Virtual Emotional Support

[STFUP]

There is only one person that can be sure this isn't Phoenix..... and that's Phoenix.

That's all that matters to me...

[phoenix]

bye

[Anonymous]

you who doesn't see it now i suggest you to watch for it in the future. you will see the real thing.

It's already starting.

Yes Michelle , you should  get paranoid to, just like me.

See what is developing here Michelle (and silent others?)

Yep ,you can expect that everything I ever posted will be dragged up and used against me. That's why people who have been here before have kept silent. Busy little stinging bee.


And be alert  and be very scared for the diversionary tactics- new posters (look out for all new posters )  with quite dramatic stories. Now how will you know? You won't.

But consider it possible.

I have my own guidelines and

I have been pretty correct in using them,

watching personalities blow in , blow out.

Sorry,
I can't share what my guidelines are,
because I dont want to aid the creative writer in smoothing out their technique.

And if you are not sure, but suspect? I suggest just go ahead and treat everyone as real, it is the curteous thing to do, answer as you would normally. It is at the very least practice at putting your thoughts to paper, and someone else may be aided.Phoenix[/[/size]quote]

Yes, pheonix, we're all not only voiceless, but we're stupid too and it seems we're to be dependent on you to interpret our reality for us.

Oh, are you the boogey man pheonix? Why try to scare Michelle into beleiving she can't trust her own judgement. That's a bit off, I think. You say, because you can't share the secret of how you interpret. Have signed a coven oath. What is it that's so dreadfully secret? Are you reading tea leaves and ashamed of the weak source?

Pleeeze give us a break, and credit some intelligence to this board. Are you trying to scare everyone into believing you're smarter than everyone else and have some insight that we all lack? So we become dependent on you for the truth we believe and for you to interpret reality for us.

PUKE!    It was talk and obsessive behaviour like yours from people like you who caused me to need to come here in the first place[/b]

very angry guest[/size]

Hi pheonix hun, like talking to yourself and encouraging yourself, do you? You sure do a lot of it!   All your imaginary guest friends are out in full force still, I see.  

[allusedup]

i've just been thru legal and medical matters with my Nfather, and was thisclose to posting about it, and asking for opinions and advice from others who'd been there.

So I stopped in and caught up on this thread - honestly, at this point, with the meanness and vindictiveness, namecalling and just plain ugliness, how can ANYONE feel safe sharing?  

All I can figure out is:  someone is lying, I have no idea who it is, and I'm sure that there are many like me who would like some help, or to get things off our chest, and be honest.

But...there is obviously one or more people who are hellbent to destroy any safe feelings here at all.  I'd imagine there will be helpful people who will tell me to "go ahead, share, we'll listen, we care" - these aren't the people I'm talking about.  I believe them, but there are others who hog these threads, who sound so damned narcisisstic themselves that I might as well talk to my Nfather and expect to get some empathy.

WHO CARES ABOUT THESE ARGUMENTS?  WHY ARE THEY CONTINUING TO GO ON?  WHY ISN'T SOMETHING DONE ABOUT THEM?

In all honesty, it's difficult to "avoid" looking at these kinds of threads, because they're becoming very pervasive, and there seems to be several people who for one reason or another, would like to destroy this board for the rest of us.  I would not disclose or share anything about myself or my situation at this point in time if I was paid by the word!

I know it doesn't matter (in the big picture) if I disclose/share here or not...BUT IT MATTERS TO ME THAT I CAN'T....and for God's sake, I thought that was what this board was about, not attack after attack, childish name calling, accusations, and posts that sound the same as the abusive people that some of us are trying to find healing from being exposed to.

I know my contributions (both my opinions and my requests for help/support) won't make or break this board.  None of you know me, and I don't know you, but I have to be honest (this part of using my voice), this whole situation is making me SO SICK I COULD PUKE!  

I'm sorry for you who have to attack, accuse, lie, re-victimize, dehumanize, degrade, etc.  I thought, way back in Oct. of 2003 when I first joined under my original username, that I'd found a fairly safe place to ask for help, learn from people that were farther along in healing than me, maybe even try to support others....obviously I was wrong.

