My Mother - A Pathological Liar

[Gaining Strength]

I want to write about that experience of taking things personally. 

I had taken my son out to breakfast last week.  We have two breakfast places we like.  One is VERY inexpensive.  They don't charge for children and their prices are low as well, e.g. $1.30 for bacon.  We usually get out of there for under $7.  The other place has similar food but is expensive and we usually get out of there for about $20.00 for the same amount or less food.  We went to the more expensive place the other day.  As I was asking for the check I noticed that I began to get irritable and suddenly I saw it - I felt the high prices were taking advantage of ME.  I was taking their prices personally - even though I knew before I went there that they were expensive.  Completely irrational.

As a child, we lived what was then the high life, private schools, expensive clothes, ski trips to Aspen twice a year, a month long summer vacation in the mountains occassional "special" trips.  But I never had any "control" over the money.  I couldn't "ask" for anything but could only "receive" in a passive way.  THAT is the key description of my current struggle. 

In this role I became resentful of others who had things that I wanted - sort of a spoiled way.  Ultimately, what I have realized recently is that I developed a sense of standing outside the window looking in - waiting for life to happen, hoping, hoping - no control, out of control.  Then I saw that there is a switch that I can flip - FLIP - I can set MY sights on something and go for it.  That is totaly new for me.  I have lived in this passive role my entire life and it is humiliating to me and makes me angry.  Yet it is even still very, very difficult for me to flip that switch out of passive into pursuit.

[Overcomer]

We are speaking the same language.  I guess when you become accustomed to living the high life and then suddenly you are struggling and your parents have the means to help but they do not even acknowledge your struggles.  That with trying to get you to do more on top of your already stressful life.

[Gaining Strength]

Taking my power back - gave it to them because I didn't have a choice.  Finally understanding how to get it back.  It is not easy but no point in giving up.

[LilyCat]

SS,

It sounds to me that your dream was about "running out of gas" with your mother. I think it talks about you coming to terms with who she really is, and that you are close to being done with her -- or wish you could be, anyway. Your fears started getting stronger as you re-approached your mother. (Came back from the gas station.) All this must talk about your conflict -- feeling like you have no more to give, and/or don't want to, vs. the piece of you that still wants to "have gas." It is a very understandable conflict. It sounds to me like a dream that really hallmarks your progress and where you are right now. (As they all do, theoretically, but this one has that quality to it, especially.)

I think the second scene talks about that same conflict from a slightly different angle. You were with people who in theory were supposed to listen to you and possibly even support you, yet they were oblivous to your needs. You kept trying and trying to talk, but couldn't. You withdrew in frustration.

This sounds like a description of your relationship with your mother. Over the course of your life you've tried and tried to have a relationship with her, and to tell her about your needs -- but she hasn't listened.

Your son (in the dream) most likely represents you, your vulnerable self/child. Your inner child was wailing because she (he) was hurt and frustrated. You comforted him. (You.)

I always know when I'm dreaming about my own most vulnerable self when I dream about either of my two previous cats. They represent the little girl in me; the one most likely to be vulnerable and get hurt. It's an image that never fails.

Dreams are so interesting, aren't they?

Anyway, that's my two cents.

[Ami]

Dear SS
 I am gonna think about your dreams over the course of the day and write, as I get ideas. I have a few, now.In dreams,houses can represent the person and cars may, too. Your car is breaking down. You may feel that you are breaking down, emotionally and physically, with all the stress you endure and did endure, with your family. The gas station is interesting. You need gas(fuel for you, too) and it is closed. You can't get it, BUT the attendent has on a Tux. This is very unusual, so would have meaning. It might be the disparity between your parents wealth(tux) and the gas station(modest means).However,even modest means seems closed to you. You can't seem to get your basic needs(fuel  for your life) met.
 You started panicing about your M. You would not be able to pack(plan,manage) right and she would be angry. Then, you saw a solution, you could put her in another mode of travel, not with you. You could then take your car(you) home.
 How did you feel at the end of the dream? Were you distressed or at peace?

 I will think about the next one during the day.           Love   Ami

(((((((((((SS))))))))))

[sKePTiKal]

I read the 12-step meeting dream as one of taking back your power. Only you can choose to speak - and when - and how.
Not letting others determine your own healing path - telling you what to do - helps you find your own way.

It's messy, though... it takes a lot of practice, to do it in a way that doesn't frighten others (your son). But, it's also something you can quickly master, with lots of practice!

Yes: isn't it amazing? Even when years into our recovery, we can still find traces within us of the damage that was done, by our parents...

SS, I really think you're progressing at the speed of light these days! Sometimes, I know I don't see my own progress until someone tells me - then I can reflect & feel - oh yeah, that's a lot different now... remember to take the time to smell the "freedom", sweetie - it makes all the hard work, worth it!

[Gaining Strength]

I really thank you for your comments.  I have been slow to respond because I have been very, very down since this "experinece" with my mother.  I come on-line are read a few - very few posts and then have to shrink back into my cave. 

