Relationship Readiness

[axa]

Hops,

There were many things about XN I did not like when I met him at first but thought Oh I am so judgemental, I am not perfect so I will have to put up with some difficult things in a partner......... wish I had held onto my judgement it would have saved me a lot of heartache.  I had been in another N relationship a few years previously and thought I could spot one a mile away but I do think that Xn had highly sociopathic tendancies, which he agreed with also.  The fact that he seemed so loving to his daughter convinced me that he was not an N.  Also, when I think of it all I can do is shake my head, he would always consult with me about what I wanted to do, check if things were ok with me etc............... he really fooled me.  Want to say never again but do not trust myself as yet to make that strong statement but working towards it

axa

[axa]

S&S

Thats smart I think,  Doing something similiar myself.  Really acknowledging the "bad" parts and then seeing if they are just lack of awareness or down right bad.. hope it works for us.

axa

[Hopalong]

One thing that eased my anguish at one point was reading that even brilliant therapists can be fooled by Ns until they're specially vigiland AND trained to spot it.

I think the danger for me was always in "interpreting" the good or charming or sensitive or considerate behaviors I'd see from a man early in the relationship. I think now I'd like to just see, oh, there is a behavior that is very positive, I am liking that. FULL STOP.

No concluding, assumptions, extrapolating: "Therefore he must be _______ (good quality I insert because I want to find it)." If I hang around him for 2 years and still can't spot it, okay. Then it might be a reasonable risk. But most of the Nmen I was involved with were in a rush, or I was, and there was never any respect on my part (or a shred of it on theirs, bed being the goal) for the absolutely necessity of a slow ambling pace and hugely expansive sense of plenty of time.

I believe that now. If I found a potential companion now or at 77, I will take my ambling time. Only pace that's safe for me.

I can't prevent an N from being a great actor. But I can prevent myself from responding like a fan.

Hops

[WRITE]

Okay, I'll work on my NO list tonight!

Hugs to everyone.

[axa]

Think I was always in a rush also, wanted to get into the relationship as if I was not whole without one.  I was so desperate to be part of a "happy family" that I ignored so much.  One thing I have identified is that I was always more concerned with how they were feeling and their needs rather than my own.  Felt to selfish to focus on my own needs.  Big lesson here for me. 

Oscar winning performances I have been involved in.  Once the tears start with the N I melt....... second last time I met XN he brought a toilet paper with him to mop up his tears LOL........ guess beware of men calling toilet rolls could be something I could add to my list.

sick and tired of the creeps..........

axa

[Hopalong]

Hey Axa:

Bravo. You've identified something so big:

One thing I have identified is that I was always more concerned with how they were feeling and their needs rather than my own.  Felt to selfish to focus on my own needs.

And you are learning how not to be a creep to yourself.

hugs
Hops

[CB123]

guess beware of men calling toilet rolls could be something I could add to my list.


Definitely, Axa!  That was the first thing I put on my list! 

CB

[Hopalong]

(((((S&S))))

Thanks for the kudos, hon.
Very heartening.

hugs
Hops

[WRITE]

I was always in a rush also, wanted to get into the relationship as if I was not whole without one.  I was so desperate to be part of a "happy family" that I ignored so much.  One thing I have identified is that I was always more concerned with how they were feeling and their needs rather than my own.  Felt to selfish to focus on my own needs.  Big lesson here for me. 

absolutely!

A relationship isn't just something perfect from day one, it's negotiated back and forth and makes or breaks depending how well each person can remain able to give and receive love in the face of the process.

I look back at my two serious relationships and they were just so fraught I buried myself in the other person and forgot about my own growth and development. Then got resentful when not only was I unfulfilled with my personal dreams- they didn't appreciate or respond to me how I anticipated either.

It's really nice now having the confidence to risk showing someone all of me and examine all of them, not trying to reach the goal of a relationship before I've been anywhere near the process of building one!

I've always been happier giving than receiving, leading than following, shouldering tasks which were way beyond me and almost broke me....I don't know when something changed but I feel now more able to be loved, able to listen to others even if they don't express it well, able to let go more and abandon myself to feeling happy and calm.

It's a wonderful feeling, every morning when I wake up I am glad to be alive, and safe, and comfortable. And it gets better, bad days are in context, they don't trigger shame or buried pain, I can ebb and flow with my relationships better and not fall apart if I feel abandonned or rejected.

And the nicest thing is that the people i am meeting now in terms of friendships and love interests are very positive and happy themselves. I guess like attracts like. My uncertainty and insecurity wasn't helping me connect with people who try on the whole to live a good healthy life.

Some of my relationships were even pressuring me to stay where I was and not deal with my problems.

Some of my friendships have ended, they've all changed. We don't just change ourselves but our whole world, maybe that's why we're so resistant to it at first, we sense there will be wider repercussions than weight loss/ therapy/ exercise/ spiritual growth etc.....

