Author Topic: confidence pill?  (Read 9598 times)

Anonymous

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confidence pill?
« Reply #15 on: August 05, 2004, 10:11:59 AM »
CG,

I take anti-depressants and being OFF OF THEM IS LIKE TAKING DRUGS. Being on them feels like normality.

The medications do NOT solve any problems. They aren't supposed to be "happy pills." They are there to help my severe high-strungness which makes it hard for me to function. I feel normal when taking them. Not happy. Not like everything is just fine. Only normal.

I think being judgmental about anti-depressants is very common. I resisted taking them for years because of my own negative judgments. But they've given me a normal life I never thought I'd have.

With that said, I don't think they are for everyone because some people have side-effects from them.

bunny

Dawning

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confidence pill?
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2004, 07:29:48 PM »
Thanks to everyone who has replied about meds and about confidence.  I'm planning to set up bi-weekly appts with this therapist and discuss other options to taking prozac.  

Bunny, your advice about taking reasonable action was a gem - I think so too.  Why I am so impulsive at times is a mystery to me.  Something to discuss with the therapist.  I wish I could afford to see him weekly.  

I found out there is an Ashtanga Yoga class in my neighborhood.  I hear it is more physical than Hatha or Iyengar (the other types I've tried) so I am gonna go for it.  The pain is getting manageable as I've allowed myself to feel.  But the anger is coming up now and it seems to be harder for me to deal with.

Phoenix, your explanation of the physiological connection with confidence was incredible interesting.  May I ask where you learned that?  I am really interested in liberating myself through the body-mind connection.  I think there is something there worth exploring.

Hi CG!   :)
Quote
Hey, did you get your bike back?


Nope, it was stolen while I was euphoric on the swing.  Think there is a hidden msg in that incident.    I ended up buying a new one.  Then, I lost the keys for a few days (yes, both key still on the same ring) but found them yesterday so could go unlock the new one.   :oops:  :roll:
"No one's life is worth more than any other...no sister is less than any brother...."

phoenix

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confidence pill?
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2004, 04:18:05 AM »
bye

phoenix

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confidence pill?
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2004, 04:33:38 AM »
bye

CG

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confidence pill?
« Reply #19 on: August 10, 2004, 08:47:31 PM »
Hi D. CG here  :D How are you going?
Quote


I found out there is an Ashtanga Yoga class in my neighborhood.  I hear it is more physical than Hatha or Iyengar (the other types I've tried) so I am gonna go for it.  The pain is getting manageable as I've allowed myself to feel.  But the anger is coming up now and it seems to be harder for me to deal with.

Yoga is totally excellent dude! What's Ashtanga Yoga? I do/did/do  :oops: Yoga (not as often as I'd like, spank myself with a feather  :D ). I found with so much to do I can't get to classes. So I bought a set of videos a few years ago put them on when I can duh uh  :?  remember.  Meditation and relaxation techniques calm the spirit/soul/mind/psyche/innards/gutbrain/whatever :?  Greatly!  


You said above, but the anger is coming. I've read here and elsewhere some good stuff about the purpose of anger, it's all part of the healing process. And anger can, yes can be positive. And, oh boy, but   :!:  it's such a yukky stage that needs to be worked through.  :(   So people often shut out/down at this stage because it's so awful. Who likes feeling angry?  :x  And it's such a very delicate stage, it's important to not let it completely control us so that we do things to make our matters worse and give ourselves more headaches to deal with and mess to clean up.  :oops:  I was talking to myself there D.  :D  

Sitting in anger :(  That's what happens with some people who've gone back to their old workplace after being fired, and with a gun.  :shock:  They go into those huge depressions, followed by massive anger and then just sit in the anger till TILT!  :shock:  That's extreme analogizing, but you know what I mean.
 
