Rain in the desert, is that possible?

[vunil as guest]

From what I know of myself, I don't think i have clinical depression.

I just feel so lost and disconnected within myself. I don't really know who I am anymore. Does anyone ever feel this way?

Yes, when I was depressed (smile for the connection between the quotes, not for the idea of being depressed).

You can have situational depression that stems from something going on short-term without having clinical depression.  I think that the media give the wrong idea of how depression feels-- at least for me, it felt more like a disconnected fog than like sadness.  It wasn't active enough of a feeling to feel sad-- sadness would have taken way more energy than I had!  I honestly had no idea if I was really having serotonin problems until I got them fixed and felt so much better.  I think that's just how it works-- the lack of serotonin doesn't feel like a lack so much as a state of being.

Anyway, don't worry about us being patient-- of course we will be.  This won't all get fixed overnight for you.  But I agree with everyone that therapy is the first line of defense, followed by a discussion of (short-term) meds to get those fans a-blowin'.  And maybe a check-up with your doc-- things like anemia can make you feel this way, too.

Of course, it's up to you.  

Hang in there!  It will get better.

[Anonymous]

Desert Rain,

While I was never diagnosed with depression (and thus defer to our friends who unfortunately have first-hand experience with it), I do want to respond to your note:

I feel like a wandering lost soul. Happy...what does that mean?? I haven't been happy for so long, that I've forgotten what that word really means.

I know how you feel. I really do. I found, for me, that I built from the small things - that was the only way I could re-learn it. So, try to think of something you enjoy. Smaller than a vacation to Tahiti. Smaller than tickets to a concert. Smaller than a day at the beach.

For me, it was 'eating an ice cream cone."  or "watching my favorite cartoon". It seems silly - very very easy to achieve, right? you can flip on that tv right now. Or go to Baskin Robbins and stare at all those 31 flavors for 15 minutes, deciding between Rum raison and mint chip.  

and so i did. And i did it, concentrating on what I was doing... wandering around manhattan with a chocolate dipped cone, talking to ever dog I ran into.  It took - what - 30 minutes? but, that was all I did. no cell phones. no work. no internet message boards.   And I was happy for 30 minutes. not even happy - content.  

After a while, I realized I also love hugging dogs. and painting stuff. and baking stuff. and I slowly filled my day with more and more... I'm not there yet... but after my hour-long chat with my nMom, I am off to the gym (where I will read my fav book) and then to hug my favorite dog...

so, I guess if i could wish one thing for you today, it is that you experience that contentment for even a little bit of time. blow a bubble in your gum. Sing along to the radio. listen to the birds.... it doesn't have to last an hour.... but it may just put a smile on your face.

--FG

[Anonymous]

From what I know of myself, I don't think i have clinical depression.  I just feel so lost and disconnected within myself.  I don't really know who I am anymore.  Does anyone ever feel this way?  I feel like a wandering lost soul.  Happy...what does that mean??  I haven't been happy for so long, that I've forgotten what that word really means.  

Yes, I often feel that way.

Everybody has a different definition of "happy."  I think, for me, that it has a lot to do with feeling usefully engaged in life and feeling that I have a choice in what I do.  To tell you the truth, I have far more days when I don't feel that way than when I do.

I think that for many of us, whether we are clinically depressed is a subjective judgment.  I've never found it impossible to get out of bed, though I have spent whole days in my nightgown.  I've never completely lost interest in life, though I have temporarily lost interest in my life.  I think the worst is when your own life feels like a not-terribly-riveting movie.  You watch it, and you say, "Oh, so that's what happens to her."  It's all happening to somebody else, or happening at such a distance that you don't feel you could possibly affect any of it.  At least, that's how it is for me.

And I've been through the medication thing.  For me, it raised the floor, but it did nothing for the ceiling.  I didn't feel like I was doomed, but I didn't feel any more hopeful, either.  So eventually I stopped taking it, for a very specific (and some might say silly) reason:  It left me unable to play the piano.  My hands shook so badly that I couldn't control them well enough to play at any speed.  I really enjoy playing, especially when I am depressed.  I find that it fills my mind completely, crowding out my tendency to brood.  For the three or four minutes it takes to play a Bach fugue, nothing else bothers me because there is no room for anything else.  I wasn't willing to sacrifice that to Zoloft.

So I am sympathetic to your skepticism about whether the "label" fits you.  I firmly believe I have dysthymia--chronic low-grade depression--but that's an uninteresting label.  Nobody writes books about it, and it's resistant to medication.  So, basically, I'm stuck with it.  As a result, I just don't think about labels very much.

What do you enjoy?  What turns you on?  What gives you a feeling of satisfaction or accomplishment?  Spend as much time as you can with those things.

And tell me about them, if you want to.  I really want to know.

