Smoke and Mirrors

[Betelgeuse]

Dear all,

After a first series of postings I've fallen silent again and may have been forgotten by most of you. It's not what I wanted, I appreciated (and still appreciate) the thoughtfulness, insight and kindness of most members here.

I intended to post my story and share some of the difficulties I have to face in my life.

But something held me back, a growing sense of unreality.

I soon realised some members are not what and who they purport to be. Specifically, I noticed how a few posters seemed to be branches from the same tree, using similar word patterns (I'm a linguist) and following a similar modus operandi. Leah, Gabben and Lupita are one and the same person, I've no doubt about it. Gabben at one point added, then removed a picture very similar to Leah's, and Lupita's command of English is not consistent with being a Spanish-speaker.

I'm sure others have noticed this, especially since Gabben-Leah-Lupita (GLL) often reveal themselves as one person, hiding and showing at the same time.

Well, I decided I wouldn't let this bother me. Someone might have reasons to scatter themselves, who knows? It might even be an Art or Social Science project to create and maintain several personae. I often had a good laugh at some really OTT posts. So I decided not to worry about it, but check up on some back threads. Well... I discovered the same tree had sprouted other branches in the past, vindictive ones, such as ReallyMe who has been asked to leave, I believe.

THEN there was Ami...

I felt deep concern and sympathy for her. It's an unspeakable tragedy to lose one's child to suicide. I was a bit surprised she went back to posting about her mother so quickly after the event, but everybody is entitled to their own grief process. I said as much to her when, two weeks after Scott's suicide, she announced having found the love of her life. But I did wonder a bit, especially since there was a 'flatness' about her, and a quite remarkable contrast between her 'rambling' style and some really astute remarks. Very little reminiscing about Scott, hardly any mention of her surviving son. Shortly after the suicide she told us that Scott had killed himself with a gun he had picked up at her house that same day. Yet no or hardly any manifestation of guilt, not even when she said there had been talk in the family of a possible suicide before the event. Hmm...

[Betelgeuse]

Sorry, that accidentally got sent off before I'd finished.

Ami just doesn't seem real to me. She shares quite a few speech patterns with Gabben, I think they are one and the same person.

Does it matter? YES, it does! A few Stepford wives don't fundamentally alter a community, but if and when they take over a major part of the interactions, 'real' people with 'real' stories will get confused and lost in some twilight zone.

I don't know why anyone would want to create all these (and more) identities. It can't be for healing... I don't think we're dealing with a student prank either, the person is far too mature for that. I rather think the GALL person is an intelligent, middle-aged woman with time on her hands and a penchant for social engineering. Rather like Mary Shelly's recently discovered friend, a writer who published under a great variety of male names, falsified her ID (with Mary Shelly's help) so she could pass for a man, marry her gf and go off to live in France.

Well...

I can't be the only person thinking along these lines. Ye 'language people', Hops, Gratitude, what say you???

Bee

[Hopalong]

I don't have the same feeling about there being multiple identities from one keyboard, Betelgeuse...each person has always struck me as distinct. (Or when they weren't, Guest efforts were clumsy enough that Doc G twigged to it and sorted things out.)

Anyway, even if you were right, it's unprovable. Maybe it's partly a sense of strangeness that can come over one, almost like paranoia, when one is in cyberspace. A sense of, "I don't know you." It's almost easier to have that experience in cyberspace that it is to acknowlege it in the 3D world, when we're confronted with the "strangerness" of others or of ourselves, in moments where we're "outside".

Here, that might happen when affect is inexplicable, or various syndromes seem to be showing themselves, or when the written voice doesn't add up to someone we can easily visualize.

I majored in French Linguistics (was terrible at it). I remember that once we deconstructed language to a certain point, phrases fell apart for me. It was though instead of speech, words became math.

Do you think anything like that could be happening for you? And do you ever have suspicions about people in 3-D life?

This sure will stir up a cycle of fears and anxiety here, if previous cycles of it are any guide. But I guess you have a right to voice your unease.

Maybe the very best thing to do, Bg, would be to examine for yourself, the FEELINGS that surround your posts, rather than the objects/invidual/s you've ascribed the cause of them to.

What is it, about unease? Trust? Fear? Suspicion? Can you identify other times in your life that this may have surfaced? Has it always proved out?

Things like that...I would be glad to listen to. Speculations about identities here seem like a dead end to me.

best,
Hops

[Overcomer]

b g-If that is the case I will have been duped.  I know Dr G knows if  someone is posting from the same computer and has called people on it before.  We also have discussed where we are from.  I have had conversations with people in PM Land and their persona stays in tact.  If you are right then I will be surprised over the top!

[Betelgeuse]

Hiya Hops,

Thank you for your long reply (on the follow-up thread). You asked a few legitimate questions, which I'll try to answer as best I can.

