Author Topic: A string of unfulfilling relationships...  (Read 28722 times)

Brigid

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #45 on: August 13, 2005, 05:35:36 PM »
bunny,

Quote
Have you ever mentioned to your therapist the idea that he's going to kick you out of the nest?

Actually no.  We have recently decreased from meeting every week to every other week at my suggestion.  Never having been in therapy, I wasn't sure what to expect from bringing the relationship to an end.  He has never suggested that we would end therapy for me any time soon.  I guess I just assumed that would be the case.  At this point, I'm pretty much taking it month to month and hoping I do not have any significant backsliding.  I guess time will tell. 

Thanks for the information.

Brigid

bunny

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #46 on: August 13, 2005, 10:45:09 PM »
Brigid,

I urge you to tell him that you felt he'd kick you out of the nest to fly on your own. This is very important material. I predict he will be fairly excited to hear it, as it is "transference" and it's like giving him a gift.

bunny

bunny

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #47 on: August 14, 2005, 12:10:16 PM »
If I were bored and distracted in therapy I would tell the therapist that I was feeling this. Here are possible things it could mean:

-- I am very angry with the therapist.

-- The therapist upset me and I can't tell him/her about it.

-- I don't like or trust the therapist.

-- I want to leave therapy and can't admit it.

-- I am trying to escape from things the therapist is saying. The therapist needs to be more sensitive to my needs.

Bottom line, it's grist for the mill.

bunny

Chicken

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2005, 10:05:55 AM »
Hi Everyone!
I had a nice weekend away.  Well I enjoyed the first day and a half and then I was dying to come home because I was tired of having to smile all the time and make conversation with everyone I had just met/was introduced to.  Having to do that for a day though, did me the world of good.  It feels healthy.

There is so much to respond to on here that I don't know where to begin.

The therapy thing: 

 
If I were bored and distracted in therapy I would tell the therapist that I was feeling this. Here are possible things it could mean:

-- I am very angry with the therapist.

-- The therapist upset me and I can't tell him/her about it.

-- I don't like or trust the therapist.

-- I want to leave therapy and can't admit it.

-- I am trying to escape from things the therapist is saying. The therapist needs to be more sensitive to my needs.


Nothing applies to me from this list...  In the past I just couldn't justify continuing therapy because ...

1. It's so expensive!

2. I felt like it was constantly keeping my wound open, thus always making me feel down, I felt like I had to keep myself in that depressed state in order for the therapy to work.  If I allowed myself to be happy, then my wound would close and I wouldn't open up to therapy in my next session, thus making it a waste of time and money and I felt like such a fake.

3. I have felt that talking about it, didn't work for me.  I knew why I was experiencing the things I was experiencing but I couldn't help it.  However, things have changed since then and I have definate goals now about what I want to achieve from therapy.  I think it's important to have a goal, an objective, otherwise it's a pointless exercise in my opinion.
I feel more educated about my problem now.  I feel like I have a problem, which before I wasn't so sure about.  I was very confused before but now I think I can trust my perception on things which is helpful because now we can chat properly

I have my first appointment with my counsellor on Friday.  It's the same one I had before.  I like her and trust her and have no problems opening up to her.

Does everyone experience "transference" in therapy?  I don't think I ever have, does that mean it's not working for me?

spyralle

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2005, 11:44:31 AM »
Hi Selkie,

It's so nice to see you back.  I am glad that some of it was good for you.  I know what you mean though about all that smiling!!!!

I was also worried about the expense of therapy.  I can't really afford it but when I weighed it up against all the financial and emotional abuse, I began to think that it must be worth it at any cost...
I guess it's not always necessary to do the open wound stuff with the therapist.  Maybe just the everyday things that are going on in the here and now are useful to examine also in terms of reaction and re framing stuff.  I was so releived with this new therapist when she actually said that it was not enough just to know, but also to test changing behaviour and bring it to the session. 

I know what you mean about being educated.  It has helped me enormously being able to come here and speak with people who understand.