Sending you good thoughts,
daylily

[longtire]

And I've been through the medication thing.  For me, it raised the floor, but it did nothing for the ceiling.  I didn't feel like I was doomed, but I didn't feel any more hopeful, either.  So eventually I stopped taking it, for a very specific (and some might say silly) reason:  It left me unable to play the piano.  My hands shook so badly that I couldn't control them well enough to play at any speed.  I really enjoy playing, especially when I am depressed.  I find that it fills my mind completely, crowding out my tendency to brood.  For the three or four minutes it takes to play a Bach fugue, nothing else bothers me because there is no room for anything else.  I wasn't willing to sacrifice that to Zoloft.

Life without playing Bach would be a big test for me as well.  Recently there have been some days where that has been the only positive thing in my day.  I enjoy playing Bach's organ music the most.
((((((daylily))))))

[Desert Rain]

I can feel the genuineness behind all your words.  They give me a nice warm feeling on the inside.

I could go for a mint chocolate chip ice cream right now.  That would definitely give me a lift.

Daylily,  the descriptions of happiness and your type of depression reflect how I feel about myself.  I haven't had much free time to let my mind ponder on what makes my spirit dance.  Thank you for gaving me something good to think about.

Sleeping is not a problem for me.  I definitely know I don't have clinical depression.  I could see how meds could help if I have a chemical imbalance, though.

I will attempt to describe one of the major causes of my depression.  I hope I won't sound too confusing or too conclusive.  You know how those who get fixated on food become obese and those who get overly fixated on alcohol become alcoholic; in my case, I also have an unhealthy fixation which resulted in my disconnection from my spirit and from deeply engaging in life.  The thing with me is, I get fixated on seeing others as bigger than me.  In retrospect, I see myself as smaller than them.  Mayber it works the other way around.  This is the fixation I have...  B/c I see myself smaller than others (psychologically speaking), I easily feel nervous, tense, unassertive, and inadequate.  That mindset becomes esp. intense when I'm in the company of those whom I perceive as having what I lack.  Even though, I now know that the big scary monster was nothing more than the shadow of a harmless object, I've not been able to get past the residual feeling of fear of the intimidating figure.  Yeah, this does sound very childish in thought.  In a sense, this is my inner child who still feels scared at times.  In my adult mind, I know that ppl are just as vulnerable as I am and as imperfect as I am.  And need as much acceptance and love as I do.  They are just better at getting what they need than I can for myself.

My fixation which I don't know how to fix affects every psychological fiber of my being and every aspect of myself.  Particulary, it affects my spirit and disposition.  Everytime I put myself in that low position, I open the dooor for others to undermine me and I don't have the resolve to stand proud and behave in a way that says, noone is bigger than me or that I'm not smaller than anyone.  Instead, I cowar like a clam.  This is the inner conflict I wrestle with throughout my entire day.  Of course, I know ppl don't perceive me as inferior to them or whatnot, but still... And when I put myself in such a low mental positon of myself, I just feel like a complete coward.  Then I feel ashame of myself while I beat myself up mentally.  My spirit feels deflated and my day becomes ruined.  This is one of the underlying causes of my depression.  It's the shame I feel for feeling defeated.

This is the fixation I have not been able to override.  I feel that with the guided help of someone skilled, who can provide mental coaching to help reframe my thinking, I can be cured of this fixation that I carry around with me every waking moment.  It weighs me down like a boulder.  Sometimes I think to myself, I wonder what I could have been or what I could have accomplished, if only...  I sound like I'm in my 60s.  I'm actually much younger than that.

Thanks for listening.

Butterfly

[Desert Rain]

It's me again.

In case you are wondering why I ended my letter with "butterfly", well, that's the other name I go by.  At this point in my life I feel more like a desert than a butterfly though.

Sorry for the confusion.

[Stormchild]

(((((Desert Butterfly In The Rain)))))

Whatever name you feel like using, just speak from your heart, and we will hear you!

((((()))))

[bunny]

Hi Butterfly/Desert,

You posted before about this, right? It seems that "thinking" is not going to solve this. You already have reasonable, logical thoughts about it. Maybe if you saw someone who worked at the somatic/emotional level, you might get somewhere. Just my 2c. What do you think?

bunny

[Desert Rain]

Thanks Stormchild!

What a neat combo you've put together.

Desert Butterfly in the Rain...I like that.  

[Desert Rain]

Bunny, I'm with you on the idea of seeking therapy.  

My goal is to get to that place.  Therapy is such a new concept for me, that I'm taking baby steps to eventually get me to that point.  Posting here is my next baby step that I'm taking.

Thank you all for helping me along.  Your postings give me needed strength to move forward.