This has turned into one huge mud-slinging contest, and I am sorry for all of you - both the slingers and the ones that get hit with the mud - and also those who stand by and wonder what the HELL is going on here!

I thought this was a place to learn to HEAL for those of us who had been victimized by narcisists....lately tho, it seems like a place for some (and I'm not accusing anyone, because I have no proof nor a desire to accuse individuals) narcissists to play their games - maybe lack of supply in their own lives?  

I really feel that I belong on a pro-narcissist board - at least they're honest there.  I'm in no way accusing very member of "not playing well with othes" or creating abusive/offensive threads. What I'm saying is: I know it doesn't matter in the great scheme of things, but IMHO, this is getting just a BIT sick!

In addition, I think not becoming a member, and hiding behind "guest" or "anonymous" (again, I'm not singling out one person, because I know there are many "guests") is one of the most cowardly things I've witnessed here.  If people have accustions, attacks, or even concerns about what's going on, step up and identify yourselves. Usernames aren't even real names, membership doesn't give any of us any private info about you....quit being chickenshit and put your money where your mouth is.  It's so much easier to attack anonymously than to attack when you've identified yourselves, even with a made-up username.

bobbie

[Anonymous]

Hi bobbie
In addition, I think not becoming a member, and hiding behind "guest" or "anonymous" (again, I'm not singling out one person, because I know there are many "guests") is one of the most cowardly things I've witnessed here.  If people have accustions, attacks, or even concerns about what's going on, step up and identify yourselves. Usernames aren't even real names, membership doesn't give any of us any private info about you....quit being chickenshit and put your money where your mouth is.  It's so much easier to attack anonymously than to attack when you've identified yourselves, even with a made-up username.

bobbie[/quote]
I can see you're affected by this. I imagine a lot here are. I am too!   But to attack all guests as 'chicken shit' . Thanks   . A bit like kicking the dog don't you think?

[Anonymous]

Can I add, I love your tag. 1st Cor 13. My favourite as well. Might help to for both of us to remeber thtat one here hey?    And leave this wibbly wobly to fight themselves to exhaustion. Not everyone here is in this thread. And it is a supportiv environment if you stick to your own issues, I've found anyway.   Good luck and hope you're okay.

[Anonymous]

Let's continue to make this a great discussion place and continue to stand up for each other's right to have a voice and continue to believe each other's feelings as real.

[allusedup]

I can see you're affected by this. I imagine a lot here are. I am too!   But to attack all guests as 'chicken shit' . Thanks   . A bit like kicking the dog don't you think?

Yes, I really am affected by this. Reading people attacking and being attacked makes me sick, because I've spent my whole life being attacked, and thinking it was NORMAL, and because of extreme circumstances, like my mom dying last year, having to take over her role with Ndad and see how bad he REALLY is, having to deal with his bad heart, his diabetes, his Alzheimers, the fact that he physically attacked my sis and I the last time we did something to help him (take him to the cemetery to put flowers on mom's grave), have him verballly abuse my 3 boys until I finally put a stop to it by denying him any contact with them, not even being able to mourn my mother's death because sis and I are now responsible for Nhim, having medical problems of my own (chronic physical plus depression/anxiety) - YES, I am affected by reading this kind of sh*t in a place that's supposed to support just the opposite kind of behavior.

You're probably right - labelling every "guest" as chickenshit is like saying "all women are weak" or "all teenagers are punks".  Your point is well taken - however, when we have you, "Guest", and correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you're a "member", and then all the other "guests" or "anonymouses", first of all it becomes very confusing, and secondly, I wonder why anyone who's a regular poster here and is obviously contributing and involved in this board wouldn't just sign up, even if they decide to take the username "Guest"?  none of my business, just a thought.

Yes, because of the way I was brought up, and have lived my life for 49 years, my conditioning makes it repulsive to me (and almost physically sick) to see people acting in a manner that degrades other people; I also realize that my feelings are not the fault of anyone on this board - I also don't think my feelings are abnormal. I'd like to think most people would find vindictiveness and constant back-and-forth attacking and name-calling repulsive, but I may be wrong.

