"Don't Tell! Don't Feel! Don't think!" Common?

[Anastasia]

Got to wondering if I am the only one who was DIRECTLY told not to "tell" what went on in the house?  Am I the only one who was told not to "talk" to others about what was going on in the house?  Am I the only one who was told directly that I "felt" too much and should (more or less) just put myself on autopilot?  Nmother always said I "thought" too much--as if this were a "bad" thing!
Regardless, I really am wondering if most of us got the same message or not from our Narcissistic parent(s)?  
Yes, I know this is the credo of the dysfunctional family; but is this also the credo of the Narcissistic parent?  Opinions?

By the way, you might like this one (stealing it from someone famous):
  98% of the families out there are dysfunctional and the other 2% are just kidding theirselves!

[CC]

Most definitely A, I was always told that what went on in our family was NOBODY'S business.    I was not to "air dirty laundry"  and also, was always told I "over analyze everything".  This is because I would mention the TRUTHS that were going on and why they were happening.  My mother feels threatened whenever I have mentioned that my childhood is discussed with a therapist.  

My N mother has gone to AA for 35 years.  Yet they don't know anything about her.  She tells me how they all "lay things out on the table" and she would "never discuss" some of the things they talk about.

Is it any wonder she's not healed?

[phoenix]

bye

[Anonymous]

I have terrible anxiety about stating things, even when I know I am right and justified...though I cannot remember any specific circumstances where it happened my parents certainly told us there would be dire consequences if anyone looked into our family environment...the irony being that an outsider almost certainly would not have realised the strange abuse which was going on.

[rosencrantz]

Too right, Anastasia.  Terrible secrets.  Terrible guilt.  

Coming out of the closet is a most painful re-birth.

But oh the bliss of finding other people having similar experiences!!!  And them not finding my experiences outrageous at all!!!

Actually, once you're out of the closet, you wonder what all the fuss was about.  What were all those secrets that were so fearsome that couldn't be told???

There was nothing in our day to day lives...no incest, no black eyes, no coal holes!

Having said that, I have discovered that there were secrets, dark things that happened back in my mother's generation and the generation before that.  Things they couldn't talk about or even acknowledge.  That's where the secrets were.  

And then my own deep dark dread.  Echoing your experience, Phoenix, I just didn't recognise where it came from.

But I know now...and, having faced the worst of it head on, even thinking for a while that I wouldn't/couldn't survive it, the fear and the dread and the terror have almost left me.  In fact, I don't think that any encounter with my mother could reinstate it.  I shan't be running before I can walk, but it's good to know that normality is within earshot!!!
R

[Discounted Girl]

Ah, yes the dreams. I had lots of dreams about people chasing and persecuting me -- the man in the black coat and black hat who would almost get me and I would fly up into a tree and he would wait on the corner under a streetlight. I still have that dream. From about age 7-9 I had the same dream over & over about my mother watching me, looking down from a 2nd story window while I was in the front yard raking leaves with my dad. We never had a 2nd story house, so I don't know what that was all about, but in the dream I would look up and she was glaring at me with pure hatred in her eyes. I told my dad about the dreams, and you know what he told me? "You have those dreams because of your hostile relationship with your mother -- you should try harder to get along with her." Can you believe that? Yep, he sure said it. Why didn't he tell her to stop it? Plus, there were so many other members of the family who knew how she treated me, they told me so, yet nobody told her to backoff. She N'd them too, but I was a kid. Even now, they want to attribute it to her "problems" "mental condition", bla bla -- nobody but me will come out and say she is just a total B I T C H, always and it appears forever !! I'm supposed to put it behind me, forget it, forgive her, overlook her, feel sorry for her -- I don't think so.  Well, like Joe Nichols says, Here's to the past, they can all kiss my GLass. Shame, pox and everything else on them.  

[Anastasia]

I was told by my stepfather to never talk to my Nmother badly or backtalk her; Nmother told me to never say anything disrespectful to abusive stepfather.  They double-teamed me, so I would be in a bind in order to control me.  And they "said" they "wondered" why I never liked them?  Or, as abusive stepfather said, "You've hated us all your life."
Gee, wonder why?  Course this was one of the nicer things they did to me.
Regardless, remember always that often it is the VICTIM who sees things the most REALISTICALLY and is the HEALTHIEST person in the family!!!!
 

[phoenix]

bye

[seeker]

Dear Anastasia & all,

And they "said" they "wondered" why I never liked them? Or, as abusive stepfather said, "You've hated us all your life."

This is just classic and I hate it!  It makes the victim feel guilty for having a normal response to abuse!!  UGH!!!!  It makes me so upset to hear they did this to you!  The N in my life tried to lay this on my kids and I cut it off like a head off a snake.  It was too late for me but I'll be damned if N does this to my kids.  

I'm so glad we can recognize it now and work on getting rid of the poison.  Peace, Seeker.

[I_am_mine]

Most definitely - "what goes on in this house STAYS in this house...or ELSE!"  In my teenage years, when it was appropriate for me to "experiment" to learn who I was, there were two situations where my Ndad found out certain things, and actually told me that if anyone found out, we'd have to move to a different state, he'd lose his job, and our family would be virtually pariahs, because of my absolutely normal curiosity and behavior.  

We were only allowed to think "his" thoughts, because those were the only thoughts that were right, only allowed to voice "his" opinions because, of course, he didn't really believe in opinions, only in black & white "rules".  He treated mom that way, too, and I'm just now realizing that she spent 54 years as an extremely emotionally abused woman.

