Learning, Growing, Changing, Moving on, Moving Forward

[Twoapenny]

Hey Tupp... I totally relate to the always busy, to only stand still. My hubs was the total opposite - and even wore his "laziness" as he called as a brownie point or badge of "suthern honor". But when the laziness turned into not feeling well...

On my side of the spectrum, I started using 2x2 post it notes: my "list" for a day to fit on that post-it (and it had to be legible, too!). So, only 3-5 things "to-do" -- outside of the normal housework chores of living.

Now, even that plan is evolving. Part of my day is spent doing one or two paperwork things. And then, the rest is spent on physical work - either the sorting, organizing, purging or outdoor clean up. (Depending on the weather.) Immersion into one or the other to the exclusion (that day) of the other kind of "work"... feels wrong; so doing a little of both is helping me feel like I'm not neglecting one or the other categories.

I'm finding similar, Skep, I've honed my to do list down to four or five tasks and I'm being more realistic about how long things take and spreading jobs over several days instead of beating myself up for not decorating the entire house in three hours flat   It's funny how it makes a difference psyhcologically - I feel great today because I'm 'ahead' of my list for the week, just because I've written less on it.  I can see how I was creating work for myself but often not actually getting anywhere.  I'm wondering if it's anything to do with being disconnnected (for me, anyway) - if it's been a way of avoiding thinking about things and avoiding things that bring about change (which is often painful).  I don't know - I'm finding I'm thinking a lot as I paint, it does free your mind for other things! x

[Meh]

Things really don't fall apart when you stop making a to-do list. Ironically it was after things fell apart that I quit making a to-do list because it was no longer a priority.  Somehow the most important things we always know what they are list or not.

[Twoapenny]

Things really don't fall apart when you stop making a to-do list. Ironically it was after things fell apart that I quit making a to-do list because it was no longer a priority.  Somehow the most important things we always know what they are list or not.

You're absolutely right, G, for me it's definitely a control/anxiety type thing, my therapist used to tease me about having so many lists I needed a list to keep track of them.  I do think my need for control is reducing, albeit quite slowly

[Twoapenny]

I'm wondering if my personality is too bland or unobtrusive?  In the last week I've had a friend visit and leave the house in a mess because he didn't clear up after his child, another friend brought his dog and left the house in a mess and someone rang me yesterday and left a message on my answerphone saying that they were just ringing because they were out of the house and they had some time to fill.  I just feel like I'm invisible sometimes, and unnoticed.  If we get toys out at a friend's house I put them away again.  If my pet made a mess I'd clean it up.  I can't imagine telling someone I cared about that I was ringing them to fill up some time. Feels like a basic lack of respect?  I just wouldn't do that to others.  Sometimes I feel like the only one I have a really good relationship with is my cat

[Hopalong]

Hi Tupp,
This is so way out in left field it probably belongs elsewhere...and it's about romance, NOT friendships.

But I was reading it because I talked with someone who has OCD, and when I just read your last post, something wobbled in my brain and I wondered if there might be an anxiety or OCD component to your feelings of upset and anxiety about lack of reciprocal connection with others. (Not a "diagnosis"--just connecting with the anxiety beneath it I think.)

(All of which I can often totally relate to. I remember decades when I was microscrutinizing everyone, and in hindsight, I think it was fear. Of abandonment. Of invisibility. Of not mattering. Ultimately of not being loved.)

So for what it's vaguely worth, thought this article might ring a spark or two:
http://ocdla.com/rocd-relationship-ocd-myth-of-the-one-3665

love to you,
Hops

[ann3]

I'm wondering if my personality is too bland or unobtrusive?  In the last week I've had a friend visit and leave the house in a mess because he didn't clear up after his child, another friend brought his dog and left the house in a mess and someone rang me yesterday and left a message on my answerphone saying that they were just ringing because they were out of the house and they had some time to fill.  I just feel like I'm invisible sometimes, and unnoticed.  If we get toys out at a friend's house I put them away again.  If my pet made a mess I'd clean it up.  I can't imagine telling someone I cared about that I was ringing them to fill up some time. Feels like a basic lack of respect?  I just wouldn't do that to others.

Hi Tupp,
This is what I glean from your post:  Perhaps you are suffering from "Nice Girl" syndrome? Do you feel you must always be nice, even when others treat you not so nice? 
If "yes", I'd say try some assertiveness. 
Example:  The kids left a mess:  So, speak to your son about cleaning up messes before his friend(s) leave.  Also, when your son's friends come over, speak to them, in the beginning, about any mess they make, they must clean up before the friend(s) leave.  So, 30 minutes before the friend's parent arrives, call a "clean up" time and help the kids clean up, even make it fun, like a game.

Re: the friend w/ the dog:  Next time they call, tell them (in a very nice way) that you would prefer that they not bring their dog because the dog left a mess last time.  That should open a discussion about the friend cleaning up their dog's mess.

Even better, next time a dog or a kid (or anyone) creates a mess for you, ask them right then & there to help you clean it up.  Ask them nicely and after all, this is a reasonable request.
If they refuse, do not have them back in your home.

