N Spots

[Hopalong]

I don't think you're alone in asking yourself those questions, dear Carolyn.

I just think you're unusually honest, and ask yourself the hardest questions.

love,
Hops

[teartracks]

Hi Carolyn,

I think you're pondering whether or not empathy can fluctuate, be selective or even absent at times in the same person, even in nearly identical circumstances.  I think the answer would have to be yes.   A fresh off the press groom  suffering through one episode of near psychotic PMS from his beloved bride would testify in the affirmative, I believe.

This is not a real answer here...I'm just thinking out loud here.
   
tt

[Certain Hope]

Thanks for validating my ticket (((((Hops))))).

((((((tt))))))) thanks to you... I like your loud thinking. Good case in point, too.

Now if people would just stop tossing around alphabet soup and - as a wise woman around here said recently - get back to basics... ahh, blessed relief.

Love,
Carolyn

[teartracks]

Dang Carolyn,

Now if people would just stop tossing around alphabet soup

Did I miss a meal?

tt

[Ami]

For me, the topic of N spots is very helpful. I DO find myself in the place where so much of the unhealed stuff(FOO) wants to come rushing up and out ,now. THEN,it seems the grief can be processed.
 So, I want to talk about empathy. Maybe, my "zoning out" is from  trauma ,from my M.
 When I heard that Scott died, automatic numbness kicked in. When we have too much trauma ,as kids, a numbness(not feeling) sets in ,also. I think that is what I mean by feeling 'gray.
 The scary thing about it is that no matter what you do or where you go, it goes ,too.It has to be dug out by the root(IMO)
  I know that Scott did so many things, volunteered at so many organizations,and still the "gray"  followed him .Maybe, that is why I have such a passion to find it  and root it out.
  Anyway, my "zoning out" must either be a "normal" thing or something leftover from having to zone out with an N mother. Either way, I have to just put it in the box of "bad" traits,I guess.If it was an adaptive mechanism ,like  shock, after Scott's death, then I simply had to have it ,in order to survive.. So, it is NOT good or bad. It is just an adaptation that developed.Now, I have to just see it and not judge myself as "bad" for having it.
 I am still in "shock" after Scott's death. He still "seems" alive to me. I still am in denial, down deep.
 This zoning out must be the same type of "denial" mechanism ,which is automatic, not voluntary, as shock  is automatic,not voluntary.
 Maybe, the N spots, AND being an N, is automatic, too. WHO would want to be an N or have N spots?
  I became numb in my teens. I guess other things came with it that were not my fault. They "set" in ,like shock has "set" in, now.
 So, I guess I need to accept them as adaptive defense mechanisms and NOT good or bad.
  I know that what took Scott down was thinking he had "bad" thoughts. He thought that he was "bad" b/c he hated my H. He left a note ,which I can't find,now, that he hated and could not forgive his F.
 I told him that anger at his F ,or anyone ,was ok,but he could not see that
  I think that "normal" people let all this junk just go by and emotionally 'ill" people use it to judge themselves.
  Anyway,I would love to hear people's responses.        Ami

[Certain Hope]

Dang Carolyn,

Now if people would just stop tossing around alphabet soup

Did I miss a meal?

tt

Dear tt,

lol.. no. I'm sorry... that was just a bit of my own residual frustration at all the labeling-by-aphabetical-letter-assignation.
(is that a word? assignation? lol... only 1/2 cup of coffee today)

Anyhow, what really struck me hard last night is... so many letters, so many labels, so many defects and disorders...
what ever happened to plain old fashioned "sin"? And why is that "label" so distasteful?

Love,
Carolyn

[Ami]

I am SO glad that you defined the alphabet soup. I didn't understand what you meant and I was embarrssed to ask(lol)        Ami

[gratitude28]

Ami,
I am going to swing this around to the original post again as the subject has been tossing about in my head since you brought it up.
I believe I have actually gone from a person with N tendencies... to being on the other end of the coin. It may be due to age and experience, too, but I feel I have lost all of my edge (my beliefs I am good, smart, attractive, etc), and, although I know I generally fit into the categories, I feel that I am lesser than I have ever felt. Lately, I feel there are so many more intelligent, more special people than me... I almost feel I am an underdog. It is very strange to be on this end. I am not sure why I have gone this far in this direction. Also, I have a bad habit in that if I get praised for one thing,, I assume that means the person is really trying to tell me there is something else I do that he/she does NOT like.
I really think it is good to have some inflation of self (to know or believe you are really good at something). I am not sure I do any more.
Love, Beth

[Ami]

Dear Beth,
 You make a really good point that we need "enough"N traits(tooting our own horn). The flip side of N is little voice(LV) which is not good, either.
  I am so glad that people are responding to this thread . I am going to think of some more N spots, today.                  Love    Ami

[Overcomer]

Do you think that our N spots are developed after trying to counteract the N in our life??  I mean, I find myself on the counter attack.  I know I have gaslighted my mom..............pick up on her weaknesses and try to overexpose them.  I am in a war and the only way to not get annilated is to fight back.