We spent so much time walking around that big "elephant in the living room",   never acknowledging when it would leave a pile of steaming dung,  that I'm just now trying to learn to trust my own instincts and knowledge, and that I actually have the right to have my own feelings, opinions, and knowledge, even if it's different than Ndad's.    

I've gone thru most of my 48 years not trusting my gut instinct, my perfectly decent brain, my emotions, my opinions...I feel like I've spent most of my life as a "nobody", obviously with no VOICE!

What a horribly hateful way to live...and what a freeing feeling to find out I'm not committing a horrible crime to have my OWN opinion, raise my kids in the way I see fit, not his way of "putting them thru the school of hard knocks at home, to toughen them up, because if you don't, the world will tear them apart!"   Raise my kids with love and acceptance?    No, that doesn't fly with Ndad, and I've had to cut off all contact between him and my kids, as he was trying his best to turn them into "nobodies", too.  That they're boys was even worse, cause they could NEVER measure up to his perfection.

"Don't ask, Don't tell, Don't Think, Don't Feel, Don't LIVE!" is the way I was raised...but I finally see that I'm not a mute nobody, and I owe it to myself, and my sons, to take the responsibility to fix the damage that's been done....and that Ndad STILL tries to do!

It's a dirty job, but *I* have to do it!  And I'm proud to be able to believe I'm up for the task, no matter how hard it is, or how long it takes.    

bobbie

[rosencrantz]

It's a dirty job, but *I* have to do it! And I'm proud to be able to believe I'm up for the task, no matter how hard it is, or how long it takes.

Just wanted to put that up in lights for you, bobbie!

It's a beauty!  And one for lots of people to put on their wall for themselves, too.

Cheers to you, bobbie
R

[Nic]

My N parents were definitely covert narcissists..in that they were/are perceived as angelic by everyone in the community..and yet everyone in the community knows my N mom was a pill popping alcoholic and that my dad got her the pills because of his profession..suffice it to say that as such, I grew up almost from day one in an environment where it was crucial indeed vital that nothing get out of the immediate household..
My n mom would let me ramble on in public about a variety of subjects, making sure to shame me whenever she felt embarrassed and/or by taking me aside for a number of seconds in order that she could slip in ..with emphasized angry recriminatory tone.." wait 'til we get home..." and then i'd get it..at home, away from her audience..
My Ndad, who always has capitalized on my nmom's dependency problems never lost a chance to blame his shyness and self-imposed isolation on what he told the community was " a bad marriage, my wife is sick..my children fight and argue and make our life miserable but who was to know when they're not yours you never know what will happen..blah blah blah...Both my parents would lie and deny reality on a daily basis and warn my brother and I with verbal and non-verbal language that they were the masters of the game..they could get themselves out of any situation by constantly lying and denying reality..this still goes on today..and I'm so sick of it!  That's why I don't see them anymore..
You see my parents sent my brother and I to boarding school as soon as they could, we were never around..or never around long enough to interfere with their fraudulent lives..
When I returned with my wife to our present community, my N dad actually said to me one day:  " Why did you come back?"  I knew immediately i was interfering with the lies, his lies and the false reality he was living on..
You see, my N parents who complain to the world at large that they are "paying for my lifestyle" are lying about that yet again..because what they are really doing is living off ME .  They do this or have done this all their lives because I have been along with my brother an alternate scapegoat and excuse for any and all responsibility or accountability that normal human beings must assume to live true and honest lives.
They've fed off my candidness, my honesty, my sincerity, my sense of humour, my decency precisely because they have none of their own..THEY STOLE IT FROM ME!
But i'm getting it back..slowly but surely..
Nic

[CC]

Nic, yours is the classic "white-picket fence syndrome", it seems.  A good friend of mine and I were discussing this very subject today, that we think a large part of that generation of parents in the middle/upper middle class did this type of parenting (children raised in the 60's and 70's).  The "make it look good to everyone else" thing.

[Anastasia]

Nic, I know everyone who went to boarding school complains...but, as for me, I am really envious of you!  Dang...I wish I could have gone to boarding school and escaped living with two friggin crazy, selfish, totally f'd up people who turned and pointed to ME (the only kid there and homegrown whipping boy for the two of them) and accused me of having problems, causing problems and being a problem when I was no problem, was a good kid, and whose only "problem" was having to live/cope with two totally abusive freaks!
When I say I was happy to get the hell away from them...well, you just don't KNOW how ecstatic I was to get away.....
Again, resent boarding school if you will, but I, for one, am jealous of your experience away from your house...lucky dog, you.  Guess this is a case of perspective.

Anastasia

[Nic]

I know what you mean Anastasia..but you know everyone who goes to boarding school complains for very good reasons.
I don't think you would have liked to be somewhere from one day to the next at 7and a half years of age, not understanding anything because didn't speak the language..My mother tongue is French and i was plopped in an english environment where I was totally lost..where I missed assignments because i didn't understand there were any only to be "swatted" publicly for my stupidity, crying and wounded with no parents to run to..
I was sexually abused there, which is an entirely different story I could write inumerable scrolls about, for the guilt and shame and helplessness and confusion it caused me for years..again with no one to protect me ie: a father maybe???? where my brother underwent the same thing and told to have the same absent father igore and deny the experience....
I was away from my N s yes but thrown into another horrendous experience where I had no voice and no control over what was happening to me...knowing my Ns didnt give a shit.
I understand your wanting to be away from your crazy family..but just like I wished the aliens would abduct me and take me to their planet for a life of bliss..the boarding school fantasy you entertain(ed) was not, in my case..a walk in the park and a much needed break from my Ns.
What we needed, you and I was a stable, caring, loving, nurturing environment devoid of Ns where we could have blossomed into the wonderful people we truly are.
In understanding and support,
Nic