A friend in my early teen years (Mavis) had an awfully litle shrunken raging alcoholic mother who'd come home drunk and wake her up and abuse her late at night.  :(  In know cause I slept there a few times. Scarey. Mavis would be constantly in this cycle of depression and anger. All depressed and crying one day, then raging the next. And she'd be so angry at her mum,  :evil:  :( and sad for her mum, and loved her mum, and looked aftere her mum,  but couldn't show her anger to her mum. It was because cause her mum scared her. hell, she scared me.  :(

So then because Mavis couldn't get angry at her mother, she would find relief by cutting herself. And round and round it'd go again. Us, her friends would be there banging on the bathroom door because she was in there with a razor. She never did really big cuts. But lot's of surface ones though. Lot's of blood. Enough to get her admitted to hospital for a day or 2, and out of home for while. Then she'd seem okay for a while, and it would build up again. Extremely stressful stuff. Anyway, I'm kinda of topic now ans using an extreme analogy again, but the stuff I'm about to type out helped me (recently) work out why Mavis used to do it.

I was reading this recently from someone. A bit long but it's good stuff. About the healing process. I've sort of just taken a bit out of the middle for you, and you too P  :D . It's really good to understand the healing process in such simple easy to understand form.

Hey P  :arrow: over here, it's CG, talking to D.  :D  hahahahahahah

Here goes and forgive any typo's everybody. 'Typo' is my middle name.

Shock and Depression.

If all this is shocking to you, that's great because shock is the beginning of grief .  After shock comes depression and then denial.   Denial kicks our ego defenses back in.

It usually comes in the form of bargaining.  We say "Well, it really wasn't that bad.  I had 3 square meals a day and a roof over my head."

Please believe me: It was really bad.

To be spiritually wounded, for your parents not to let you be who you are, is the worst thing that can happen to you. I'll bet when you got angry you were told, "Don't you ever raise your voice to me again."

From this you learned that it wasn't okay to be yourself, and it certainly wasn't okay to be angry. The same with fear sadness and joy. It wasn't okay to touch your vagina or penis, even thought it felt great.

It wasn't okay to dislike the Reverend Herkimer, Rabbi Kradow, or Father Walch. It wasn't okay to think what you were thinking, to want what you wanted, to feel what you feel, or to imagine what you imagined.

At times it wasn't okay to see what you saw, or to smell what you smelled. It wasn't okay to be differnet or to be you

To accept and understand what I'm saying is to validate and legitimize your spiritual wound, which is what lies at the core of every wounded inner child.

Anger

The next feeling that usually comes up in grieving is anger. It's a legitimate response to the spiritual wound. While your parents probably did the best they could, in original pain work your parents intentions are never relevant. What is relevant is what actually happened.

(D & P  :D , that line above cured me of the constant 'whying' I was always driving myself nuts with. Why why why why why? I'd nearly drive myself nuts with all those questions that I could/would never get a straight answer to.)

Imagine that they were backing out of the driveaway and accidentally ran over your leg. You've been limping for all these years and you've never known why.

Do you have a right to know what happened to you? Do you have a right to be hurt and in pain over it? The answer to both questions is an unequivocal yes. It's okay to be angry, even if what was done to you was unjintentional.

In fact, you have to be angry if you want to heal your wounded inner child. I don't mean you need to scream and holler (althought you might). It's just okay to be mad about a dirty deal. I don't even hold my parents responsible for what ahppened to me.

I know they did the best that 2 wounded adult children could do. But I'm also aware that I was deeply wounded spiritually and that it has had life-long damaging consequences for me. Personally, I hold us all accountable. What that means is that I hold us all responsible to stop what we're doing to ourselves and to others. I will not tolerate the outright dysfunction and abuse that dominated my family system.

Hurt and Sadness.

After anger comes hurt and sadness. If we were victimized, we must grieve that betrayal. We must also grieve what might have been - our dreams our aspirations. We must grieve our unfulfilled developmental needs.

Remorse
Hurt and sabnes are often followed by remorse. We say "If only things had been different, maybe I could have done something diferent. "Maybe if I had loved my dad more and told him how I needed him, he would not have left me".

When I counseled incest and physical-abuse victims, I could hardly believe that they felt guilt and remorse about their violation, as if they were in some way responsible for it.