I especially appreciate the thoughts about my dream and the encouragement about where I am.  It helps so much.  It is so amazing what a difference it makes to actually get encouragement for what I am going through.  I can't help but imagine what life would have been like if I had lived with a family that actually encouraged rather than put down and belittled - subtly, very, very subtly and then denied that they put down.  Just like in the dream where if I got angry then I would be shunned but if I didn't then I would be belittled.  Those were the only choices I saw in life, I never saw the one where I could "rise above" and simply know that these people were not ones to value my gifts and therefore I needed to move on to those who would.  I always assumed that NOONE would value me.  That's the damage that I sustained.

I want to write about moving beyond this stuff, digging deep and re-membering my shaming experiences that are soooooo painful and getting beneath them and finding the real me.

This issue about taking everything personally is closely tied with a powerful battle I have against expecting the worst, and expecting rejection.  All of this is powerfully negative mental processing that has control over my life and derives directly from the lies that are my parents and were told me overtly and covertly about who I am.  Until now I simply accepted these lies - oh I cried about them and mourned them and ranted about them rejecting them or wanting to reject them but unfortunately not really - really I took them on and have lived them out. 

But this is the turning point in my life - at long, long last.  Finally I am at a place where I am finally rejecting the lies that are so deep within that even though I have railed against them I have taken them in.  Now I will root them out.  I think this "thing" about my mother will be a catharsis and has taken me deep down inside to the great, indescribable pain that I have lived with life long but have tried (unsiccessfully) to suppress.  It has been like standing on a refuse pile and pretending that the refuse is not there.  That hasn't worked.  That refuse was all lies and is nightmarish horrors about who I am and am not.  Those lies, that pile of refuse has NOTHING to do with ME.  It has only to do with the shame and self-hatred that my parents felt about themselves and projected onto me.  I took it.  They did not but I did.  But just because I did does not mean that I must continue to - Just the opposite - now I can dig up the refuse and stand on solid ground - a much different ground.

I think I will start another thread about expecting the worst and how it has manifested in my life.  This is my fervent battle beginning today.  In the two years since I have been here I have had several battles and each one was successful and that gives me extraordinary hope for tomorrow. So today I begin to overcome and destroy the lies that have come from my parents and which I took on.  No more.

PS - I feel guilty and self-critical for not responding personally to each post here.  I ask simply that you forgive me and understand that I am listening and appreciative.  I am not able to respond to each one personally for reasons that I don't fully understand myself but it is something about an emotional response that is very strong and for which words feel inadequate to convey.

[sea storm]

((((((AWWWWW SHAME SLAYER))))))))))))))

I think in your dream that you are the car that is running out of gas.  Your depression is the result. Giving mom the boot is very difficult.  I am no contact with my mother now and have been for about two years.  I just cant stand the pain and the confusion and mixed messages and I end up being the bad girl psycho to her. She is clueless and takes no responsibility for her behaviour. Even if she did take responisibility, she just cant see what is going on. Her lack of insight staggers me.  But it is just too painful. It is not a brain injury on her part but some sort of dissociative state. Whatever it is, she ends up making me feels horrible. If that is mother love, I cant stand it.  Does not feel like love to me.   

I havent spoken about it because it is too hard.  It is a powerful convention in every society to love your mother.  Trying to grasp that mom can't love back in a healthy way is not even described in literature very much.  It is about narcissism and envy and unconscious rage.  I see parents who are poisoning their children in insidious ways quite often.  There is no talking to them.  I just try to make a good connection with the child and model respect and caring.  I pray that these kids can get out of the spider web of their dissordered parents as quick as possible.  Just go.  Dont stop to water the plants or prepare or organize or soften the blow. Just get the hell out of there.

At the bottom of this situation that you face is a lack of trust in your own instincts. And no wonder. They were undermined, minimized , repudiated and scorned so often.   From your posts I would say that you have very good intuition.  Liars are impossible.  The person lied to ends up with huge, frustated, stifled, exploding, oozing rage.
Somewhere somebody said that honesty is the lynchpin of character.  So true.  I live and breathe by it and I have to be away from it

Thank you so much for sharing your story.  It really helps me to remember that although my mother has good qualities and can be so sweet and loving at times, she has been so unpredictable and disloyal that it has just horrified me at times. I cant do it and live.  That might sound like exageration but it is not. Sadly, she was so busy pitting her children against each other and setting them up to compete for her attention, that there is not much left of the family at all.  What a legacy. How sad.

Do whatever you need to do Shame Slayer.  Write all you want and can.

Much love,

Sea storm

[Gaining Strength]

Thank you so much for sharing your story.  It really helps me to remember that although my mother has good qualities and can be so sweet and loving at times, she has been so unpredictable and disloyal that it has just horrified me at times. I cant do it and live.  That might sound like exageration but it is not. Sadly, she was so busy pitting her children against each other and setting them up to compete for her attention, that there is not much left of the family at all.  What a legacy. How sad.

