Author Topic: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?  (Read 2969 times)

bean2

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Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« on: November 13, 2020, 08:23:28 PM »
Thank you for everyone who has responded to my posts.  I read them all, and sometimes read them more than once.

I am really struggling lately, with the realization that I was the Lost Child (third born) in my Family of Origin.

I want to break out of this role, but I am so scared.  Even thinking about doing something different brings an ache to my stomach.  It doesn't feel OK for me to stay where I'm at, though.

Where does this stuff come from? 

I guess I just need to take some baby steps.

any words of wisdom would be appreciated

bean

Bettyanne

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #1 on: November 14, 2020, 12:30:21 AM »
As a child when my mother wanted me to go to sleep.....she would run her fingers on bed headboard and say the mouse is going to get you if you don't go to sleep ........
Not sure if that counts as lost child or abused child.......
I sure hope and pray you know you count here.
Lots of Love,
Bettyanne

Hopalong

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2020, 04:13:27 PM »
I felt lost in a way, Bean.

My parents were dutiful and nonviolent and my Dad was a completely gentle (if often ineffectual in changing anything) soul. He worked too much to take in what I was going through but I did know he loved me.

But my Nmom was emotionally absent and my older brother abusive. Bullying at school for many years (while I was the youngest, smallest, and awkwardest) was the capper.

In that sense, I felt too often unseen, unheard. I was SOOOO sad and SOOOO lonely. I was small and smart and super sensitive. Waaaay sensitive. Not cut out for most of stuff. Especially girl-group stuff.

If that's "lost" -- yup.

How I've "found" myself is by consciously trying to remember to intentionally 'beam' love inward to my living inner child, and overall trying more to be my own loving friend. Huge adjustment in my pleasing, empathic mindset. Doesn't replace it but the balance was wayyyy out of whack. (I've noticed that this also makes it easier for me to love others.)

I send you courage (which I know you already have) to take some of these small steps. Know you are not alone, there are millions all over who are doing the same. And sometimes we "losties" find each other and discover we're found after all.

much courage, big hugs--
Hops
« Last Edit: November 14, 2020, 06:29:01 PM by Hopalong »
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sKePTiKal

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2020, 08:53:20 PM »
My tai chi teacher used to tell me - just be yourself, nothing bad will happen. It was wise encouragement - and when I finally was able to "crack" out of my shell - I found she was right. Nothing bad happened.
Success is never final, failure is never fatal.

Bettyanne

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2020, 12:23:03 AM »
I don't know to laugh or cry.......
my N Mother used to call me a snot nose all the time......
If I saw her cleaning which most of the time she didn't
So I would know someone was coming if she was cleaning
so she would call me names most of the time Snot nose etc etc
When I think of her now what a dumb person she was or should I say just plain mean person.
You are a wonderful person.......I think these parents we had were a lot to be desired. 
Please think highly of yourself and feel good about yourself....
I know you mean a lot to everyone on this forum. 
No matter what they said or did to us......we found help....and people to help us
big hugs.....Bettyanne

Twoapenny

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2020, 06:55:22 AM »
Thank you for everyone who has responded to my posts.  I read them all, and sometimes read them more than once.

I am really struggling lately, with the realization that I was the Lost Child (third born) in my Family of Origin.

I want to break out of this role, but I am so scared.  Even thinking about doing something different brings an ache to my stomach.  It doesn't feel OK for me to stay where I'm at, though.

Where does this stuff come from? 

I guess I just need to take some baby steps.

any words of wisdom would be appreciated

bean

Hi Bean,

I think I realised as an adult that I had no idea of who I really was.  I don't think I really developed my own personality as a child.  I can remember reading a self help book about growing up with a narcissistic parent (Dr McBride; 'Will I Ever Be Good Enough') which is what brought me here, ultimately, and one of the exercises in there is a list of questions about personal preferences.  It's easy questions, what's your favourite food, favourite music, place you most like to holiday, what kind of clothes do you like, do you like wearing make up - just preferences, not right or wrong answers.  I couldn't answer a single question about myself - but I knew the answer to each question if it related to my mum.  So I kind of felt like an empty shell and have tried since then to get to know myself better and work out who I am.