When we grieve for someone who has died, remorse is sometimes more relevant; for instance, perhaps we wish we had spent more time with the deceased person. But in grieving childhood abandonment you must help you wounded inner child see that there was snothing he could have done differently. His/Her pain is about what happened to him/her it is not about him/her.

The end of for the moment D.

With anger, we aren't meant to stay there, but we are meant to pass through it, have to to heal. And we're not meant to withdraw into denial and shame for feeling it. Sometimes our anger can frighten us. I know mine can.  :shock:  It can be so intense an scarey. That is a very good measure/indicator to use actually.  :D  

We can use it to assess the level of inner pain we are really in as a result of the spirtual wounding we suffered in our childhood.  And therein lies the challenge. Hahahaha. Got to use therein already. Oh, and so sooon too!  :D
 
Quote
Nope, it was stolen while I was euphoric on the swing.  Think there is a hidden msg in that incident.    I ended up buying a new one.  Then, I lost the keys for a few days (yes, both key still on the same ring) but found them yesterday so could go unlock the new one.   :oops:  :roll:
[/quote] Yeah, I read recently a recommendation not to jog or walk or cycle with a walkman on. Seems the baddies target people who can't hear them coming. Sad.  :(  Just best to have lot's of people around and swing in a busy place if you wanna swing and listen to your favourite music.  :D  And yeah, rememeber, always chain your bike up D.  :D Or it could get quite expensive replacing them all the time. hahahahahaha Yep, spare key on the same ring. hahahahahahahahaahhahaah.  :D

((((((D))))))))
 
CG

Anonymous

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confidence pill?
« Reply #20 on: August 10, 2004, 09:12:29 PM »
D, there's link I'm trying to find for you where you can get more of the original extract for free. But I'm having trouble finding it  :? . I think I need to do a computer course  :oops: .

CG

Dawning

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confidence pill?
« Reply #21 on: August 13, 2004, 12:33:20 PM »
Hi everyone.  

CG and Phoenix,

Thank you for your recent posts.  There is alot of information in there to process.  Still processing.   :)   Still reading it.

I mentioned at the beginning of this thread about a new therapist I am seeing bi-weekly.  I've only had one session so far.  Well, tonight, I went out with a friend and asked her how her hike went last week.  I was supposed to go but stayed home to work.  She mentioned some of the others that went and one of them was "a psychiatrist named ****" who "seemed a little creepy."   Yup, that's the same therapist I have scheduled myself to see next week.   :roll:   He has been supportive and sent emails inquiring into my situation; that was more than the other ever did.  But I would have been surprised to see him on the hike if I had gone.   Should I mention the very real possibility of us meeting at different group activities here when I see him next?  I didn't tell the friend that I had seen him and that he was the one who suggested I take the meds.  Any comments welcome.  Anyone ever run into their therapist in a social situation?
"No one's life is worth more than any other...no sister is less than any brother...."

Anonymous

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confidence pill?
« Reply #22 on: August 13, 2004, 01:45:38 PM »
Dawning,

This is what I'd do: I would tell the therapist that my friend saw him on a hike that I almost went to, and that she thought he was creepy. I would say that I would be really upset to go on a hike and see him there. And I would wonder aloud how we would deal with the two problems: one, boundary issues; and two, creepiness.

I would also ask myself if *I* thought he was kind of creepy and whether his emails were in any way unprofessional. (The answer to these questions might be no.)

I believe in telling my therapist my worst, most negative feelings about him. If he can't take it, then he isn't the right therapist for me.

Yes, I've seen a therapist in public places and I didn't even care. But I hike is different because you're isolated in a small group. Totally inappropriate for a therapist and client to be together in that setting.

bunny

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confidence pill?
« Reply #23 on: August 13, 2004, 01:49:05 PM »
Addendum!   :oops:

I can see how it's dicey to say my friend thought he was creepy because he may then guess the ID of your friend. So maybe you don't want to do that. But I would ask myself whether I thought he was creepy. He might not be. My H thinks my therapist is a wierdo by the sound of phone messages he left. I don't think he's a wierdo.

bunny

Dawning

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confidence pill?
« Reply #24 on: August 13, 2004, 11:05:40 PM »
Hi Bunny,

Thanks for the guidance.  No, I don't want to unintentionally ID my friend.