I want to make it clear that when I was saying unidentified and unidentifiable people are chickenshit, I was not referring specifically to you. Since reading your post, I've thought of many reasons why someone would want to remain nameless.  I can be the most chickenshit person in the world (I probably am) but i gave myself a username that describes how i feel right now, and i sign my first name on my posts.  My option, doesn't necessarily work for anyone else.   I NEED to name myself, in whatever fashion, because along with being voiceless for so many years, I've been "nameless",  "invisible", "ineffective", "impotent", "unimportant", "helpless", and "hopeless", etc.  To repeat, those conditions were not created by anyone posting on this board, but it creates a very strong feeling in me.

I know I'm coming on strong, and it makes me so uncomfortable to express myself this way, but I'm so upset by what I view as unnecessary viciousness I've jumped out of my own comfort zone.

I'm sorry if I offended you, Guest. I should have worded my opinion differently - the viciousness upsets me way more than people not identifying themselves, or sharing some kind of descriptive username. I apologize to you.

However, now that I'm out of my comfort zone, my next post will probably offend or insult many people, and for that I'm sorry, but I feel I must do it to express myself.  

I'm also aware that because of my own life situation, which is disgustingly repulsive to me, I'm probably over-reacting to the situation here. Believe it or not, I am working on my "misplaced aggression", but I wanted you all to know I am aware of this fact.

bobbie

[phoenix]

bye

[allusedup]

Sorry, this isn't the "next post" I was referring to - Phoenix beat me to the "submit" button - my computer kicked me off before I could post.  the "next post" follows this one.

Can I add, I love your tag. 1st Cor 13. My favourite as well. Might help to for both of us to remeber thtat one here hey?  

Fortunately, only my dad is N - that tag is what mom taught us, and tho she's gone now, you're right - I really do need to remember it and practice it. Hey, I'm luckier than some - only 50% of my parentage was a waste of skin, altho mom was partially responsible for the "dance" that created our sickening family dynamics.

 I'm sorry to have offended you personally.  I have no problem with you specifically, but I've never understood why some people contribute and are involved in boards like this, but don't join and identify themselves, even if their username is "Guest".  It just seems like  "hiding" to me - altho after reading your post, many reasons to remain anonymous and maybe not totally commit come to mind, many of them having to do with possible self-preservation.  It's also confusing to me to have "Guest", other "guests", "anonymouses", etc., but that's my problem, not yours.  I'm truly sorry for using you as "the dog" and kicking you - that wasn't my intent.

 And it is a supportiv environment if you stick to your own issues, I've found anyway.  

You may be right, but I have many fears, and one of them is: if i say too much about myself and my situation, the "game players" might join in.  I have no resources at this point to deal with that on a personal level, about my own stuff.  

Good luck and hope you're okay.

My sincere thanks for the good wishes. I would love to say I'm okay, but like many others here, I'm far from it.  Spent most of yesterday having such an extreme physical and mental reaction to my situation that I could hardly talk, and I was walking around as if I'd consumed a 5th of Jack Daniels - can't remember how many times I fell, but I've got bruises all over, took things out on my boys that they're not responsible for (which gave me a sh*tload of extra guilt, but I deserve that part), I couldn't even walk a straight line...and really, I wasn't drinking or drugging, I was just falling apart.

I'm also aware that I may be over-reacting to posts on this board the same way I over-reacted to my boys yesterday - because I don't take care of business in the correct ways with the correct people.  Believe it or not, that's something I'm working on with my therapist.  I just wanted to cop to that defect before my next post, as I'm afraid it may offend/insult people, which isn't my intent, but may be the result of what I have to say.  I'll also say I'm way out of my comfort zone here, and maybe that's a good thing, but by expressing myself in a confrontational way, I almost feel like I'm possessed.

Sincere apologies, Guest - I shouldn't have used you like "the dog" to be kicked.

bobbie

[Anonymous]

Sorry bobbie for what happened with you yesterday with your boys   . Sorry for everything you've just shared   . I wish you well. Let it reip bobbie. I'm sure you mean well and I'll keep that in mind when I read.  

