End of the Road Farm

[lighter]

Yes yes yes.... Holly will have to process in her own time, in her own way, for her own reasons.  Backing off is just right, IMO.

About it being cooler out.... it's been nice working outside in the drizzle, or in between downpours.  The moss is super thick, and happy.... like a carpet.  I've been tidying up borders, and picking up sticks and branches..... trying to stop pulling weeds, as I plan to poison with a sponge once it's dry and hot enough. 

I look forward to reading about your progress at the farm, Amber. 

Lighter

[Hopalong]

Zing...zing... edited to show how I relate... Oy oy oy.

That's one of the things that was painful trying to work on the relationship with Matt B. He kept trying to "correct" and "improve" [me] to his liking - [my] self.

Bless her, bless him, bless you.

May everybody learn and keep on loving themselves, let that love point the way to healing.

Hops

[sKePTiKal]

The sky has been crying all weekend. It's wrecked my driveway, since the ditches should've been cleaned out last fall. I put it off. And we're having one of those REALLY wet years here. Flooding is a problem all over the county.

There's been a kind of 180 in the Holly & Matt situation. She had brought the dogs out here with her, since they're cooped up in the house while they work all week. Had to take them home. And she & Matt talked; a GOOD TALK for a change. He talked to someone professional over the weekend who suggested they attempt to work through the break-up together. Logistically, it makes sense to me. And after this weekend, I'm pretty sure Hol's strong enough and solid enough in herself to successfully do this. We both have reservations about Matt. BUT... he finally saw his way clear to tell that he hates her, because he loves her so much. This is the first authentic statement he's made in this situation. It's not much... but ya work with what ya got. And he thanked me for my idea for his 40th birthday party in October. That could STILL work out, if they can part on peaceable terms.

I realized I'm taking this almost harder than Holly is. Matt's been a part of my life for 9 years too. And he's stepped up and helped out in some tough times. Additionally - she doesn't need me anymore. (She says she still does, but in reality - no; she's fully grown up now.) She's got the situation completely in hand - even with her feelings - and she has some amazing friends. Maybe it's triggering the old Mikey feelings; losing him. So I'm binge watching Outlander this afternoon & evening. The story of the relationship has always been close to me and I have a real soft spot for the scots. And the strong bond between Jamie & Claire always bring the tears. It'll be a good release.

Holly sounds pretty happy about this turn of events, so I warned her about making herself vulnerable via hope. I needn't have worried - LOL. She'll be keeping a sharp eye out for a return to habitual characteristics. But this is something that pleases her.

[lighter]

Amber:

I'm glad Matt saw a professional, and admitted his feelings of hatred, as well as love, towards Holly.  Validation of our experience is a powerful thing.  A very heeling thing... it explains why Matt behaved the way he did towards Holly.  It brings clarity, IME.

Matt will likely push to save the relationship, as it was.  It's too bad that's the likely reason he finally went to a therapist.  Not bc she asked, years ago, or bc she was suffering, and he was the cause...but only bc he's lost something, he's suffering.

IME a couple working through a huge issue can make them stronger, but I've never seen a couple successfully work through hatred towards a partner.  I've seen them remain friendly, to a certain degree, but the hatred, and old issues, always popped up when things shifted out of friendship,  and back into romantic territory.

They'll both learn a lot, no matter what happens.

Sorry about all the rain, and your driveway Amber.   It finally stopped raining here Friday, and I had the most glorious day in the yard Sunday.  Just beautiful.

Lighter

[sKePTiKal]

They're still going to break up Lighter. It's just not going to be "uproar style". The love/hate thing seems normal to me. Love is big enough to absorb those moments when you hate the partner - as long as they are "moments" and not a constant, repetitive feature of the relationship. After 9 years of trying to get to that "aha moment"... they're just not able to.

I've been really thrown for a loop by this change. Been supporting a (seemingly growing) list of ill online friends, widows, and now this... I finally realized I am just too sensitive still to losing people I care about in my life. Or watching them go through things that it's impossible to comfort them in. Feelings are just too exposed and raw right now. I end up hurting right alongside of them. That just isn't good for me...

So, I'm going to do my "turtle thing" for a little bit.

[lighter]

Amber:

Sorry you're struggling.

Lighter

[sKePTiKal]

It's hardly a big deal Lighter. Just something I'm recognizing - and know what to do with it. I can't fix everything for everyone. No matter how much I wish to.

Taking a day off of looking at the mess the rain has made here - if I can get the Cherokee out. Run some errands over the mountain and hopefully get back before today's rain sets in.

[Hopalong]

Turtles rock. Turtles hold up the earth. Turtles are wise and deep.

I think you were really wise to recognize how deeply you identified
with Hols' situation (sub-surface) and how that affected you.

I totally get it. How could you possibly live what you've lived, love the way
you love, and have the knowledge you have...and not experience her situation
in a personal way?

I'm glad you're retreating a while to heal your own pain. And leaving your
strong daughter to heal hers, however she negotiates her transition with Matt.

GOOD going, you.

hugs
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Thanks Hops.

[sKePTiKal]

Turtle woman is starting to peek out of her shell. I finally actually RELAXED and slept well last night. It required a couple of home made "remedies" for sinus/pollen/barometer rollercoaster rides... and one of the beneficial "side effects" is turning off the anxiety centers in the brain.

Anxiety, I'm almost positive now, blocks chi. And you can toss worry into that category too.

But it appears the waters (every kind) are calming a bit... so still continuing the self-care focus for a bit. Meanwhile - delayed work awaits. The grass is so tall in the garden field, that it could be baled. Seriously - it's almost waist high. That should make mowing it "fun" - and require two passes at that - but it HAS to get done.