Desert Rain

[Desert Rain]

Hello everyone,

I have a feeling that I gave the wrong impression with my previous post.  I just don't want anybody to think that I am here desperately waiting for ppl to provide me help or expecting it from anybody.  Everyone here has enough things going on with their lives without having another thing to be concerned about.  What I want to convey when I said, you all are helping me along is simply that b/c you're hearing me out, it helps me tremendously.  It helps me sort out/ untangle/ dust off the cobweb that's been collecting over the years.  It also helps me to understand myself better.  I guess the act of talking is what I need to do most at this moment.  This is my stepping stone to therapy.

Thanks for hearing me.

Desert Rain A.K.A.  Butterfly

[Anonymous]

Hi Desert Butterfly,

As bunny said, you think logically about yourself and you seem to know your self image is not how others see you.
Getting from knowing it to feeling it is usually the hard part, eh?
I'm glad you started a new thread and i hope you can use these baby steps to get to where your heart has caught up with your head.

Everyone here has enough things going on with their lives without having another thing to be concerned about.

If that were so, this board would just be people seeking support and no one giving it. I think just about everyone here has the time to be concerned about anyone who is hurting and voiceless.

God bless.

mudpup

[Desert Rain]

Okay, Mudpup...

That makes sense to me.

D.R.

[daylily]

Hi there,

The thing with me is, I get fixated on seeing others as bigger than me.  In retrospect, I see myself as smaller than them.  Mayber it works the other way around.  This is the fixation I have...  B/c I see myself smaller than others (psychologically speaking), I easily feel nervous, tense, unassertive, and inadequate.  That mindset becomes esp. intense when I'm in the company of those whom I perceive as having what I lack.

Oh, this I know very, very well.  The sweaty palms, the inability to look at people's faces, anxiety and shame knocking at your heart like an excluded ghost--yes, I think I know what you're describing.

There's no easy way out of this, I'm afraid.  I can't speak for you, but for me, I don't ever remember things being different.  I can't reach back to some memory of "health" on which I can model my behavior.  It's all new, and sometimes it feels like trying to drag the earth a few degrees backward.  The momentum pushiing me into this behavior is so strong; I can't always stop it, let alone reverse it.

I can't imagine trying to do this without therapy.  Not that it's a magic bullet--my checkbook certainly tells me otherwise--but it is a great gift you can give yourself:  the gift of a space that is yours alone, the gift of someone whose job it is to listen to you and provide counsel, the gift of allowing yourself to feel and say whatever seems important to you (at least in 50-minute increments).

Then I feel ashamed of myself while I beat myself up mentally.  My spirit feels deflated and my day becomes ruined.  This is one of the underlying causes of my depression.  It's the shame I feel for feeling defeated.

Lord, yes.  Of all the feelings I feel, that is the most painful--the one where you're down on yourself for being down on yourself.  It's walking through sand; every step gets harder and harder, until finally, thankfully, the day is over and I can go to bed.

I feel that with the guided help of someone skilled, who can provide mental coaching to help reframe my thinking, I can be cured of this fixation that I carry around with me every waking moment.  It weighs me down like a boulder.

But it's not all about thinking, is it, and I don't think we're ever "cured."  Sometimes I believe that therapy teaches you how to re-parent yourself, how to tend to your own emotional needs and give yourself (or find in the world) what you never received.  Now, I realize there's a certain "Gak!" factor in that...inner child and all...but I also think there's a profound truth there as well.  If we could think our way out of these feelings, most of the therapists would starve.  We have to feel our way out of them, and that is a long, painful, frightening process that no I've ever known could face alone.  

Can I ask you what is stopping you from making that first appointment?  You're very articulate about what the problem is.  You seem to have a fine grasp of what you would ask for in therapy.  I'm interested in why you don't think you're ready for it--because you seem very clear about its potential benefits.

I hope your day is going well--

daylily

[Desert Rain]

((((Daylily))))

I can't tell you how much you're posting means to me.  They mean more than my words can express.  Although we are phantom strangers, you seem to know me so well.  The feelings and thoughts I can't seem to articulate, you said it like you know exactly what's going on in my subconscious.

A few things deter me from making the first appt with a therapist:  a demanding course load, finance, and lack of time.  Also, this may sound ridiculous, but I don't have any good references of therapists.  Other than a few resources at my disposal (that I've been putting off into researching them). Other than that, I am at a lost.  To tell you the truth, it seems a little intimidating to me.  I guess it's just the fear of the unknown.  I'm afraid that I'll be misunderstood, misdiagnosed, and mistreated.  Then I would have to go through the pain and aggravation of being misunderstood.  For me, being misunderstood is worse than not being understood.  Does that make any sense?  I'm afraid that after I bare my soul to the therapist, I would get emotionally betrayed.  Hmmm, maybe I'm being a little dramatic here.  But I've been betrayed emotionally before, I don't want to have to go thru that again, esp. by someone who is suppose to understand you.  I know, I know...the bigger the risk, the greater the reward.  The first step seems to be the hardest b/c I don't know what to expect or whether my expectations will be met.

Desert Rain