The best thing for me is to go into the sessions with clear goals of what I want to bring up and see how we go from there.   *However,*  I have trust issues - maneageable ones but they are there nonetheless.  Especially, after the last wet-blanket therapist....who I really did want to trust and I *believed* so strongly that she cared.  But she didn't.  So family-iar.  

My dilemma now is in figuring out how to not let my friend's opinion of the man she hiked with cloud my own personal judgement of him as a therapist.  Already, I notice my eyebrows raising when his image comes to mind.
"No one's life is worth more than any other...no sister is less than any brother...."

bunny

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confidence pill?
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2004, 12:20:52 PM »
Quote from: Dawning
The best thing for me is to go into the sessions with clear goals of what I want to bring up and see how we go from there.   *However,*  I have trust issues - maneageable ones but they are there nonetheless.


Can you bring up trust issues to him, and the fear that you'll see him in public and how would he handle it? He does have to earn your trust after all.
 

Quote from: Dawning
My dilemma now is in figuring out how to not let my friend's opinion of the man she hiked with cloud my own personal judgement of him as a therapist.  Already, I notice my eyebrows raising when his image comes to mind.


It's okay if your friend's judgment clouds your own opinion. You can tell him that you've started doubting him as a therapist. This is all grist for the mill. And it may turn out that he sucks as a therapist - better to find out now than later. I've had serious doubts about my therapist and almost left him a few times. Then he redeemed himself. I decided it was a negative transference and not him. But I had to consider whether it was really transference, and be honest with myself about it.

good luck,
bunny

Portia

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confidence pill?
« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2004, 11:08:50 AM »
Hiya Dawning. :D  Just popping to talk to you briefly. While I’m here can I say Hi to CG and everyone else? I’ll hope that’s a yes! Thank you in advance? Hi. I think D you may have the book that CG has wonderfully typed excerpts out of (way to go CG, can you type properly? I just use four fingers!). CG I love that section. But how I keep spiralling back and forth between the stages, each getting a little less intense with each revisit. Anyhows, I mean to spend a lot time thinking and reading the board and not posting too much. I hope.

But before I do, can I ask D, about the emails? I’m interested in protocol and what happens. He’s sent you supporting emails, asking about you. Is this usual? Did he say he would do this and did you say that was okay with you? And a really down-to-earth question, (this is really intrusive! :oops: ) how does he account for any email type support in terms of payment? I guess he might bill you for time spent writing, reading and replying? I’m just wondering, well, okay, a bit fascinated too! I’m always interested in what people do with their therapists, how it works. I mean, would you ever tell a therapist your name on this board and have them read sections? It seems natural that with a good therapist, one would. Or am I being too optimistic about the relationship?  :? Hmm. I’d like to think it was possible.

Anyway Dawning, I was reading recently how deciding on a therapist is one of the most important decisions in life, when you consider the potential benefits. A decision not to be taken at all lightly and one to base on intuition as well as qualifications etc.  Your money, time and energy are serious things to commit. It’s okay to question and be very choosy, it’s so important to feel a rapport of some sorts. And for both you and therapist to be rigorously honest! Listen to me,  :roll: I’ve never done it. I’ve just read about it! :D  Love, P

Anonymous

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confidence pill?
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2004, 11:19:07 AM »
I'm not Dawning but I'm going to respond with my experience.

No therapist I've ever seen has emailed me or allowed me to email them. However there are therapists who do email; if it's a psychiatrist, it may be mostly about the medications (guessing). Email is risky for a therapist so most of them won't do it. For one thing, confidentiality is a problem with email. For another, many things can be misinterpreted over email.

I have had phone calls with therapists between sessions and was never charged. I don't think any therapist charges for communication outside the room. It's considered part of the service. I think they would have to warn a client in advance if they charged for phone calls or email!