Sometimes transference just is...  It will depend on the therapist and her orientation and how useful it is to you as to whether it is brought out into the open... i wouldn't worry too much about the theory, just go with the flow...
(Ha ha listen to me I sound like a sane personxxxx)
Spyralle x


vunil

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #50 on: August 15, 2005, 01:25:46 PM »
My understanding of transference is that it is only really working if you don't know you are doing it.  It just feels "real" that the therapist is feeling xyz or acting xyz.  Early in therapy in my 20's I got really furious at my therapist for judging me.  She just sat there most of the time (she was that kind of therapist, which I needed then) with a nice expression on her face, quiet.  It became clear to me she was being sarcastic and mocking me.  Boy was I mad!  I just really needed to let her know what I thought about all of her criticism :)

She handled it great and we really made progress that day.  But it was only later that I realized what I had been doing.  If she had told me at the time-- oh boy would I have stormed out of there indignantly. 

I guess it goes without saying that my parents are sarcastic and critical and mocked me my whole childhood.

Humans are funny.  We are so complicated. 

Anyway, maybe some of your antipathy in previous therapy situations was transference.  Who knows? It's definitely possible. 

Chicken

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #51 on: August 15, 2005, 05:34:00 PM »
Oh God!  Tonight is so hard!   :( :( :(
I miss him so much and all I can think about is the way he loved me.  No one loved me as much as he did.  He made me feel soooooo special.  I just want to fall back into his arms and forget everything that has happened.  It's so hard to be this new strong person.  I miss what I had with him and I love him so much and am so attracted to him.  I hope he doesn't ring me because I just might pick up. :cry:
He loved me so much and I just want to feel that again...

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh!

 :oops:

Just four days til I see my counsellor, I hope I can hold out til then...  I feel like I am going to break.  I am not in a strong place.

Thanks for allowing me to offload...


Moira

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #52 on: August 15, 2005, 06:40:34 PM »
Hi Selkie! I totally relate to the place you may be stuck in now! Remember that Ns are incapable of loving- they're excellent actors and con artists . They learn how to go through the motions, read you for any vulnerability, and they know how to fake love. It's all about them and they're getting what they want at your expense- ALWAYS. If you've been- like me- addicted to love and relationships that are abusive and unhealthy- we are codependent. we are good at lying to ourselves, denying and rationalizing crazy making behaviours that a healthy person would never tolerate. My ex N is now calling me++ and leaving the old" oh baby...things will be different now..I see how I hurt you and it'll never happen again...you are the only woman who has ever understood me...you are my soulmate..." All B.S.!!! As people who have picked abusive relationships, we become addicted to the incredible highs and intensity and we come to believe no other man can ever give us those highs. We tend to find " normal" men boring. Focus on the lows and the incredible depression, self doubt, destructive and soul destroying crap we endure for lengthy periods of time after the sort lived honeymoon period is over. I actually found it helpful to put notes on my phone, computer etc reminding myself of the lying and abuse and tell myself not to answer the phone, not to return messages, not to respond to emails, not to answer my door should he arrive, not to talk to anyone who supports him. This is overwhelming at first but with each day, I find it getting easier and I'm getting stronger. There will always be days you feel so low you are tempted to call him. If I engage, I'm giving him the power to use and abuse me. If you have absolutely no contact with an N they will get bored and move on to another " source of Nicisstic supply". This term refers to Ns viewing all interactions in the context of using people who are vulnerable- treating us as objects because that's all we are to them- and then discarding their victims when they no longer have anything to offer. Ns always quickly find someone/ another group of people- to exploit. I also find it really empowering to start reconnecting with friends you may have neglected while with the N, going back to hobbies etc. you once loved but dropped because a N relationship is all consuming and meeting new healthy people. I'm getting back into my art, reading, going out, swimming. I'm actually meeting quite a few healthy people now- the first time in almost two years! I'm starting to like myself again, and in fact, feel like I'm back in touch with positive emotions- other than always being consumed with anger, pain, sadness, loneliness, self doubt etc. I hope this helps somehow. Keep posting here- we're all here to learn and support each other. I sent you an email in response to your email to me- but don't know if I sent it correctly! Let me know if you got it- if not, I'll send another one! Hang in there!!! a big hug and thinking of you!!! Moira
I've just ended abusive relationship of 1 yr. with male narcissist. I cycle between stages of anger and grieving and have accepted it. Hope I've alienated him so he won't recontact me- is this possible?     Moira