I really get this.  It is so hard - even here - to write about and make sense of a mother who "claims" to love but who has no concept of what love is.  She still doesn't get that you can't lie to and about someone day in and day out and still love them.  There is actually no relationship when everything is a lie.

[sKePTiKal]

Very good work you're doing - you're sounding very strong & fearless!

I think you might be able welcome all the pain now - and WERE able to take on the overwhelming pile of refuse - because you have the capacity to love - deeply. You CARE. (they can't/couldn't)

And this will help you see that the pile isn't nearly as large as your capacity to love - yourself, your son - and yes, even your pathetic parents... this caring will make short work of whatever is left in that pile.

that caring will get you to the other side where perspective changes and things can be let go... permanently.

Thinking of you, my friend. I know you'll finish this soon.

[Gaining Strength]

My mother and I are now communicating via e-mail.  (We have never done this before but my brother suggested that I do this so that she cannot twist my words around anymore.)  She e-mailed asking my son to spend the night tomorrow night.  I replied and BCCed my brother (part of his suggestion is that I copy him on all correspondence to and about her). 

She called him and told him that she had invited my son but that I had not replied.  He was able to tell her that that was not true because he had received my reply as well.  She went on to tell him that I had not returned her phone calls -

Anyway.  He has communicated to her that she needs to see someone to help understand why she lies so much to me.  I told him that I don't even need her so much to STOP lieing as I need her to admit that she is lieing when I confront her.  She apparently has finally admitted it to him.

[Ami]

Dear SS
 You are facing the truth about your M's type of "love".I am having to revise the concept of love. It hurts so,so much. I am so sorry you have to go through this type of pain. It hurts so badly,like childbirth. I am here,SS, and going through the same thing.               Love   Ami

(((((((((SS)))))))

[Gaining Strength]

My mother invited me to her home for a church gathering tomorrow night.  Normally it would be something that I would do.  But I have thought about it and decided not to go.  I have not been with her or visited withher since she decieved my brother and me about her psychiatrist's appointment.  She and I have been through this 3 times now.  This is the third time since my husband died that I got fed up with her lies and said I would not have a relationship with her unless she got help.  She understood that to mean that she could go see someone without me and that would be OK.  I gave in the first 2 times - not this one.  This time she knew that my brother and I intended to go and she made sure we would not find out when the appointment was.  She - by nature of past experience - thought this would pass.  It has in the past.  I have been clear this time that it would not.  - No problem - she is persistent.  This is what I just e-mailed her.  She calls me and I e-mail her and BCC my brother - his idea.  Now she can no longer get away with saying that I have said something other than what I said.  She has already tried it with my brother and he corrected her and when she persisted he told her that he was looking at the e-mail I sent.  I know it is typical N behavior but that doesn't make it any better.

Dear Mother,

Thank you for inviting me for the Home Eucharist at your house tomorrow night.  I have thought about it and decided not to come. 

I believe that until we have actually seen a professional together or as a family that if I decide to participate in your life you will simply decide not to follow through. 

In the past, when I have confronted you about lying, you have done the exact same thing and then just waited for time to pass.  By coming to the eucharist at your home on Wednesday it would be just doing the same thing that we have done in the past and nothing gets done about the problem.  In fact you have not yet even acknowledged a problem.  That would be a start.

Thank you.

Here's what I sent last Thursday and have received absolutely NO acknowledgment:

i want to let you know that I truly hope that you will
be willing to see someone about our relationship. I miss you but I must tell you
that whatever the dynamic is that causes you to view me as your enemy has caused
a real rift between us.
 
I know that you claim to love me but it really is impossible to truly love
someone you view as your enemy.  The very need you have to lie to me so often
destroys any trust and any ability to have open and honest communication which
love depends on, real love anyway.
 
It would be a tremendous start if you could begin by acknowledging that you have
lied to me, if you could be specific. That would help tremendously.  Just pick
one - any one.  I truly hope you can.  Love,

I would love to have some feedback.  What do you think?

[Ami]

Dear SS
 This is my honest feeling. I think the e mail was fine ,direct and well stated. However, I think that you may  have hope for HER to change(or it sounds that way) and I am afraid that she will not. I could be wrong. With my M, she SEEMS to change and own things, but it is not real. It is a mouse getting out of a trap. Later, she does the exact same thing b/c she has not changed b/c of internal convictions,but b/c she was  trapped and  is trying to extricate herself from the trap, only.
 That is my 2 cents.    Love   Ami

[James]

SS....You have read my letter to Alice Miller and her reply, maybe the same thing is going on here with your mother and you want her to "understand" you. IMO this is a futile effort, as she will probably never understand. I am giving up more and more this approach to people and if they don't understand I don't struggle anymore with them, I move on to people who do. In many ways I have given up on my parents for good. They never will care to know me, mostly just use me to abuse or use me for their own needs. I am facing the type people they are and refuse to be around it anymore. It's painful at first but I feel so much better knowing that I accept what I feel and find others who do understand me. As Miller said it becomes a lifelong and never ending struggle with your parents, to make them finally understand you and it won't work....James