I don't think I'm a paranoid person, in fact, in 3D I've sometimes regretted trusting people too far too soon. Occasionally I've had 'hunches' which I chose to ignore, much to my detriment. So I've become a little more wary, though not to the point of fundamentally changing my life-style (quite a few people have a set of keys to my house).

 I'm not used to cyber-interactions, I only started looking for groups in the past year (after a difficult life crisis). This board, as I said, felt good, until a measure of unreality crept in. My BS-detector went on alert, hence these posts. Of course, I may be mistaken, but I don't think so. I wanted to explain my discomfort and warn others.

I understand that for your part, the subject is not relevant.

A la prochaine,

Bee

[Certain Hope]

Hi, Bee,

No, you're not the only one thinking along these lines.

 I think that what you're sensing is not paranoia at all, but a very real phenomenon which is quite common across the web.

However, I do not think that it's necessarily a masquerade of the sort you've described.

Constant, prolonged exposure to certain input can create a form of brainwashing, in my experience.
For instance, if I sit around all day long and think about myself and my problems, or even read and think about others and their deep distresses, I know that I'm impressionable enough to take on some of that aura... and maybe even some of the mannerisms/style of the other folks involved.  I know this because it's actually happened to me, before I developed a strong enough sense of who I am to sit back and say, "Whoa!"

MY BS'ometer has sounded off plenty around here... and sometimes it has been very, very accurate. For that reason, I've found it vital to practice being as thoroughly real within my 3D surroundings as possible. In that way, I believe we develop an insulation, of sorts, to the online baloney which can really twist your gut if not prepared for it.

Regards,
Carolyn

[Hopalong]

I understand, Bee...

"Unreality" is a significant word, I do recognize that feeling in myself here at times, and I may be in denial. I'll never know.

I guess I have to take everyone at face value.
For me, a bigger revelation has been "believe what people tell you about themselves" rather than "find out what people are not telling you." That's applied most often to the Nish people in my life. In hindsight, there were always cues I rationalized or empathized away.

In some way, I think evidence is almost always present, but I've learned/been socialized to overlook my own intuition. I'm often seduced by the verbal and my discernment sucks.

Still, my assumption is to assume the best I can about everybody. I'd do better sometimes to entertain more doubts, and the more I become anchored in a positive vision of myself, and less dependent on a positive certainty about others, the better off I'll be.

I hope you find a way to stay and benefit from the board, doubts and all.

Hops

[Ami]

Dear Bea,
 I am not going to talk about me b/c it does not deserve a response. I want to say that Gabben IS Gabben. She is a real person, working bravely on her issues.
       Ami

[lighter]

Bee....

Very brave of you to speak your peace.

As for the board.....

I find a much improved posting experience when I limit the posts I read.

If I can't emotionally connect with a poster or find it a negative experience (in any way) to read their posts.....

I simply skip them.

Light







 

[Gaining Strength]

Yet no or hardly any manifestation of guilt, not even when she said there had been talk in the family of a possible suicide before the event. Hmm...

It's clear that you are insinuating something here but I can't figure out what.  Either you are suggesting that Scott did NOT commit suicide or that something is wrong with Ami because of her response or something else entirely.  If it is the former then you are wrong, there are articles on the internet reporting his death. If the latter then it is simply because you have no idea about the huge range of responses of people to severe, destabilizing devastation.  If you knew anything about how families respond to suicide you would not question her response.  When pain is so horrendous you don't function in predictable, rational ways.

Yet no or hardly any manifestation of guilt, What are you looking for here?  Why does she have to manifest guilt for you or for you to see?  That does not make sense to me.

[Betelgeuse]

GS, this first post was inadvertedly sent off before it was finished. You'll find the rest of it in the second thread with the same title.

Let's just say I notice things. That's what I do.

I wanted to share my perceptions because they have kept me silent and because I felt they might be of use to others.

I'll leave it at that.

Bee

[Betelgeuse]

Carolyn, I like your use of italics..

You and Light have given me some good advice here. Thank you

Bee

[Gabben]

I don't have the same feeling about there being multiple identities from one keyboard, Betelgeuse...each person has always struck me as distinct. (Or when they weren't, Guest efforts were clumsy enough that Doc G twigged to it and sorted things out.)

Thank you Hops -- I know that you and I don't always mesh well but I do appreciate you.

As you can tell, I'm not about smooching up to people to gain popularity....I just want to be real and I really am Gabben and Ami is really Ami.

I'm wondering who Betelgeuse is?

Lise

[Ami]

If you and I are one person ,Lise, it is interesting how one person can talk over the phone long distance ,to themselves(LOL)   Ami

[Gabben]

If you and I are one person ,Lise, it is interesting how one person can talk over the phone long distance ,to themselves(LOL)   Ami

Interesting....yes. (((((((((((Ami)))))))))))

I need a hug....I come online this morning  -- what toxic wasteland!!!!!!!!!!