[sKePTiKal]

Hmmm.

Seems Holly/Matt have chosen to do this the hard way -- ie, maintain a friendly respectful but still breaking up situation. Except Holly has noticed he's kind of working his way back into - well, if I'm just nice to her so she stays, then it can go back to what it used to be. She's been working hard all week winding up the production stages - and will likely have to work Monday too. So, there's a weekend where they can really talk. She's going to suggest an overnight at a friend's cabin to be somewhere OTHER than home to talk.

What she wants is a lot more independence and time off from the "same old same old" to determine - each of them - if they want to try to seriously work through their impasses. The summer would give them that space to decide. And it's not like they wouldn't talk; or even see each other during that time. Just in the space of last weekend, I watched her resettle into her "Holly-ness" from the various roles she maintains at work and at home with Matt. She has some serious depth to her and will most likely address her feelings for Matt in excruciating detail. I won't be privy to any of that until she's processed it into coherent form.

I think she's probably at the point, that this is now about her and her choices... and less about being the only one doing heavy lifting in a relationship - and not having much to show for it at the end of the day. So until I hear otherwise, I'm "doing" what needs "doing" by myself around here.

[Hopalong]

Sounds like a good approach to me.

Being "best friend" to your child in this, her adult situation, and hearing every blow by blow might set you up for more destabilizing enmeshment, which you don't deserve. And can hurt you.

No unnecessary extra pain for Amber, is da rule.

Why can't we all have our own Carolyn Hax to drill us on boundaries???? I need her reminders over and over, it seems. (So nice that she's available....)

xxoo
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Well, it's INTERESTING Hops. Holly and I are really close. No doubt about it. But she became independent, at an earlier age than normal... for periods of time. She would move back home for months too, until she finally got her own place, by herself, at 18.

My T knew her from tai chi, as well. And when we were working through the boundary issues... I was worried precisely about enmeshment. Her comment was that Holly was so strong in herself, that I shouldn't worry about her at all -- in that way. And Hol and I have talked about it in detail at length... and we're both OK with the way it is. She knows I worry about her... and she reminds me that she's 40. LOL. I really don't have a thing to worry about with boundaries and Holly. She's been telling me to F off and mind my own business for so many years... and I say OK... and we only "analyze together" when she's trying to identify all her options or is afraid her perception is skewed one way or another.

Same with me; turn about is fair play between us. And yes, I chafe and squirm under that kind of "helpful comments" too. But we can do it, and keep on rockin' & rollin'. She was the toddler with temper tantrums; serious tantrums... and waited to really start talking. And when she found out that I could talk her through the intense emotional moments... if she talked to me... till the "waters calmed", she quickly internalized that as one of her "superpowers". She only very rarely shows that intensity to people... it freaks people out. But not mom. I let her vent it all, only saying enough to show I'm actively listening and getting what she's saying... and then she engages rational brain again on her own.

I was very young then, when we figured out how to do that. Before she talked, and during a tantrum, I just hugged her real close and absorbed the energy until it was spent. The comfort of that touch and security helped them go away completely. I guess I instinctively knew what to do because that was how I needed to be mothered. And wasn't. She would be fine in a short amount of time... and we'd go back to whatever was going on... as if it was completely normal. In time, she managed those times herself with lots of finesse and skill... and compassion for others. She knows that her intensity in those times is scary to people. It's like being in a lightning cloud and tornado all at the same time.

And when it's reversed - and she's doing that for me (there have been times) - people simply look at us as if OMG... there isn't going to be any going back from what's coming out of their mouths; and I'm uncomfortable in this situation... and when the energy is dispersed... we're just fine, but everyone else is confused. All in the space of maybe 5 minutes. LOL... There was a commercial awhile back for gelato. An Italian couple just going AT IT... and it's all resolved with a spoonful of the ice cream... until something else sets them off. It's like that.

The connection between us is strong enough to absorb it all, not infringe on each other's autonomy/independence, and not take offense or take the intensity personally - no matter what words come out. I don't know if that's a more primitive level of "socialization" or interaction... or if it's actually more evolved. Don't know; don't care. It's what works for us. LOL.

[Hopalong]

when she found out that I could talk her through the intense emotional moments... if she talked to me... till the "waters calmed", she quickly internalized that as one of her "superpowers"

That is amazing mothering, Amber. You have trained her not just to be dependent only on you for that level of understanding, but to internalize that kind of process and become her own "calmer."

No wonder she is so strong as an adult today. She understands her own intensity but now is realizing that she won't be dependent only on you, to be the only person who can understand and weather her storms. Very very hopeful.

I am awed. So now I'm back to picturing your own personal storm-savvy Viking to come shelter YOU in that kind of accepting, resolute embrace. You deserve it.

xxoo
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

I think she's learning to not "depend" on anyone else to absorb it and help her dissapate it. It's NICE when there is someone there to help; just not necessary.  As much flailing as I've done the past few years, adapting to being alone, I'm finding there's just not much occasion for needing to deal with my own intense "storms". They're more like an average summer thunderstorm that freshens the air, removes humidity, and cools things off a bit.

If you've ever seen the History Channel series "Vikings"... while I strongly identify with the shield-maiden/mom/wife/farmer Lagertha... I also really really enjoy/understand Floki - the boat builder, who's always got one ear open to the Gods, to try to understand the mystery of life around him.

Independence matters to Hol. Responsible independence, and she forms strong connections with people too. She's always been socially oriented and very compassionate. But I raised kids to be independent; to think for themselves and not ONLY seek approval from their peer group; and to understand that the effort required - mentally, physically, emotionally - to maintain independent self-hood. I can not conceive of wanting kids to be dependent on me that way... shudder to think of such a thing! Ugh.