Re: the phone person, just tell them it's not a good time for you to speak, can you call them back? 

Just my thoughts, toss out whatever doesn't work for you.

[Twoapenny]

Hi Tupp,
This is so way out in left field it probably belongs elsewhere...and it's about romance, NOT friendships.

But I was reading it because I talked with someone who has OCD, and when I just read your last post, something wobbled in my brain and I wondered if there might be an anxiety or OCD component to your feelings of upset and anxiety about lack of reciprocal connection with others. (Not a "diagnosis"--just connecting with the anxiety beneath it I think.)

(All of which I can often totally relate to. I remember decades when I was microscrutinizing everyone, and in hindsight, I think it was fear. Of abandonment. Of invisibility. Of not mattering. Ultimately of not being loved.)

So for what it's vaguely worth, thought this article might ring a spark or two:
http://ocdla.com/rocd-relationship-ocd-myth-of-the-one-3665

love to you,
Hops

Hops, thank you, I had a quick read through the first couple of paragraphs last night and some bits did ring bells so I will sit down later and have a good read through, thank you.  And yes, not mattering is a big thing for me, I don't feel like I'm at the top of anyone's list and I find that very hard.  I do have some friends that I know care about me a great deal and I am really trying to focus on them more but they live a long way away and my day to day contact with humans is so limited that I find the loneliness distracts me.  But will keep chipping away at it.  Also realised yesterday that I'm quite tired at the minute and this sort of hypercritical stuff does come on more when I'm tired (I'm like a toddler who's missed their afternoon nap and gets all crabby at tea time ).  So I'm planning on some rest and me time over the weekend, recharge the batteries a bit and stop feeling so frazzled.  Thank you xx

[Twoapenny]

I'm wondering if my personality is too bland or unobtrusive?  In the last week I've had a friend visit and leave the house in a mess because he didn't clear up after his child, another friend brought his dog and left the house in a mess and someone rang me yesterday and left a message on my answerphone saying that they were just ringing because they were out of the house and they had some time to fill.  I just feel like I'm invisible sometimes, and unnoticed.  If we get toys out at a friend's house I put them away again.  If my pet made a mess I'd clean it up.  I can't imagine telling someone I cared about that I was ringing them to fill up some time. Feels like a basic lack of respect?  I just wouldn't do that to others.

Hi Tupp,
This is what I glean from your post:  Perhaps you are suffering from "Nice Girl" syndrome? Do you feel you must always be nice, even when others treat you not so nice? 
If "yes", I'd say try some assertiveness. 
Example:  The kids left a mess:  So, speak to your son about cleaning up messes before his friend(s) leave.  Also, when your son's friends come over, speak to them, in the beginning, about any mess they make, they must clean up before the friend(s) leave.  So, 30 minutes before the friend's parent arrives, call a "clean up" time and help the kids clean up, even make it fun, like a game.

Re: the friend w/ the dog:  Next time they call, tell them (in a very nice way) that you would prefer that they not bring their dog because the dog left a mess last time.  That should open a discussion about the friend cleaning up their dog's mess.

Even better, next time a dog or a kid (or anyone) creates a mess for you, ask them right then & there to help you clean it up.  Ask them nicely and after all, this is a reasonable request.
If they refuse, do not have them back in your home.

Re: the phone person, just tell them it's not a good time for you to speak, can you call them back? 

Just my thoughts, toss out whatever doesn't work for you.

Ann, thank you, yes, that's very me, I do struggle with being assertive, particularly spur of the moment assertive, if that makes sense?  If I know I'm going to encounter a situation in advance I can prepare for that and practise a bit and I find I can do that quite well, but spur of the moment stuff I do struggle with.  I do find as well that I've spent so many years masking my feelings that I do have a really good poker face; my emotions and feelings just don't show (unless, as one friend told me, it involves being asked to share cake, which she says is the only time she's ever seen a look of horror on my face, lol).  Unfortunately I don't play poker, perhaps I should learn as it's probably a good idea to put it to good use.  But I think that's part of the problem as well, I always seem fine and not bothered and don't give any indications that something's annoying me.  I might try practising looking annoyed in the mirror later on   Thank you x

[Twoapenny]

I'm trying to get into the habit of meditating each day now, which I did after I answered the other posts this morning.  I just pick out whichever one I fancy from YouTube and I tried one this morning that's for deducing anxiety.  The picture I got in my mind while I was doing it was of a little girl that no-one wanted, who kept waiting for someone to come and get her but no-one ever came.  I felt like one of those dogs you see at rehoming centres who's been there for years because no-one wants him.  It made me feel incredibly sad, but it also made sense of the way I feel now, like I don't matter to people.  I hate it when my phone doesn't ring all day (which happens a lot) because I feel like no-one in the world had an urge to speak to me all day and that makes me feel incredibly lonely.  So I feel a bit of inner child work is called for.  I've abandoned my usual habit of caffeine fixes and sugar to help me rush through the day and have retreated to my bed with healthy snacks and herbal teas, to rest, sleep, read and think.  My boy is busy doing his own stuff at the minute and happy to be left to his own devices so I am making the most of the opportunity to look after myself and make this a 'looking after baby Tupp' weekend.