spyralle

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #53 on: August 16, 2005, 05:23:43 AM »
(((((((((((((((Selkie)))))))))))))))))))  Oh I so badly feel for you .  I know exactly where you are and the pain is so horrible.  You said 'I love him so much and am so attracted to him'......  Selkie, are you attracted to him or the devasating feelings he leaves you with.  This is familiarity.  How scary is it to stand alone and value yourself.  I know for me it is terrifying.  Remember how you felt the other day after he assaulted you.  Do you really want that......??  Moira is right any of the stuff that he comes out with that makes you feel special is nothing but B**lsh**.  I am learning how good at acting these people are and it is shocking....  I know this is painful now but you are getting through it.  Imagine yourself another three months down the line if you get back in contact with him.  Remember I told you about my therapist asking what he would have to do to make me leave.  and you said that assault would make you leave.  Remember that.  That was only a few days ago.  don't let the memory of how you felt then get lost amidst the pain of being with yourself...

You are worth so much more than this.  You are a special beautiful person who is worthy of a healthy life with healthy people who love you properly...

Spyralle xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Plucky

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #54 on: August 16, 2005, 01:20:47 PM »
Hi Selkie,
I agree with Moira.  Make a list of all the awful things he has done.  Leave copies lying around the house and look at it when you are feeling weak.  Play some empowering music (Alanis Morissette or Gloria Gaynor).  If you feel up to it, think through all the 'wonderful' things that happened and dissect them with the lies you know they consist of.   Be strong.  Your survival is at stake.  Use the R word.  He raped you.  That is a crime.  There is nothing loving about rape, ever.   Could you force, coerce, humiliate, and hurt someone you loved?  Can you imagine yourself doing the things he has done?   Did it feel good when he raped you?  Did it feel loving?  Do you want it to happen again?  Because if you go back, it will seem you are ok with it.

He has spun a lying story of your 'love' affair. You need to re-spin that story and make it into the true nightmare it was.  Every so-called loving a wonderful experience needs to be reinterpreted based on your knowledge that this guy is a user, a loser, and and abuser.   Do it in writing and it will be there as a resource for you later in weak moments.
Once the fiction of the 'loving relationship' is taken away, it might be easier to resist his advances and your responses.  Good luck and I am pulling for you.
Plucky   

Chicken

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #55 on: August 16, 2005, 07:05:30 PM »
((((((Moira, Spyralle & Plucky))))))))
Thanks again for your support.  I have been on a downward spiral since Monday.  I put it down to spending all day Monday doing nothing but wallowing and now I recommend to all in the same situation that the key is to keep busy

It seems you just dig a big trench sitting around thinking about it.  It's much harder to get out of the trench once you've dug it.

I love the idea of remembering all the bad things he has done, because I normally don't hold on to anger for very long, and once it wears off I forgive and forget easily thus remembering only the good bits, which in turn lead to me craving him

I think I will make a list here too...  Just for my own record...

1. He said to me "I normally go for glamourous girls but this time it's different..."
2. He said to me "I normally go for flashy girls but this time it's different..."
3. When we went out for a drink once, he approached a girl and told her she was so beautiful
On another occasion he sat with three girls whilst out with me and a friend
4. He tore my ipod headphones out of my ears once and broke them.
5. He wrote a letter on my bed sheet, in permanent ink, after I asked him to leave (because of the ipod situation)
6. He told me liked women with high-heels, this is when I was used to wear flats (I stupidly bought high-heels after this... cringe!)
7. He always stared at other women and commented on their beauty
8. He told me that he doesn't believe in monogamy
9. He told me he was addicted to porn for two years
10. When I asked him what are the ten most important things for him in life, among his list was
"seduction"
"locking eyes with someone across a crowded room"
11. He used to point out my spots/blackheads (-I don't have many, believe me)
12. We went out for drinks with my friend R***.  They seemed to hit it off and I was relieved, they listened to the same ipod to some songs and he said to R***, I bet Selkie is jealous of us now...
13. He was very rough with me despite my asking him to stop
14. When I told him that I had a string of relationships that ended in abuse, he told me that I should look at how I contributed to it and that maybe I pushed people to it
15. He was physically and sexually violent
16. He went away for the weekend to a festival...  When he returned i asked him if he'd been faithful, he replied "I'm really proud of myself because I was faithful to you"
« Last Edit: August 17, 2005, 06:19:24 PM by Selkie »

spyralle

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #56 on: August 17, 2005, 02:24:24 PM »
Yep Selkie I know that holding on to the good bits scenario....

