Money

[WRITE]

over the past few weeks I have had to shelve some of my plans simply for financial and practical expedience.

I found it made me panic one bad month when the bills outstripped the incoming.

But looking at Hops request for support just made me think even more- we don't have anyone to lean upon....and that can be quite a challenge, financial independence on top of everything else.

I set out to work for myself and undercharged. I decided I was too money-fixated by charging at all and so I started working half my work free. Last week I got hung up because I don't have a degree even though I don't need one to do what I am doign and in many ways it has been liberating not to get 'hooked' by a well-paid job I didn't like any more as I was in my twenties....

There's no one to tell stuff to though, as Hops said. No one to lean on is the phrase keeps coming to me.

I am afraid to go too far with my ideas for some reason, so I keep letting practicalities hold me back.

Because I have no one to lean on? That's definitely part of it for me, and I do sort-of lean on ex too because he pays my alimony and is excellent advise and sounding-board. When He's well that is...

If I had a daughter the first thing I would teach her is how to value her skills and worth and to expect to be financially independent.

I don't think women of my generation or older grew up with that, and though we had role model exceptions I think still many of my friends are taken care of financially or have someone to lean upon.

Even in an inverted fashion for some of them- they work their butt off to keep a lazy guy/ family for example.

I am not anchored anywhere in this way.
If I don't want to I don't have to; and achievements and goals I can set and work on entirely independent of anyone's input or criticism or say-so.

You'd think it would all be liberating, yet it just feels like:

I have no one to lean on.

I'm beginning to realise I was raised to believe someone would take care of me somewhere down the line.

Hops buisness ideas sound so interesting, and I can see immediately it's worth taking a chance and going for it Hops. There is bound to be something you can cash in or remortgage or downsize to cover it.

I even worked my credit rating from nothing to big in the past three years just so I can have a loan or run up debts as a safety net in emergency myself.

But what to do, how to decide, and most of all trust myself to take something on and carry it through....

Don't know if any of this is all you are feeling Hops but I know it helped me immensely to start facing my financial head-in-the-sand I was doing back then when GS first wrote about debts and anxiety around money, and seeing her build on that and take control.

We can do it you know.

Looking for another quote I just rememebred I found this instead:

“The best day of your life is the one on which you decide your life is your own. No apologies or excuses. No one to lean on, rely on, or blame. The gift is yours - it is an amazing journey - and you alone are responsible for the quality of it. This is the day your life really begins.”

Wow.

I think I am going to look at some of the financial advice for women books which are around right now, it's a place my skills are a bit deficient.

[Gaining Strength]

You write so clearly about this issue of finances.  I so fully connect with what you say. - Gaining Strength

[axa]

Write,

I understand what you are saying.  I have ideas about a new venture but find the fact that I have no one to lean on very very scary.  I can do the work but the thought of everything falling back on me, alone, is very scary.  I think acceptance of being alone and not hoping for that "wishful supportive partner" is a big step.  My motto lately has been what is the worst thing that can happen if I do this. 

Sounds to me you are capable and able and the more you know this about yourself the easier it will be to forge ahead.  I too so believed that in the end someone would look after me and take care of me........... its a tough one to give up on. 

For what it is worth with my business idea I have made a plan and looked into the financial implications, the rewards, financial and personal, the commitment, the energy it would take, the knowing that I would be doing it alone.......... as I work through these headings I am beginning to think that it is not feasable, which is a disappointment but I am being realistic.  Maybe I need to scale things down.  The financial implications are huge for me and I feel unable to take on such a burden at the moment.  I suppose I have decided to park the idea for the present and look at another option which would not put me in such a vulnerable financial situation.  The process has been interesting.  I have been very grown up about it.

Sounds to me researching financial advice is a very smart thing to do.  Keeping my fingers crossed for you and Hops,


axa

[mum]

Write:
I am exploring my relationship with money/career lately as well.

It IS really hard to decide if a new venture is going to pan out. Too bad we can't have some way to know, but then, where's the fun in that?  Sometimes we have to decide on security. We make our choices for good reasons.
A while back, I thought I would write and illustrate children's books. So I did some research and part of that was going to a writer's convention. I left convinced that I suck at writing, but found out that illustrators do pretty well. Good to know!! I canned that for a while because I have kids who count on me and it just felt too risky at the time.

I am now slowly exploring other career options and when I got my first check for some design work I did on the side, I felt really guilty, like I hadn't done anything but have fun when I did it.