I found, as I've mentioned before, doing 'kid' stuff with my son helpful.  I tried to do different things, just small things - listen to music I didn't usually listen to, read a different kind of book to normal, watch a different TV show.  Just to try different things out.  I try very hard to pay attention to how things make me feel, rather than letting my brain decide what I should and shouldn't do (I find that one very difficult).  I have tried to tune in to myself more, but I have (and do) find it hard, as I often found if I unpackaged a bit of myself a whole load of unpleasant stuff would come out at the same time.  I don't think I'd have coped without regular counseling sessions; it helped me to have an objective perspective and just have someone mirror things back to me so that if I was losing it a bit they could help point me in the right direction.  Journal entries helped, both as a release and it helped me see that I disassociated at times (I'd wondered if I did but wasn't sure).  I think with hindsight one of the things I struggled with is that I thought there would be an end point - a point at which I was 'cured', everything from the past was dealt with and life was just easy.  I've realised as time has gone along that I'm going to be my own life long project, which initially upset me.  But now I find I like the idea of learning more about myself and I think that's because a lot of the pain that I'd bottled up for years has been settled now.  I think just because I've grown into my own person and I feel more comfortable with myself.  It's still hard but I don't feel like I'm waiting for a sort of light bulb moment where everything's suddenly okay.  So yep, for me it was just about trying to do little things, notice how it made me feel, and I found professional counseling really helpful for getting me through the wobbly moments xx

Bettyanne

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2020, 04:22:08 PM »
Hi Two a Penny,
I can relate to you.......I had a cerebral palsy brother never walked talked or could feed himself, a nutty grandmother from Ireland totally uneducated with school or home life, who would scream and yell all the time and take my dad's booz when he wasn't home.  A mother who was a N and Borderline according to my T...... and sweet dad who fell into the trap of it all and never did anything to defend himself or me. 
I used to dream as a kid I was in quick sand going down and down......but the truth was I was going down and down.......I did realize at some point around age 4 I loved my dad.....was suppose to love my mother and grandmother but ??? nothing came in return from them.  At this point I am not looking for sympathy just realizing there was nothing I could do as a kid with all this total dysfunction.  OMG what does a kid do???

The nuns at school I could tell were told by my mother she had her hands full and the truth was she was out the door six days a week to an office.  I had a young friend who I asked what she thought of my mother, she said I didn't know or ever see her......so my old brain now is still working and truth was she was hardly home. 
I am alone now for first time in my life except for my six kids but I really feel so alone with my husband Bil gonel......who died 2 months ago.  Life goes on doesn't it no matter what happens......
So now my old age part of life is here and no Bill.  I cry at times and other times I try to figure out what will I do?'
I know my childhood family left me little to nothing what to do......as I need to face it......and do my best to figure it all out????

I like that you mentioned Dr.McBride......I met her years ago in Denver......Colorado.  It was good to meet a person like her who knew what a N was ......sick mean people is my own answer.  Life in my house was around my NM's desires......she was a runner, running away from anything she didn't like and taking it out on all of us......especially me. Because I was the kid and she could.
 
So where do we all go from here?? to have a better life, a loving life......one that we don't run away from and one we face it........yes we can go do fun things, or take a trip when this covid passes soon I hope.......and we love the people in our life we choose to love......and we hug each other because we care.....We also talk about how we feel......and cry at times too and also laugh. 

One lesson I learned from my mother Betty Lawler (she never taught me anything good)......I can love my kids....always have and not hit them.....not call them names.....respect them and they respect us back.....I am far from perfect but always learning and look forward to the days ahead.
Love, Bettyanne

sKePTiKal

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2020, 02:52:07 PM »
It's been 10 years or so since my T gently suggested that perhaps I could continue on my own and didn't need to see her anymore. Somewhere in that 10 years...

the lost child I WAS, once upon a time... either grew up or got comfortable with my type of mothering and healed... or there was another kind of transformation. The huge difference between my characteristics when I started therapy and now, is that I have more self-reliant confidence than when I started. There was an awful lot of work involving separating the things I was told I was from what I could say was my real self... and that took a long time before I realized I simply didn't have to believe or accept anything, anyone told me I "was". In the end, I am the final say there. And I can reject things that don't match up with my perception. Sure other people, are going to perceive differences from what we self-perceive. And I do seriously consider & ponder other people's opinions... and when needed work on how I express myself and communicate, to at least keep the differences in the same ballpark.