! + 2.  He clearly fails to see your depth and is obviously looking for some showy offy person to compliment his own arrogant self importance.

3.  He is deliberately trying to unseat you and keep you unsure and off balance  CONTROL

4.  he is a selfish violent a**h**le who obviously thinks that HE should have everything and has no respect for others or their property.  CONTROL

5.  Spoilt selfish, again trying to damage yoour nice things because he is jealous

6.  Again trying to keep you off balance.  I did things like that on many occasions.  It's all about them subtley subtly making you uncomfortable with the way you are to make themselves feel better.  CONTROL

7.  He knew this would wind you up and again start doubting yourself.  CONTROL

8.  I guess this will make you try harder to dedicate yourself to him and be that special one.  It will also make you doubt yourself AGAIN!!! CONTROL

9.  YUCK YUCK YUCK.........  All about him.... 

10. Isn't seduction all about control???????????

11.  CONTROL>>>>CONTROL>>>CONTROL

12,13,14,15,...............Control.......CONTROL.....ABUSIVE AND EMPTY AND SHALLOW AND VICIOUS CONTROL.....

He was a bit controlling wasn't he...................................

You on the other hand are deep and interesting and loving and compassionate.....  People like him want to take that away because they are soooooo unable to do it.  Feel really proud to be who you are and being as strong as you are being. 

(((((((((((((((((((((((Selkie))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Spyralle xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  Hang on in there xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx





Chicken

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #57 on: August 17, 2005, 06:23:02 PM »
Spyralle,
Thank you so much for taking the time to read that and to respond.  I did that for my own benefit and didn't count on anyone else taking the time to read it!!! 
You speak a lot about control.  I guess in time I will see how he tried to control me.  I am struggling to see how you diagnosed it as control.  I'm sure therapy will open my eyes to it.  My instincts told me the above behaviour was wrong. 
I'm doing much better today, so much better.  I don't imagine it will take me much longer now.
xx

Plucky

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #58 on: August 17, 2005, 08:30:04 PM »
Quote
You speak a lot about control.  I guess in time I will see how he tried to control me.  I am struggling to see how you diagnosed it as control. 
Hi Selkie,
I think this is about not letting you value yourself enough to think about what he was doing or not doing.   If you are kept busy fretting over your own imaginary shortcomings, you will not see his own collossal faults.  He controlled your ability to evaluate the relationship, therefore behave appropriately in it, by pushing your buttons.   The buttons so conveniently created by others in your life.  The buttons he looked for when he opened the package (how do I work this thing?  oh yes).  You ended up taking his word for what was going on, instead of seeing what a fraud he was/is.
I think. 
Plucky

Chicken

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Re: A string of unfulfilling relationships...
« Reply #59 on: August 18, 2005, 03:05:42 AM »
Plucky, that is a very very valuable and perceptive insight...  It makes a whole lot of sense.  Thanks so much...  growing up I was painfully shy around men, it wasn't til my mid twenties til I could actually be brave enough to talk to them! (Had to get really really drunk to be able to talk to them!) In every other area in life, I was confident and extremely outgoing so I never knew why I was like that around men.  Anyway, I guess I was so busy trying to fix myself around men over the years, always trying to be this way or that, never being able to be myself and ALWAYS ALWAYS allowing them to dictate who I was and how I was behaving.  I never thought for one minute that I was ok and maybe someone was taking me for a ride!  I took their word as gospel.  If they said I was being manipulative, then I would believe that etc...

I have never even given myself the opportunity to ask myself if I liked the person (ie. once I got to know them)!  If they loved me, then I would stay with them what ever it took...

Thanks for giving me something to ponder over...
« Last Edit: August 18, 2005, 03:29:56 AM by Selkie »