Intervention

[debkor]

There was an intervention today.  It didn't go well and I didn't expect it to.  There were two professionals, my friend, myself and her mother.  There was confrontation and she refused all help.  I told her she is not welcome in my home, to call me, or anything other if she refuses the help.  She refused.  I can't help her.  She will not take responsibility for herself. 


Thats it.  I'm done. 


The pros gave her numbers if she changes her mind.  They were done the meeting was over.  They looked at me and said..don't 2nd guess yourself, don't enable, let her go.

And I did.

Feels like a death in the family.  In some way it is. 

It was sad, it was soft, it was gentle tone  but it was real.  She said goodbye Deb and I said goodbye think about using those numbers and the door shut. 

Love
Deb

[Logy]

Deb,
I'm so sorry for your pain.  It's like a cancer.  You hope for the best and prepare for the worst.  And in the end....you have absolutely no control. 

You did all you could do.

[Gaining Strength]

(I erased what I had written because it was only to let you know that i have great compassion for you and your experience.  I wanted you to know that I have been in a similar place and I am thinking of you.  Thank you so much for you kind words about your son.  That is so encouraging.  It is always shocking to experience the self-absorption of someone whom we care about.  Thinking of you - GS.)

[debkor]

Hi GS and Logy,

GS thank you for sharing your story.  I can assure you that your S will be alright and deal with the loss of his F because he has you.
I had two children  (might as well been a death) although he (their) F is very much alive and they came out alright. 

My S was bothered more as a child then my D because of being male.  All the other boys had dads.  They had F's day, sports, etc.
He didn't know what to do, what to say, but every other F, uncle, even teen age boys took him under their wings. 

He wanted to make up lies.  Can I tell them my F is in Calif.  He was in jail.  You can tell them anything you want.  It's not your fault.  It's not our fault.  It's not even his fault.  He is just sick.  You do and feel as you need to.  And he lied.  As he grew he told truth.  He coped with it as he could as a young child.  He's a man now and I'm proud of him.  He turned out just fine. 

His heart will heal and I can only imagine what your S or my S really felt for I had a F in my young life.  My S is 23 now and some of the fathers he had seen of his close friends (all being adult young men now) found out that although they were at sports, seen, many of these boys are comfortable to say...even though you see my F I never really had one other then him just being around.
Even one of his friends said to me last year and I was shocked....do you know what a narcissist is?  I said yes I do.  He said I believe my father is one.  He never cared about anyone but himself.  This was a man who you would have thought was daddy of the year.  Two boys  my S and his friend one father seen and one who was not ...but both missing out of their children's life in one way or another and both boys coping as young children as best as they could.  They are grown and both fine now.

My S has bonded to his friends.  He loves them as family.  He really bonded with friends about the age of 12 and at 23 has the same ones.  He found his way.  They found their way.  And so will your S.

As far as my friend I did all that I could do.  Only she can save herself.  I can't do that.  I do feel peace and I feel closure.  I have pain but not as I have had. 

In the intervention (she lost her children) they said...You or your children.  If you want your children then you must do this.
She made choice to give them up.

It reminded me of Dr Gs row boat...She put them in the water to drown and saved herself.   Oh well me or them...ME...myself and my drugs.  Save herself? Ha! Did I really say that?  She does not seem to even be alive.  She is imitation of life. 

It was a hard confrontation and she never shed a tear not even for her children.  One of the workers said ..I shouldn't say this but you should be ashamed of yourself and she didn't flick and eye, not a tear, not uncomfortable, nothing.  I think 'm getting mad as I write. 

At one point she said all I have who is my family is my b/f and my children.  When she was told choose you or your children her next words were  all who is my family is my b/f. 

Can they make choice.  Yes sir they can. 

Love
Deb

[Twoapenny]

Deb,

My mum chose her BF (now her husband) over her children.  What's that saying about you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink?  I've a friend who is maybe a bit like yours; she's two children who don't live with her and who have minimal contact and she's just had a third.  When she told me she was pregnant again I thought why?  You have two kids already, why not concentrate on being a good mum to them?  But she likes having babies so she went ahead and did what was best for her, not for her kids.

You've done as much as you could and been a good friend in the process.  I've had to walk away from several people in my life, for similar reasons.  I hope her kids are getting some help and support.