But the abusive things I was told were so unjust, unfair, and not even CLOSE to being accurate - they could only be projection and gaslighting. They really hurt - because they made me doubt my own perception of myself.

There are so many subtleties in human interactions that I think I wasn't exposed to - not being a "people-pleaser" vs being a self-centered jerk - and trying to find the comfortable medium spaces between those extremes. This is probably one of the things I still work on the most - trying to find where I'm comfortable on those kinds of continuums. A new one feels like a whole new universe is opening up - maintaining my self-reliance and independence within a committed relationship. Talking about navigating the extremes of the continuum! Can't be so independent that the connection suffers from lack of emotional availability and vulnerability... can't be so dependent, that I can't stand up for myself and rely on myself when needed either.

The continuum concept and the one I had years ago about things not being either/or proposition - but instead, truly an "and" situation - are probably the two most helpful ways of sorting my own tangled ball of yarn mess out.

Along with actually experiencing that I really could just be myself and "nothing bad happened". LOL.
Success is never final, failure is never fatal.

Bettyanne

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2020, 12:09:52 AM »
Hi Skeptical......
When I read you wrote you were able to be free of your M......omg that was great ......that's what I needed to put into place.  Mine was never a mother or anything to do with a kid......
How freeing? was that to hear? I see you wrote in a ten year period of time...
I think no matter the time frame.....Just to know you could do that if it felt the right thing to do?
I so needed to free of mine....I was a kid who when she wanted to show she was a mother.....I was shown but when she wanted nothing to do with me which was most of the time....I was the pain in the ass kid. 
Why would she even want a kid......??
She only used me when I could do something for her.........
My Betty Lawler mother, died at age 100......so she used me and abused me all the way to this age.
She was user and abuser.....I only wish I had been able to ignore her or never see or hear her voice.  I did towards the end of her life.....to only talk with her on a day I picked.....as a suggestion by my T.
All I can think she was a life lesson...
Thanks, Bettyanne..
I still need to apply some action to my head.

lighter

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2020, 12:47:57 AM »
I hope you can release thinking in terms of needs and SHOULDs, Bettyanne.

Please consider treating yourself to as much self compassion as you'd extend to a small child.

Drop all judgments about everything, as you can, and try shifting into Observer mode....be curious in place of seeing things as bad or good.

And breathe, Bettyanne.  Pay attention to your breath, and how your body is feeling.  Pay attention to any pain or tension.  Put your hands on it and name it.

Tend to it as you would a child.

Lighter


Hopalong

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2020, 02:54:53 AM »
Bettyanne,
I'd like to salute your courage.

At 77, to be coping with grief, catching up with the hard work of processing your life and challenges, and willingly embracing therapy shows you've chosen to heal and to continue loving life. You haven't given up. I think that's powerful and deserves so much respect.

I'm especially touched as ever by Tupp's compassion and patience with the way we all grow and learn. Everyone should have such spacious kindness in their life.

I hope in some of the ideas, techniques and supportive thoughts, you'll find those that give you new strength.

hugs
Hops

"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

sKePTiKal

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2020, 09:20:35 AM »
Healing, IMO, is just as individual a process as grieving. What I know best, is my process. Does it, will it work for everyone? I wouldn't expect it to. There are some things I do, that come with the disclaimer "don't try this at home". LOLOL.

Some things work great for some people; but other people not so much or even at all. So collectively, as a group, there is always something of value in each person's story & path of healing. Some nugget of buried treasure that resonates so loudly, it generates enough energy & excitement for another that the light bulb goes on. So, you take what resonates, hits home, makes sense to you... and leave the rest.

Maybe the one thing, that does apply to everyone, is the acceptance and acknowledgement that we are all unique individuals and being "heard" as one, is a rare or in some cases non-existent experience. I know if you've ever had to depend on a PD parent - a common experiencce with childhood is to feel as if there is something "wrong" with ourselves, because we're not like the PD parent - who scapegoats those children who won't "pretend" to be just like them. That seems to show up in all our stories, early on in explanations of what we've lived with and through.

As for my choice to separate and free myself from my mom's influence on who I am... that wasn't just waking up one day thinking - "I think I'll do this instead of what I've been doing". Oh noooooooo. That's one of the things that took so much time. I had to study my self; all the ways I that even in my thoughts & feelings I gave up control over my own choices (or boundaries) because she is my mother. Then, I had to question my deepest feelings - the one's that are just ME and ask if I really was willing to do this, and was I OK with the fact that what I give is never going to be reciprocated? And then, I observed - that some days, I could give what she was demanding... and other days I just didn't want to or couldn't; and I gave myself permission to "not be there" for her on those days.