[allusedup]

i guess once i get started, only a fist in the mouth will stop me....i just have some observations and opinions i have to get off my chest.  i've gone thru this thread, and seen some things that cause me fear and anger, and some things that reassure me (and yes, I do have a life - I just don't know how to live it yet).  I feel the need to quote them, but I won't use the "boxes" - my intent is not to criticize the writers of the particular quotes, but to express my reactions to certain words and phrases.  I realize that I haven't quoted complete posts, which ends up taking them out of context, but I again emphasize, this is MY take on things:

Phrases and wording that disturbed me:

- quit talkin' to yerself & take yer meds...
- Quite contradictory to this sweet & innocent pennin' over here
One word: DUPLICITY
- How BIG does the fire breathing dragon have to get for others to see? How could they not?
- Shame child- cryin' shame-- How long ya been round these here parts- girlie?
When it comes to P spew, I must be readin' the book and you must be seein' the movie or somethin', 'cause I can't get my head around the P your explanin'
I hear the masses callin' "here kitty kitty..." and when P burps, were gonna be mourning another...
- Portia 'aint no glam car--- she's a train---wreck
- Very much so but I am waking up to the fact that it's not. I feel like I'm in a fun house at the crazy mirror?
That she was ham-strung to go into battle. No, I don't believe that. For obvious reasons. She was here. Think I'll go and do some more reading before she does anymore editing of her posts which I noticed she's doing. The race is on.
- Only than can he create the appearance and illusion of security that soothes the savage egotist,that domination illusion/ manipulation,blame the person for thier own shortcomings and pain game that he uses to tell himself he is in control of the painful thoughts and feelings inside himself.
- Only than can he create the appearance and illusion of security that soothes the savage egotist,that domination illusion/ manipulation,blame the person for thier own shortcomings and pain game that he uses to tell himself he is in control of the painful thoughts and feelings inside himself.
- ...we're all not only voiceless, but we're stupid too and it seems we're to be dependent on you to interpret our reality for us.
Oh, are you the boogey man ********? .  Have signed a coven oath. What is it that's so dreadfully secret? Are you reading tea leaves and ashamed of the weak source?
 Are you trying to scare everyone into believing you're smarter than everyone else and have some insight that we all lack? So we become dependent on you for the truth we believe and for you to interpret reality for us.

Phrases and wording that feel like empathy to me:

-  If you are going to make huge accusations like that, I think the least you could do for the participants on the board is to make your facts that you based your decision on as clear as possible so that none of us are left in the dark. This also allows us each the opportunity to re-evaluate the situation and make our OWN decisions. Otherwise, it just seems like a vicious attack on someone that we all trust and enjoy. I have no reasons to think differently of Portia OR CG. Right now I feel these are feeble attempts to put doubt in our minds regarding these 2 board members in particular and add mass drama and confusion to the board. If you really want to make an argument - go for it. Toss in some facts and solid examples so that we can see the real issues you are talking about instead of the fluff.
-  One more question for you two - what are your motives? Are you out for blood here or truly trying to heal?
 - My post is to invite others who already feel bewildered, in the manner HUGC and I are, to question! question! question!
- I can't understand why you think you have the "right" answer on this and I still haven't seen you present any hard, undisputable evidence.
- I can respect your response, although I am still confused about the details of the accusations.
-  i'm a member here but am posting anonymos because in spite of what everyone says, there really isn't free speech here for sure. you get marked if you say what you think.
- I know the stability\safety of the board feels important to ya.
- There is not many havens in this world that exist that narcissists do not infiltrate.
-  You have to be willing to LISTEN to someone before you tell them advice,and if they don't want it,get over yourself....A person wants someone else uses advice or insult to tell someone else to not use thier voice to express thier own pain they are a narcissist ,emotionally immature,self absorbed know it all,or emotionally overwhemed..
- It is the narciusist who tries everything mindgame he can to stifle the voices of others he does not like to hear to make them silent or be a voice that sings his tune only..
- A bully cannot stand anyone else expressing weakness and pain around him because he is weak,in pain and so afraid of himself he won't dare aknowlege it is in his own heart too. So he lies to himself ,and bullies to keep up the appearance of self control and power
- PUKE!  It was talk and obsessive behaviour like yours from people like you who caused me to need to come here in the first place
I don't know anyone with that much time on their hands to post message after message, day after day, to go through all of those old messages and paste and quote.What a sick thing to do. That girl must have a huge inferiority complex, and no life

