narcissism and friendships

[vunil]

If I take the quote as a whole it seems like your last paragraph is saying that only liberals are "trying to do the right thing and be good people". Is that what you are saying?

No, sorry, I wasn't clear.  My post was supposed to mean:  (first paragraph): try these liberal places, (second paragraph) but of course there are all kinds of people anywhere, (third paragraph) any place where people are trying to do something good for someone else (whatever that is, and whether it's liberal or not) would work.


I don't feel like arguing politics, and this isn't right place to do it anyway, and I think your posts have been very loving and open and everything I would call moral and good.  

But... this is the nervous-making part.... part of me feels disingenuous agreeing that conservative republicanism, as it is practiced right now in this country, is as focused on (what I feel to be) the right thing as are other political positions.   I think for us to be super-cool then I would have to agree that it is, and I'm going to practice some of my new-found assertiveness and say I don't agree that it is, but that I believe in your right to believe so.  

I hope that's ok with you  I can't really do any better than that.   I get the impression you want me to go a little further, but suffice to say I'm as entrenched in my position as you are in yours!  

And I utterly and completely agree that people on the left can be supremely annoying.  One time at a party I met a guy who gave everyone within earshot a big lecture on how it was evil to own a car-- everyone has to walk or ride their bike.   Ok, so within earshot were a blind person, a person in a wheel chair, and a pregnant lady.  I looked around, pointedly at all of these people, and said "everyone?" and he then launched into another tirade.  No pause to even notice who was around.

On this thread, early on, I was bemoaning the lack of tolerance of a friend of mine who wants me to believe in new-age spirituality and other related beliefs (that I think of as "liberal") and I just don't.  She isn't any more tolerant than anyone in a conservative church, that's for sure, and maybe a lot less.

[Anonymous]

Dear All:

I have lately been confronted with the "opportunity" to join a group.  All the members of the group are an easy going bunch, except for the "leader".  The "leader" is a control freak, imposing her rules, her thoughts.  This does not mean the other members follow lock step.  However, because of this "leaders" negative comments about my joining (it is a social type group) and her exception that I might have to bring my son (who is very well behaved) at times to some functions, I have declined to join.

Why couldn't I just go with the flow?  There is no reason to.  If you associate with those who might have negativity, imposition of their values (regardless of what yours might be) you have to evaluate is it worth giving up your beliefs, your values for that association.  If you elect to associate then will you have the uncomfortableness that you may have compromised yourself in some way.  

"To thine onself be true".  Patz

[Anonymous]

vunil,
I hope my post didn't sound like I wanted to argue politics either. I absolutely have no problem with you thinking people like me are not focused on doing the right thing. I happen to believe the same about people on your side of the fence. What I am saying is most people of good will on both sides have good motives. They genuinely want to improve things and sincerely believe that their position is the best way to make things better. Obviously there are cranks on both sides. I'm not talking about them. The vast majority of both liberals and conservatives I know (and I know quite a few of each) are good decent people. If you can't go that far that's OK too. I'm still super-cool with you, because I can tell by your posts you care about other people and that is far more important to me than any political position.
Bravo for your new found assertiveness, too.
"Vive la difference' as they say over in Europe where all those liberal euro-weenies live. Just kidding, please don't flame me.

With super-cool love
Mudpup

[vunil]

"Vive la difference'

Je suis d'accord! (I agree!)

cheers,
Euroweenie

[Anonymous]

vunil,

Super-

mudpup

[mum]

Vunil: I think any friend who doesn't respect your right to an opinion is one to watch carefully, understanding that her fear (which is what such extreme attachment to her opinions means in the big picture) drives her behavoir.

WHAT you disagreed upon isn't the issue at all.  It's the way she wouldn't let go, couldn't see your discomfort (did you tell her?) that is so frustrating.

I have a friend like that and her attachment to being "right' is exhausting.
 I limit/derail our conversations when it starts going that way.  She is pretty much a full blown N, but for some reason, I can deal with her. Mostly I laugh off her righteousness, or change the subject.  I could care less if she thinks I'm stupid...she thinks everyone is stupid.  I tell her to back off on matters of my heart (not hers to know) and pretty much ignore the rest.

Why am I her friend?  She's a stray, emotionally.  She openly admits to her trauma and damage. I find her interesting in many ways. She is totally locked in to her "story" in this life, and perhaps selfishly,  I think I can show her another way to be. (now doesn't that sound like an N victim talking or what?)