 I have found that like most of my issues in life, a lot of my attitudes and feelings about money were based in what came from a religious ideology:

     money is bad

     people who have money must have done something bad to get it

     there are people suffering for thier basic needs to be met so why would I even want more for myself

     if I have more money, someone is suffering because of it

     I must be a bad person to even ask for more money for my services/product

     Having a good time AND getting paid for it makes me a bad person

and this stems also from a mentality of LACK/POVERTY:

     there is a limited supply of money in the world so if someone has some, someone else does not

     I must hang on to every penny and invest it wisely or I will lose it

These (above) are just a handful of mindsets that I have been consioiusly working through lately. They are very closely tied with the beliefs that shaped many choices I made in this life.

I think self doubt, fear and ghosts from our past/voices in our head have more to do with financial success (however we define that) than almost anything else.

I see tons of artists who do work that to my standards is awful, but who have found a way to parlay that into a successful income. That's probably true in any field. So why shouldn't I be making the living I want to in the way I want to? Those are the questions that hit so many nerves. Exploring it is hard, but change and growth are never easy.

I think the only difference between me and some designer with questionable skills but who is financially successful is this:
They believe they are worth what they do and because of that have convinced someone to pay for it.
Doesn't matter how talented I am if I don't DO IT and put myself out there and BELIEVE I deserve to be paid for my work.

 

[cats paw]

Mum,

   Found your post helpful in that I can substitute happiness for the word money in some of those, especially the one about there are people suffering for there basic needs to be met.  Odd thing is though, I can be happy for other people's happiness.

   Yep- back to examining where and how certain beliefs came about. (Again!)

cats paw

[WRITE]

Thanks GS, Axa, Mum, Cp.

There is so much here I must digest & this absolutely jumps off the page:

Doesn't matter how talented I am if I don't DO IT and put myself out there and BELIEVE I deserve to be paid for my work. ( Mum )

It's almost like deep-down we don't want to be successful, isn't it!

I've re-ordered Marsha Sinetar 'Do what you love and the money will follow' which was such an inspiration when I first started the business, and I'm going to seek some more mentor and support for what I want to do next.

Thank you so much for all this, look at another option which would not put me in such a vulnerable financial situation.  The process has been interesting.  I have been very grown up about it. (Axa)

I don't think I am being very grown-up especially about having to shelves the divorce for a few weeks, but I know I can't just throw everything up in the air either like I have so many times before....

Money is really symbolic of how we truly feel about ourself/life isn't it.

[isittoolate]

Sadly for me, as I was growing up, I saw that all the older gals were dating, then engaged, then married and the husband supported them.

Then I went out to work. I had no Degrees, whatever, but I did manage, as this was the time of Hope (Hopeless for me) Chests, to buy 12 place settings of silverware (Flair pattern) and 12 place settings of good Chinaware, Starburst pattern from Easterling.

So much for that, as I never married, I still have the damned dishes packed in 3 boxes in my closet, but one Xmas I gave my daughter my silverware Chest and everything in it.. The dishes? I would give them away except my daughter broke one of the fruit nappies and One place setting is short a piece --not the real excuse. Lordy--even has matching individual ash trays.

All I can say is that I figure G_d was looking after me and threw me into a car crash, disabled me, so I could sue and have enough money to live on, thanks to Hertz Rent-A-Car.

Obviously the work I do now is just part-time to be busy and I have never had the experiences like what you gals are talking about now!

I wish Luck to all of you.

Love
Izzy

[axa]

Oh dear, just figured out some stuff reading this thread.  I hate anything to do with money.  I was wowed by your sentance Write, about not wanting to be successful.  I feel this is tied in again with the shame issue.  When I work I have great difficulty sending out invoices.  I hate discussing money with people I work for.

As a kid money was always an issue in our house.  Asking for money when I was young always made me feel humiliated and was never given easily.  At school I was always the last girl in the class bringing in money for books/trips etc.  I would ask my father for it and he would make me hold out until the last minute.  I always felt ashamed when the teacher would ask me where my money was.  I recall being about 11 years old and telling the teacher, in front of the class, "My dad won't give me the money".  I got so sick of making excuses, I forget it etc... she left me alone after that.

What I am now reminded of is XN.  When I would ask him for something, a favour, help etc he would always make me wait.  I would become dispondent and when I hit a low he would give me what I asked for.  Again replaying the feelings of humiliation and shame.  Somehow I turned my attitude to money around so that it was not so painful.  I would act, as an adult, as if I did not care about money as if it was some kind of virtue but in truth it was defending against my shame and humiliation.  This has been so enlightening. 