I know, taken out of context, it might be difficult to understand why I put certain statements in one "category" or the other.  That's one reason I didn't attribute each statement to its author, altho I know the authors recognize their own statements, and it's not difficult to figure out who wrote what.  

What I was after was the language, the "tone", the sarcastic cuts...or the calm requests for clarification, the civil requests for posters to take responsibility for their statements (not just criticize without backing up the criticism), the respectful comments and observations, the the remarks that validate, rather than disrespect, others.

No one has to agree w/me, many probably won't, and many more may not have the slightest idea what I'm talking about.  My "categories" are not meant to be judgmens, either - they are my OWN categories, and just about the way certain wording and statements make me feel.

probably time for me to take off now, i don't want to fan the flames, and i know ALL boards blow up from time to time.  I guess I was just disappointed that at one time I thought this was a certain kind of place, and now I don't - THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT TRUE - it's just the way i feel.

bobbie

[allusedup]

Sorry bobbie for what happened with you yesterday with your boys   . Sorry for everything you've just shared   . I wish you well. Let it reip bobbie. I'm sure you mean well and I'll keep that in mind when I read.  

Thanks, but there's no reason for you to be sorry, you weren't the cause of what I did, nor did you ever inflict any harm on me, but thanks for your thoughts.

I do need to apologize, because what I said, and the way i said it, was hurtful and insulting - no matter if i meant well or not.  you (or anyone else) can't know what's in my head or what motivates me.  all you can know is what i express, and i expressed myself in a negative way.

bobbie

[Anonymous]

I know I wasn't responsible, just lingo differences. I feel sorrow that you, another human being, fellow traveller in life, is experiencing such pain and grief and distress as you've described. I felt sorrow for you. And that as a result, your children experienced that too.

And hey, I apreciated your post. You made some good points. I found my comments are in both lists. That's okay. I'll whip myself later. "It's an emotive topic" is an understatment.

All the best to you, and hopefully things will calm down around here soon, and everybody can on with the job of healing. A lot of people are I've noticed. These couple of turbulent theads really are in the minority here.

Take care bobbie

Guest (just to be annoying)  

[allusedup]

That's okay. I'll whip myself later. "

Please don't!  The world whips us enough without us making a do it yourself project!      

Obviously I misunderstood a couple of your points: sorry/sorrow being one of them.

I'm also upset that my kids have to suffer for this. I know what I go through, and I can't even imagine what pain it's causing them.

If you found your posts in both categories, again, that may be a misunderstanding on my part.  that's a problem with reading vs. talking face to face. as we all know, the same words can be perceived differently in writing when the reader can't see if the person's affect matches their words, but when talking face to face, it's easier to put the two together (well, i've never been very good at it, but i was conditioned well, i learned to practice many many forms of denial, and mom took the brunt of things for sis and I - honesty in any form was not popular in our house).

so if i took your meanings incorrectly, or anyone else's for that matter, i apologize. i did not mean to judge, i'm just not that omnipotent.  i know i've written offensive things also, we're none of us perfect.

if i misunderstood any of the statements i listed, I apologize to those i offended.  i'm very raw at this point, and that's not an excuse to hurt people, maybe just an explanation of why i'm not seeing things clearly.

bobbie

PS:  and yes, calming down and getting on with the business of healing does sound like a wonderful idea, so i'm going to quit with the confrontational posts, altho i'd be happy to respond (in a calmer way) if anyone takes exeption to my previous posts or disagrees with me.

Thanks for listening/reading.

bobbie