Hugs to you (((((((((((((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

[debkor]

They are with thier father now (the girls) but the S stayed with the GMther.  They have support and are getting professional support. They come back here every weekend to be with thier GMther and  brother, friends, and people they know since birth.
They have lots of comfort, laughter, and to just be silly, funny, and be themselves..kiddos.   They are in contact with everyone on facebook, by phone, and in person.

They are looking forward to warm nights, the TV outside, scary movies as soon as it's dark, popcorn, tension being built up on whats going to happen in this next scene, parents sneeking around the side of the house and scaring them....they love it.  I love it, we all love it.   

Adults running and screaming in day time of them scaring us running with water balloons watching us fight to get into whatever door we can find open falling over each other laughing so hard..how could you trade that off?

 

[lighter]

(((Deb)))  I'm so sorry this is so tough.

So sorry.
Mo2

[debkor]

I have not been on for a bit.  The intervention worked.  For us.  It has been over a month since.  Friend is in rehab since yesterday morning.  Until yesterday she has spent a month at my home.  She had no home, car, kids, money.  This was a decision that was family made.  We offered her the help with some very hard rules.

She is I do believe N besides being pill addicted.  Number one rule was  No drugs.  Number two...going through detox if there was medical assistance needed she would be taken to the hospital.  I would not subject myself or my family to this. 

She detoxed.  It was not as bad as it could have been (I say this because I was not the one going through it) I'm sure it was horrible.  She being who she is thought that rehab would magical open up and take her in that moment.  It was one month till that happened. 

My main concern was my family.  They wanted to do this for her.  At any time we could not or did not want to handle this we would not.

During this time it was very difficult for her to be here.  She hated it.  It was not difficult for myself or my family.  I was always aware of anything of change I could see possibly going on emotional with my family. 

There were enjoyable times as well.   As it goes (leaving the drug addicted person) and the person...there was N.  The N part not only did I handle but my children handled as well (without any anger) they just said no...

Now when I say it was so very difficult for her to stay here with my family I mean that.  We were kind and treated her well but she could not take over.  She did try.
She would be shot down immeadiately.  She was made to be responsible for herself and her actions.

At times taking care of herself some of her actions would be as a child.  She would text message everyone that would listen and cry the blues.  She would cry when she didn't get her way which would have been that we would live in her house (change our ways to accommodate her).

One time when she was crying my D came to me and said she wants you now (I was on the phone) she is crying.  I left her cry.  When I hung up I said my show is one and ignored her tears.  I'm not cold I just know the tactics.  I left her be.  So did everyone else.  Within a half hour..you never know...it was the same...I need attention person.  She didn 't get her way.  She wasn't acknowledged for what she was trying to manipulate out of everyone.

She hade real hurts/tears/truly needed support and we all gave her compassion but did not enable her when she do what N's do.  Before the drugs she was still N.  I do really believe this but I'm not a Dr.

She would try to turn people against each other (the manipulations) and maybe she did but in this home ...she could not. 
We didn't even get mad when she tried. 


We knew what she was doing and just ignored her.  We, my family know she was sick and sicker then  sick at this point.   Was it difficult I can honestly say No not for us.
Very difficult for her though.  I did feel sorry for her because it was like living in hell for her by living by rules. 

She did respect us. We did respect her. She on the other hand would (I would imagine) would think we did not by not giving her her way and letting her run the house, the people, and everything in it her way.

To describe what it was like living in the same roof I would have to say in short words....Like having a trouble teen age child. She hated having to take care of herself and be responsible for herself.  Did she have choice?  Yes she did.  The street or be responsible.  She did make choice. 

She is in rehab now.  I wish her well.  She is responsible for her life.  I could see though (close up) she does not want to be.  She did hate doing it and being here.
It was hardcore to live here (for her).  We live a normal life, we are individulas, we all are responsible for ourselves (with exception of my 15 year old) but even he is responsible for his actions and owns them. 

There is one thing she said reading something on the net to me.....You have good friends that tell you good things and do good things and then you have real friends who tell you the truth. 

Do they know...yes they do.  That was the only acknowledgement I have ever seen....and not directed but directed.  They know.


Can they control thier behavior?  Yes they can.  They can't change who they are but they can control behavior or manage it.  So can we.  She hated to do it.  It made her cry but she did it.  She made choice and it was not to be in the street.  She went by the rules.  She had to be reminded many times....your crossing a line...and she go back to respecting them...not liking it...but doing it.