***

My NO list:

*carrying personal toilet roll ( thanks Axa! )

*poor personal hygiene/ no pride in appearance

*not good manners

*aggressive or abusive

*substance abuse/ drinker

*doesn't listen- especiall doesn't 'hear'

*closed-minded

*'player'/womaniser

May be a problem list:

*has any ongoing trauma or drama from past life

*religious belief clashes: no fundamentalism!

*cultural differences?

What have I missed??????

[axa]

Write,

What a good post.  Very uplifting.  Sometimes I think I am so damaged from a life of Ns that I will never be in a place of relationship readiness.  Also the fact that the wrinkles are creeping up daily does not help!!!

I remember when my daughter was really ill being so stressed, driving from the hospital to my home, an hour away and screaming until my throat hurt.  I felt so scared and alone in the world.  I remember crying and screaming "all I want is someone to put their hand on my neck and hold the weight of my head"  I knew then this was too much for me to expect.  Nobody was going to hold me with love and help me carry my burden.  I learned not to expect anything, even the smallest thing.  I am very suspicious even of the smallest thing and always wonder what the motivation of the other is, my gut always felt they just want something from me and of course my experience confirmed this.

I feel different now.  I know I am alone.  I know it is a better place than hoping for something which is not available.  I do not trust others but I am beginning to trust myself.  I have figured out, at last, that I am responsible for my own happiness and when I neglect myself I am saying I am not worth being happy.  I do not believe this any longer. 

I am glad you are attracting healthy people around you.  Someday I hope I have the confidence and trust to put myself out there for some form of relationship.  I find I am hyper sensitive and know I am seeing Ns everwhere.  But I am ok in many ways better than ever before and that is such a good thing to write.

My list

No toilet rolls
Nobody who tells me they will buy me a car on date 2!!!!
Honest
Grounded
EMPATHIC
Nobody who cannot make eye contact with nobody else except me.

This is too scary.  Think my list is going to take some time

Axa

[Hopalong]

What have I missed??????

comb-overs

 

Hops

[WRITE]

I know I am alone.  I know it is a better place than hoping for something which is not available.  I do not trust others but I am beginning to trust myself.

I was like this for a long time Axa, couldn't let anyone in.
Three years has seen a change though and I think in another three it will be different again.

Someday I hope I have the confidence and trust to put myself out there for some form of relationship. 

starting here and with a therapist is good and safe.

I lurked on this board for ages, then posted anonymously, it's a process to learn to trust again.

who cannot make eye contact with nobody else except me.

was that your experience?

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( )))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

I don't mind a comb-over Hops if it's got a decent kind fun guy underneath ( I can tactfully steer him to the hairdressers later  )

[axa]

Write,

Yep,  He would not make eye contact with anyone but me.  When we were together at first, people commented about how "shy" he was and how crazy about me he was.  He was always holding onto me, usually standing behind me with his arms around me and talking only to me.  I never saw anyone so smitten.  Now I understand that this was part of the grooming process.  His "shyness" was actually his complete lack of interest in other people, especially my friends as he they were not of any use to him.  And his overt attachment to me was two things, his inability to meet others in the world without a shield in front of him and his excessive love bombing of me so that I felt so secure and moved in with him quickly.

axa

[Ami]

I remember when my daughter was really ill being so stressed, driving from the hospital to my home, an hour away and screaming until my throat hurt.  I felt so scared and alone in the world.  I remember crying and screaming "all I want is someone to put their hand on my neck and hold the weight of my head"  I knew then this was too much for me to expect.  Nobody was going to hold me with love and help me carry my burden.  I learned not to expect anything, even the smallest thing.  I am very suspicious even of the smallest thing and always wonder what the motivation of the other is, my gut always felt they just want something from me and of course my experience confirmed this.

I feel different now.  I know I am alone.  I know it is a better place than hoping for something which is not available.  I do not trust others but I am beginning to trust myself.  I have figured out, at last, that I am responsible for my own happiness and when I neglect myself I am saying I am not worth being happy.  I do not believe this any longer
 

THIS is my big question. Axa realized that she was alone. Are we alone b/c we have N relatives and N issues or is this a "LIFE" issue? If this is a simple minded question--- forgive me        Ami

[lighter]

well I was hoping someone would comment on this, does this mean I am doing good or just so deluded these days it's not worth even trying to advise me? 

Hee.... to tell you the truth, I've sidestepped this thread like the plague, lol. 

I can't imagine getting involved, dating, accepting a drink etc EVER AGAIN much less rehash the finer points of mate selection.

For you, I'll try to remember some of the things I thought would be important while dating.

1)  In balance, spiritually, physically and emotionally

2)  Allows me to be myself and accepts me, warts and all

3) Lord let them have some kind of sense of humor

4) someone who wants to be with me,my family and isn't all the time thinking of other things they'd rather be doing. 

5)  Priorities are in line.  Children/family come first.

6)  I'd add this to the list...... no addictions that will drive me nuts.

7)  No scapegoating sociopaths.

  No criminals.

9)  No sociopathic criminals with a sociopathic Criminal Foos.

10)  No sociopathic criminals with a sociopathic criminal Foos who would do me and my children harm.

That about sums it up.....::nodding::

Lord..... talk about lowering one's expectations, lol.