I did want to say thank you to all of you, and to you, Dr G, for being here and having this place.  I wouldn't feel safe or comfortable talking about some of these things anywhere else, whether online or face to face, anonymously or otherwise, and it does really help me to be able to write this down and to feel safe doing it so thank you all so much for giving that to me xx

[Hopalong]

Me, too.
Loneliness.
Phone rarely ringing.

I think Facebook is part of it. Folks migrate there for their daily humanity and we don't give each other our voices anymore.

(((((((((((Tupp)))))))))

Hops

[Dr. Richard Grossman]

I did want to say thank you to all of you, and to you, Dr G, for being here and having this place.  I wouldn't feel safe or comfortable talking about some of these things anywhere else, whether online or face to face, anonymously or otherwise, and it does really help me to be able to write this down and to feel safe doing it so thank you all so much for giving that to me xx

Hi Tupp,

I feel lucky to "know" all of you.  Through the years, this "place" has gathered wonderful people, and it has been an important part of my life.  So glad you're here!

Richard

[Twoapenny]

I did want to say thank you to all of you, and to you, Dr G, for being here and having this place.  I wouldn't feel safe or comfortable talking about some of these things anywhere else, whether online or face to face, anonymously or otherwise, and it does really help me to be able to write this down and to feel safe doing it so thank you all so much for giving that to me xx

Hi Tupp,

I feel lucky to "know" all of you.  Through the years, this "place" has gathered wonderful people, and it has been an important part of my life.  So glad you're here!

Richard

Thank you, Dr G   It's good to be here.  It's so kind of you to run this and let us all loose on it as well

[Twoapenny]

Me, too.
Loneliness.
Phone rarely ringing.

I think Facebook is part of it. Folks migrate there for their daily humanity and we don't give each other our voices anymore.

(((((((((((Tupp)))))))))

Hops

I'm sorry that you know that feeling too, Hops.  It's strange, I know so many people, and they're all happy for me to visit them or join them on nights out and so on.  But they don't initiate contact and I can't go for nights out very often as it's difficult (and expensive!) to get someone to sit with my son for the evening.  And then I resent spending money I struggle to afford to go and be with people who can't be bothered to phone or come round to me one evening instead and so I don't go.  I have been going to the meditation group and I enjoy that but I've also found that I'm so used to be alone now that I find the company of others quite tiring - the effort of making conversation seems to take it out of me more than it used to.  And I find I'm not interested in other people's day to day stuff, or their problems, I feel like I only want to share with the few people I feel very close to?  I'm aware I've cut myself off to a certain extent, I just feel quite dead inside a lot of the time, but full of longing as well which is odd.  My sister came round yesterday afternoon and when I opened the door and saw it was her it was all I could do not to groan.  I love her but she just talks about herself and all her problems the whole time and I'm just not interested.

I tried getting into Facebook thinking it might help but I found it quite annoying and lots of people I would prefer to forget kept popping up so I abandoned that idea!

I don't know how we change the situation of getting people to want us?  It's that feeling of someone wanting me that I miss, just for the sake of me, rather than because they have a problem to get off their chest or something they want me to do.  But you can't force other people to do things and I feel that I don't want someone to ring me because I've moaned about being lonely, I want them to phone because they want to.  I might have to try some sort of mind bending or something and see if that makes any difference xx

[Twoapenny]

Meditating again, this morning I got an overwhelming sense of anger at my dad for leaving me.  Unfair and illogical as my mum got a court order to get him evicted and then he died a couple of months later so it wasn't his choice, obviously, but I still felt incredibly angry that he left me.  After he died I used to think up all kinds of stories and scenarios that would explain how it had all been a big mix up and he'd turn up unscathed.  I used to sit out by the side of the road on a Sunday, which is the day he used to come down to see us, and wait for his car.  One day a car just like his came over the hill and I remember jumping up, I was so sure it was him.  It wasn't, of course, he'd been dead for months by then, but I can remember that feeling as I leapt up to wave to him and then realising it was someone else driving past (even though the man in the car was waving back, but I didn't know who he was).  I think that's where this feeling of waiting to be rescued and so desperately wanting someone to want me enough to come and get me comes from.

Anyway.  Cried buckets.  Feel very tired, but in that way that you do when you've let something go.  There's the most beautiful sunset this morning.  Seems very apt. x

[Hopalong]

Awwww, Tupp.
I'm so sorry for that horrible abandonment.
And your mother, by being so unkind, abandoned you too.

I wonder if you isolate yourself or find it hard to trust/connect
because you are carrying on the orphan feelings as an adult?

I was no orphan but I do feel so scared and alone at times.

And you're on your own with a huge parenting burden that nobody
helps you with. I can't imagine how hard that is sometimes, to feel
that "unhelped."

I admire you a lot for your persistence. The rest, the emotional
healing and calming...I feel sure it will come for you in time.

You're going through an awful lot right now, and anticipating a
huge change you're going to go through on your own. It takes
a lot of courage and you've got that!

hugs
Hops