She needs to grow up.  Will she?

Don't know.

So that's that.

Love
Deb

[Hopalong]

Oh, Deb.

I am awed by you.

Truly.

love and respect,
Hops

[seastorm]

Dear Deb,

Such a powerful story and you lived it with grace and strength. You really care for this person and care so deeply. Getting her to rehab was a happy outcome but maybe not the end.  Rehab doesn't change the essential character of an N.
Maybe we need interventions for people who keep trying to change the N. I know this is a harsh thing to say. But I said it.
Saving people can take you down the river of no return. Breaking the rule of intervention was a risky thing to do. It involved your whole family. They learned something from it. Maybe they arent as strong as you are.  These ways of coping with an N take Herculean effort and complete vigilance. And that is just coping. It is not changing.

Some people will take you down, no matter your good intentions or how smart you are. They are just predators.
You challenged yourself to take on this addicted N but you never really win.
Rather than say I think it is great, I wonder why you broke the rule of intervention. It made what people said empty. They were speaking from their hearts.

Blessings to you,

Sea storm

[debkor]

Hey Sea,

The intervention was not broken.  This took place in March.  She made choice of her drugs, we made choice of  no drugs.   We let go and let be.  She did not have our support, our friendship, her family....

In April  she came to me asking for support.  She had a d&a counselor, meetings, and awaiting a bed in rehab.  She left yesterday.

It wasn't broken Sea...

She took herself to rehab we just are supportive of this. 

I want to address what you wrote about having intervention for people who keep trying to change the N.  I'll start it on another post.

Love
Deb



   

[Gaining Strength]

You know Debkor that I admire what you have done.
Just want you to know that you have my support.

Sea - I see  what you are referring to.  When I first read Debkor's post I thought she had taken her friend in even after drawing limits at the intervention.  But on 2nd reading I understood that she only took her in after she agreed to go to rehab while they awaited an opening for her.

There is a delicate balance between supporting one another and holding each other accountable.  Both are important aspects of true friendship.

[lighter]

Wow, Deb.

What an incredible family you have.

I'm amazed at how well you guys handled the situation.

Thanks for the update.

Mo2

[debkor]

17 days of rehab an in the door she walked.  It was completed thought (which seems a little to quick)but ..wadda I know.  She had a horrible rash and complained of stomach pain.  Off to the hospital she went but failed to tell them she was just out of rehab and they gave her Perks in IV. Today another trip.

An hour or so ago she called my D on her cell phone (which was odd) to pick her up.  I heard my D saying but if you have your car it's because they don't want you to drive.  My D hung up and said ...Come with me...They will not release without a ride.  They won't let her drive her car because of the meds they gave her.

[debkor]

Sorry did it again.  I'm not use to using my finger with lap top and hit things before I finish.

So anyway.....  You don't try to use or manipulate my children. 

She had planned to be released to my
D and get in her own car and drive (on heavy duty meds).

My D walked into her room and I behind my D.  I spoke to the nurse and said she can't drive her own car?  No she can't.  I looked at my friend and said your coming in mine.  She gave me attitude and said she was not.  I told her...I'm tired...I'm leaving and either you getting in my car or your staying....she did more lip.  I turned and walked out said lets go (L) my D.  I stopped at the nurses station and told them I will not take her she has no plans of getting in my car I will not be responsible for her but she does have plans of getting in hers as soon as she leaves.  She came behind me saying (something) which at that moment the nurse called security to escort her out to make sure she got in my car.  I told t hem it would not be necessary if she agrees but her mouth kept going.  As I was walking out I said you need to call someone to stay at thier house.  You can't stay with me (but at this time) I was willing to take her home let her collect her belongings and just leave...she said...OH DON"T YOU WORRY I PLAN ON IT ALREADY....so when the doors opened to the waiting room I turned to security and said..Thank you I am leaving now she will not be coming in my car...she will have to call someone else to pick her up.  I said lets go to my D and we left.

Did I feel bad leaving her there?  Not one bit.

She could cause a terrible accident or kill someone and she tried to use my D........Big Mistake!

I don't even have any words for her...don't care...just want nothing to do with her. 

Love
Deb