Because people do have the power of choice and critical thinking; asking questions & facing reality and our selves; none of what was experienced in childhood has to be a life sentence. Maladaption and old coping mechanisms are how many of us survived to adulthood with some autonomy maintained. But that's nothing at all as serious as having a PD (personality disorder). So, because of the brain's plasticity its possible to change habits of thought and behavior; to consciously choose our selves; to patiently work toward feeling comfortable enough to reveal that real, inner self to others without overwhelming fear of reprisal, punishment or "something bad happening" - ie, karma.

I still observe myself being/saying something that is practically "channelling" my mom. Hol, my D, ALWAYS calls me on it, too. I am lucky enough to have an old BFF from junior high; we knew/know both of our mothers... and V will also tell me I'm "doing it again". LOLOLOLOL. That's valuable help, actually. So it's still in my head - and I'm still trying to be aware of just parroting that crap, reacting without being conscious of what I'm doing - and trying to stop for a nanosecond or twenty to scrape that out of my head and find my authentic response.

It's still all a "work in progress" - but that's how I'm more me these days. In a way, more free from the past. People use the phrase "letting go" a lot. But since I gotta be different and do things my way - I kinda changed that around to "moving on" from the past. IE, a conscious decision to take the first step, then the next, and many more after that without dragging the old baggage (or old bag) with me.

If any of this helps - put it into your own process. If it doesn't, well then - we're just talking. Right?  ;)
Success is never final, failure is never fatal.

Bettyanne

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #12 on: December 19, 2020, 02:58:18 PM »
I was giving this some more thought??
I think I was a pain in the ass to this woman who called herself my mother.......ha
She did everything from put me in daycare until I was 5, and then I went to two years of first grade.....no kindergarten because she was working ...ha
So put the kid in a situation that would be more helpful to oneself ......of course.
Who wants to be bothered with a kid.....
Especially when you got a husband that is making a good salary...
a mother who is old and taking full time care of your cerebral palsy child???

All I know is being told lately from my T that I never really had a mother......that fits
only a person who when I got my drivers license I could now drive her and become useful for her.

What the H???
I wonder what happens to this type of person when they die? I am not wishing her anything but is this truly a sick individual who got away with escaping her son and daughter.....who loved to fight with her mother when ever they were together......as the her mother lived with us.....screaming and yelling all the time and stealing my dads booz????
so much for parent hood......
Lost Child......I was one pain in

 the ass kid she had to put up with..as I did nothing ever to her but be born......

My dad did great pickings in choosing a wife??? what ever you want to call this person
He never stood up for himself......ever

I hope your not the Lost Kid.......today......Love, Bettyanne

Hopalong

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2020, 05:27:18 PM »
Quote
Lost Child......I was one pain in

 the ass kid she had to put up with..

Mind if I do a small edit, Bettyanne?

Quote
Missing Mother......she was one pain in

 the ass mother I had to put up with..

You survived her, Bettyanne. You and Bill found each other,
had beautiful children, and built a good family full of love.

I'd say whatever was wrong with her (a lot), you took those
lemons and made love. Good for you.

hugs
Hops
"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Twoapenny

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Re: Was Anyone Else a Lost Child?
« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2020, 10:31:29 AM »
I think you've done an amazing job given the very difficult start you had, BettyAnne.  I suspect that a lot of men and women - possibly your mother included - had children simply because it was expected of them, and/or there just wasn't reliable enough contraception to prevent pregnancy.  I hope that you're able to get to a point where you don't feel it was some fault on your part - how can anything be a tiny little baby's fault?  But I suspect a lot of parents just weren't in a position to choose whether or not to have kids and I suspect a lot of kids suffered as a result.  My own mum loves babies, always has, but she likes the complete dependency.  As soon as they start doing their own thing she struggles to cope.  I often wonder if counselling had been as available many years ago as it is now how many of us wouldn't be working through these childhood issues through our adult lives.  Humans make a mess of things!  Goodness we can really mess things up.  I hope you are doing okay.  I think you're doing a great job xx