the time, what you need is others standing behind you, either directly (as in an office bully situation) or emotionally. A lot of the time, the people who are encouraging you to "stand up to" someone are really stirring the pot, and instigating, and they get some kind of entertainment from watching other people fight. Watch out for these clowns, they are incredibly destructive, and most people don't recognize them.


one of my friends commented 'they make the bullets then get you to fire them'!

It just came to my mind reading that.

That boss was a n or sociopath too.

OR

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2005, 10:47:25 PM »
Patz, :
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Sometimes I feel really damaged for future relationships because of my attitude toward this "editing" problem. Am I crazy for feeling this way? Patz


Am I going to go crazy for keeping the thoughts of protecting myself from merging with an N. God please send in angles to keep the N's far away.
If I do encounter them I think I would be like a deer in the head lights.


My friend just now e-mailed me this note as I was writing this message, I had just asked God to send in angles, this is the jest of the story:

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God didn't promise days without pain, laughter without sorrow,sun without rain, but He did promise strength for the day, comfort for the tears, and light for the way.
Read this line very slowly and let it sink in...
If God brings you to it, He will bring you through it.



After reading her message, I think for me it comes back to balance. My thoughts need to balance out the bad things in my life. It becomes such a challenge when the N has life so unbalanced.

Maybe as I grow away from the drama,  I will learn how to see the positive reasons behind my life for the past 26 years. I have gone through the marriage, now the fall out is about to hit me.

As I will no doubt encounter many N's, I do need to learn placing stronger boundries.
I will not have an Unbalanced N, be in charge of my bullet making.
to do this without taking the boundries (bullets)
to an unbalanced, unhealthy level, I could get a clean shot at making my point. I want to make a point, a very sharp point.

Wrtie:
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one of my friends commented 'they make the bullets then get you to fire them'!



I have been reading some of the web sites on Child custody.
It sounds like I need to be very careful  how I present the Idea of my H being an N. I could be looked at as being only bitter about my H and his behavior.
He must be reading this stuff himself. He keeps telling me no matter what I say, that Im bitter. I could tell him it's a beautiful day and he would come back with don't be so bitter.

Got to go it's late OR

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2005, 10:49:59 AM »
Hey OR and Patz,

You guys wrote,
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Bunny, I am so spooked about an N, I see a good looking guy and I want to run the other way.

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I see a good looking guy and I want to run the other way.


Not all of us Errol flynn types are Ns you know. :P  :?

OR,
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It sounds like I need to be very careful how I present the Idea of my H being an N.

I don't know family court but I do know court. If you sound credible and you have documentation of your positions you will be believed. Didn't you say you had a diagnosis the guy was NPD on your other thread?

Praying for you OR, and glad to hear you keeping the faith. :wink:  :D

mudpup

Anonymous

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Comments non-N's say
« Reply #14 on: April 18, 2005, 12:33:54 PM »
OR,

If your husband behaves in court the way he does most of the time, you won't have to say anything.

bunny