Finally, I would never tell my therapist my handle and ask him to read my postings here. Never. Reason one is that I don't want him on this group; reason two is that he probably wouldn't read the group (for confidentiality reasons) and then I'd be hurt! Reason three, I want some places that are free of therapists. I suppose a person could print out their own posts and bring them to the therapist.

bunny

Dawning

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« Reply #28 on: August 15, 2004, 12:08:11 PM »
I don't intend on EVER, EVER telling my therapist my handle here or anything about this board.  This is a place where I work things out in a group setting albeit online and the privacy and sacredness of this group is important to me and to others too, I imagine.  It never even crossed my mind that I would bring him here.

I might bring up things that come to light for me as a result of being here.  

Something else: I got an email from another person I know today telling me about this therpist, ****** ,that she's been seeing who is full of insights but doesn't have a very good couch-side manner.  Guess who that therapist is.   :roll:  

He did have me sign a disclaimer at the beginning.  Something about him not being held responsible for my behaviour or something.  Has anyone else had to sign a disclaimer?  He gave it to me right at the beginning before he asked me any questions.  I understand his motives....doesn't want to get sued if I go postal.  Heh.  But the other one didn't do that.  She also didn't make make herself available on the phone (only for rescheduling) and never did emails.  

I'm also careful about the content of my emails to him.  Of course, he has to earn my trust.  

Apparently, there are alot of therapists out there with all kinds of different approaches.

p.s.  In addition, current fellow gave out lots of info/worksheeets/paperwork at the first session.  He also wrote that email/phone support is part of the counselling fee and would not be charged extra.
"No one's life is worth more than any other...no sister is less than any brother...."

Dawning

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confidence pill?
« Reply #29 on: August 30, 2004, 11:15:31 PM »
I had my third meeting with new psychotherapist last night.  He asked me which of three routes I wanted to go but I didn't feel like he could accept my answers or questions.  We spent the entire session talking about the merits of prozac.  First, he was running late and I had to wait in the hallway outside his building.  That annoyed me since he exclaimed to me over the phone before we met that I absolutely *must* be on time and make the meetings at the exact minute of the agreed-upon appt.  So, why doesn't he hold himself to this exactness, I wondered.

If he wanted to push prozac on me, I would have appreciated knowing his true intentions.  Why ask me a question about which therapeutic route I wanted to take if he was not going to accept my answer?

As I said, this is only the third meeting.  As bunny said, he does have to earn my trust.  Basically, I feel that he has taken my openness about my history to make come premature conclusions without mention of alternative therapies.  

When I asked if he would still see me as a client if I decided not to take the drugs, he didn't answer clearly and I asked the question twice.

I told him I felt it would be important to get a second opinion and he gave me the names of other physicians that I could get a second opinion from.  Is that normal?  I thought when someone gets a 2nd opinion they get it from the *outside.*

What seemed odd to me is the feeling I had of his diagnosis that I needed anti-deps without an explanation that satisfied me.   My intuition is the biggest asset I have and talking with him was liking talking to my mother -that feeling of *my way or the highway.*  He seemed overly-persuasive (ie, using my honest appraisal of myself as a way to push these drugs...I mean, are they really that great?)  Maybe he gets a kick-back from someone?  He certainly was pushy.  

I'll be open to taking drugs but I need to know that my concerns are listened to and heard.  I feel like he has made a diagnosis of me (depression) too soon.  

I'd like to hear from others about this (yet, again.)  I would not be adverse to taking prozac but I don't want to take it forever and he seems to think that they are necessary forever (he used the analogy of a diabetic needing insulin.)  He also mentioned some possible side-effects:  that I might become paranoid or more depressed at the beginning.  Well, I live alone and the last thing I want is to *freak out* on my own with no support around me.  I told him that I didn't want to take them for a long time...just to help me make some major life decision and get me thinking more clearly about what I have to do to make them.  It sounded as if he wanted me on that sofa, in his office and on those drugs for the duration of my life and I definitely do NOT want that.  

Any comments would be most welcome.  Thanks.
"No one's life is worth more than any other...no sister is less than any brother...."