There were many occasions when I could have been "successful" but sabotaged myself so I stayed in the old place.  Wow this is bringing up a lot of stuff for me.

Money is symbolic of how we feel about ourselves and others

I am beginning to see this.  XN was obsessed with money and material things.  I turned my shame about money issues into a feeling of superiority over him.  There is so much in all of this for me............ have to go and digest it.

axa

[WRITE]

I figure G_d was looking after me and threw me into a car crash, disabled me, so I could sue and have enough money to live on, thanks to Hertz Rent-A-Car.

well I'm sorry you had to be hurt Is, but you are right, we are taken care of sometimes in strange ways!

I have never wanted for anything in my life despite all the difficulties.

There were many occasions when I could have been "successful" but sabotaged myself so I stayed in the old place.  Wow this is bringing up a lot of stuff for me.

me too Axa.
It's something I feel is the right time to address, finally.

[GS]

I am about convinced that my problems with money are rarely about cash and bills, but about emotional stuff.

I agree 100%.  I just had that conversation with a friend earlier this week.

[WRITE]

i]Money, A Memoir, by Liz Perle[/i]

okay I'll order that too!

[axa]

Problems with money rarely about cash and bills but mostly about emotional stuff


CB

What would I do without you.  Your posts so often trigger things for me.  Yes Yes Yes.  I had no idea that this was an issue for me until a few days ago. 

There is something about if I discount money, talking about it, dealing with it etc I avoid a sense of humiliation.  My expectations have always been about money and gifts that I don't deserve it.  Its about my father, its all about my father.  I go straight back into child mode about money.  Rather than risk any disappointment about it I pretend it does not exist when I engage with others, then am left alone to panic.  I cannot tell you how shocked I am to make this connection.  I have a big "I do not deserve it" issue methinks!

This brings up a memory for me.  One time XN and I looked at a painting I just loved at an exhibition.  I really wanted it but felt it was too expensive for me, could not afford it etc.  I burst into tears and when he asked what was wrong I told him that if he wanted it I would have put it on my credit card and paid it off but I could not buy it for myself.  This really upset me.  Like he was more important than me.  This is one of the few happy ending stories I have with XN.  He went back and bought me the painting which I really appreciated.  But this is a pattern I obviously think others deserve more than I.  More stuff to struggle with or maybe just another layer of the onion being peeled back.


Last night I was at a friends house who had some "magical" eye cream which disguises those horrible bags and puffiness.  She slapped some on me and he presto! it seemed to work.  It was very expensive and I have decided next time I am in the city I am going to buy some........big step for me.  I would always have seen buying this kind of product as wasteful, extravagent, silly well maybe I need to be extravagent and silly sometimes......


axa

[Stormchild]

Last night I was at a friends house who had some "magical" eye cream which disguises those horrible bags and puffiness.  She slapped some on me and he presto! it seemed to work.  It was very expensive and I have decided next time I am in the city I am going to buy some........big step for me.  I would always have seen buying this kind of product as wasteful, extravagent, silly well maybe I need to be extravagent and silly sometimes......axa

Maybe I can save you a little money. Do you know what models and actors use to reduce swelling under their eyes?

Preparation H. So help me.

It works, too. Of course, you have to buy it, and you might feel kind of funny standing in line with it, but I think most pharmacists know about this other use, especially when women are doing the purchasing.

[WRITE]

'do not deserve it'

this is at a deep emoitonal level though I think.

Intellectually I know I give great service and value for my fees, and I get loads of good feedback.

But why do I push away job offers/ ways to earn more?

Part of it for me has been being a Christian. I know Jesus did not intend us to own much, though that is conveniently forgotten by many modern churches! But that would not stop me earning it and giving it away....

I think a lot of it is a generational thing or cultural thing too. I remember my dad saying 'why do you need a degree, you'll only get married and have kids...'
He didn't see that education would be great for personal development or raising kids even.
Just that it was a waste of time paying for my university.

So I never went, ripped up my forms, left school and vowed I'd succeed without his help or anyone's.

And I have, largely.

But now somehow I equate status and success symbols ( including wealth ) with pain.

I was pretty wealthy with my husband's income too, though we could not have been more miserable at times, infact we were much happier when poorer.

Money=reminder of painful emotions for me.