So at our work I realized (not always but in the last five or six years..) that I understood the business BETTER than she did.  All my life she has been thinner and more  successful and more well thought of, etc.  When the realization came to me that she wasn't so smart and that she did a wonderful job of convincing people of how good she was without really being so good, THAT is when I got my N spots............I started to see myself in a different light.  I was authentic.  I was smart.  I understood this business.  Then I start thinking......................it is MY turn to have the light of fate shine on me.

CB said my N spot is being abrupt and outspoken..................my....."I'm mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore attitude!!"  I understand this now and I am going to try to humble myself and just do a good job and stop thinking I........I...........I

And I will also try to bring the sarcasm levels down.  The abrupt levels down.  And the outspoken levels down.  But I will be honest.....but not with a club.....

[Certain Hope]

Do you think that our N spots are developed after trying to counteract the N in our life??  I mean, I find myself on the counter attack.  I know I have gaslighted my mom..............pick up on her weaknesses and try to overexpose them.  I am in a war and the only way to not get annilated is to fight back.

So at our work I realized (not always but in the last five or six years..) that I understood the business BETTER than she did.  All my life she has been thinner and more  successful and more well thought of, etc.  When the realization came to me that she wasn't so smart and that she did a wonderful job of convincing people of how good she was without really being so good, THAT is when I got my N spots............I started to see myself in a different light.  I was authentic.  I was smart.  I understood this business.  Then I start thinking......................it is MY turn to have the light of fate shine on me.

Dear Kelly,

This makes sense to me, yes. If you have the perception that someone is always trying to "one-up" you (which often IS true, when dealing with NPD) then it's easy to get entangled in that same game, which stirs up feelings of anger and vengeance.
When N is going around trying to UN-do your words and actions, or heap them over with volumes of her own, this feels like it's threatening to minimize your person-hood... almost like someone coming behind you with a giant eraser for the sake of the glory of the Big N.
And that, I think, is where we can choose whether to respond in kind and develop N'ish tendancies of our own to play her ridiculous game - or simply stay on our own track and refuse to give her control by reacting.

What you wrote really helped me this morning, Kelly... and I'm taking it to work with me with resolve to remain on an even keel   Thanks!

Love,
Carolyn

[Gabben]

Ami,

Tonight I was reminded that we are to love others as we love ourselves.  It hit me like a ton of bricks.  I thought of some of the ways I have or do 'love'  others and thought, Is that the way you love yourself?  Big reality check.

Love,

tt

tt -- this has been hitting me like a ton of bricks too. I have been also thinking about do unto others has you would have them do to you.

Then there is also love your enemies with you whole heart.

I say to God: "are these my only options???"

God yes: "YES."

I say to God: - "but I do not have love in my heart for them and they have hurt me.

God says: "Fake it until you make it."

End of conversation.

[Gabben]

Yes, I have N spots.

Mother Theresa says "it was never about you and them it was always or only about you and God."


My nspots:

attention seeking
self-rightous anger and contempt
sarcasim
fear of what others think and attachments to opinions of others, however, I do not manipulate to get N supply.
magical thinking

There are more but that is what I can see about myself today.

Peace!

[Gabben]

So now I'm asking myself...  if I don't feel genuine empathy for particular people, why is it that I don't see them as vulnerable? Is it because I'm too angry with them to relate at that level? Or too afraid? Or... is it simply because I don't view self-obsessed people who never show a bit of authentic concern for me as an individual - to be valid recipients of empathy?  And if it's the latter, is that based on pride or my own self-preoccupied concerns?     maybe it's like being a friend. In order to have a friend you need to be a friend. In order to receive empathy, you should expect to have to give it... and not the gushy sort, either... the kind that's willing to get down into the trenches.

Wow --- yes Carolyn. I hear you. This board was the helper of me asking the question to myself how can I fully love myself if I do not also have empathy and concern o love for ALL others, even those I have felt hatred for.

That has been my lesson this year and for my life............I'm a slow learner


But the wonderful news is that I can see that N saint is the only person I have ever felt  hate for excpet my mom. I have prayed and prayed and prayed for her. I have blessed and blessed and blessed her.

It is starting to work. Lately I have been feeling compassion and pity for her. But then I stop and think, is that what I would want others to feel for me. NO. I want respect and dignity. So now my goal is to cultivate respect and dignity for her, not for her behavior, but for her.

I only call her N saint because that is how people know who I am talking about but I am going to post a new post with the new fake name of Rachel in order to treat her with dignity.

"And if it's the latter, is that based on pride or my own self-preoccupied concerns?"


Recognizing that all insults and injury's are really a matter of pride and ego. I am an adult now (well sorta  ) I can discern what is right from wrong, if some does wrong to me well then, they must just need a blessing or a hug. If they do really wrong and it will help them to hear my truth then I will work to find a loving place to use my voice and speak up, after I have stepped back for a while---------------we will see.

Peace

[teartracks]

Gabben,

Why is it that the simpler the truth, the harder to practice?  Frustrating, ain't it    I'm determined to master the art though.  How about you?

tt