iNsight

[write]

I was talking to ex tonight about our son and he said 'here we have that same old problem: it's not about you!'

That would have floored me a few months back, and the unfairness would have sent me into emotional turmoil.

I just said 'well actually, this is about me.'

He replied deflated 'yes. I suppose it is.'

And I suddenly got a blind flash of light.

He doesn't get it. That 'sharedness' between people so relationships can take place, that taking turns and having each person's needs taken care of as much as possible within the wider context of us all. And sometimes it's more one than the other...it's a constantly shifting balance of emotions.

It's all words to him. He's learned now: sometimes you need to apologise; he can't hog the whole conversation; all people have interdependent needs; you can't tell people what to do based on your own perceptions.

But he doesn't get the delicateness of the interwebbing, the fact that things go wrong and there will be confrontation, and most of all- that there is no certitude.

He is looking for a solution: a system of family interactions. A model to work off of.
Something certain by which he can say 'I'm right' or 'you're right' and know
like a small child needs to know things...

All our years together his answer to any problem he could not immediately instruct us how to solve was to withdraw and then- no one can accuse him of doing anything wrong! He's out of it.

And he still is.
Our son has a problem and as much as ever- it's between the boy and me.
He can give me the benefit of high-handed advice but is he going to really get involved? Set a better example? Talk to his son? Empathise?

I'm not saying he isn't trying to be a dad and make reparation to me.
He is.
I think he's a wonderful father in many ways I have seen in my own family the fathers are not: he will expend endless time, patience, money, trying to set an example as a responsible person, be an organ donor if neccesary....

But he doesn't know how to love.

[Hopalong]

Write,
That is such a beautifully written description that it almost brings joy...
except that it is so sad.

Then again, the beauty wins, imho.

You have the insight.
You have deep understanding...past that, you've gone all the way to compassion.

(It's so easy to confuse compassion with weakness, but it's not the same at all.)

This is one of the most balanced things I've read.
Thanks for sharing it. What a strength.

Hopalong

[write]

Thanks H.

It is at once joy, strength, and sadness.

But that is LIFE.

I never wanted my relationship with a narcissistic pd husband to be any more than I want anything else in my life to be: evidence of my journey.

No matter what N-h ever did or does I will never relinquish a compassionate ideal.
It's my weakness if you like.
I want to see everything as how it might be.

I'm coming to the end of my N-journey.
A place where the best outcome is here and will be 'tweaked' by various therapists or life experiences for us all...but I did what I set out to do.

Help my npd husband reach a place of safety, whilst growing myself and my son into new fertile territory of being able to cope and BE.
With our past and our future. And the present:

it's a place where we acknowledge the battle but the battle no longer 'rages'...

<over and out>

[Brigid]

Write,
I really liked what you wrote.  My xh also tries in his own way to be a good father.  That does not include teaching any responsibility or getting involved with serious issues (that is all left for me), but he is good to the kids and makes them laugh and they now recognize that he is just another kid, only older.  When I bring up an issue in an e-mail (our normal form of communication) regarding one of the children, assuming they have also shared it with him, I usually hear from him that he was unaware of the situation--but he still hasn't figured out why.  The kids have learned that there isn't much use in having a serious conversation with him and if it's important, they are going to talk to me.

But the reality is, that it was always like that even when we still lived together.  It took me awhile to come to terms with that, but now that I have and just don't care what involvement he has as long as he pays their education fees and sends me my monthly maintenance, we're doing fine.  Compared to many others here, I feel very fortunate to have an ex who just wants us to get along and doesn't want me to be angry with him.  I treat him like the pathetic little boy that he is, but I no longer have to manage his life, be responsible for his bad behavior, or depend on him for anything but money.  I'm very good with that.

Brigid

[write]

Thank you.

I'm not sure everyone gets what I am saying sometimes, and when I see people about to start WW3 or go another round or dance...I want to say: don't do it! But I know everyone has their own path to work out.

Personally I think I have spared myself and my family grief by deciding that ex-n-h will be an ongoing part of my life, so let's make it a good healthy part as much as possible.

If you heard some of our conversations though- you'd laugh.
He was supposed to return the boy today around lunch, I called at 2 pm and he was still sleeping and told my son, tell your mother don't come over if she's mad at me!
I went over and burst in shouting where is he, let me at him...and we all laughed.
He's not going to change so I might as well adapt to the situation with humour.

Compared to many others here, I feel very fortunate to have an ex who just wants us to get along and doesn't want me to be angry with him.  I treat him like the pathetic little boy that he is, but I no longer have to manage his life, be responsible for his bad behavior, or depend on him for anything but money.  I'm very good with that.

absolutely. Me too.

I feel I have been the kindest person I could be and if I've been angry or unreasonable- well I'm only human.

But like you I watch ( in dismay sometimes ) as I see he can't grow up. And I love him, and can see the wonderful 'might have been' future we could have had, and just have to let go just as I would if he had a  brain tumour or something else I cannot predict or control.+

Btw.
my son initially wanted to live with daddy, and spent a happy six months slumming it and late bedtimes, eating what he wanted, watching unsuitable tv.
Now he's back largely with me, a couple of nights a week at Dad's.
He's realised that daddy's just another kid, and he still needs an adult parent more than not.
I am so glad I ddn't fight it and let my boy work it out for himself, though everyone was saying when he moved in with his dad that I should fight.

How can you fight a shape-shifting angst-ridden bundle of talented no-person?

[Plucky]

Hello write and brigid,
Thank you for writing what you did.  It is so helpful to me, as I face splitting up with my H.  He tries but he just can't do it.    And I alternate between being impatient and sad about it.
Plucky

[Hopalong]

(((((((((((((Plucky)))))))))))))))

Hops

[write]

Hi Plucky-

you will find make your decision when you're ready, when it's right, and in the way feels right.

It's no use behaving angrily either- I have found it makes Ns worse ( it makes most things worse ) though it can be a brief control mechanism sometimes.

Or hating- my ex hates himself more than anyone else ever could, with no good reason.

No amount of love or reassurance makes any difference either.

We are all here for you as you go through this.

I really believe that by being as open and caring as I can- whilst taking care of business- it has made the process easier.
My ex doesn't trust me, but he knows he could trust me, if he were able to...

[Plucky]

Thank you Write,
I'm just inching along.  Your insight really helps.  Also the hugs.
Plucky