Acceptance?

[Ellie]

For those that feel they are sufficiently in a healing process I pose this question:
Is the real healing just the point at which we simply accept our fate, that we have been voiceless and will remain voiceless?

I have come to the conclusion that I know what has happened in my family - but I cannot change them - therefore I accept that I will remain voiceless to them and must move on.

I realize that there is no cure, I will be cautious of meeting new people, and never let down my guard to let them into my life for fear that after they get to know me, they too will realize ignoring me is the simplest way to deal with me.

I realize that my H has spent 17 years learning to tune me out when I need attention the most. I shut down when I see he has heard enough.

The problem I see is that continuing the process of healing is being able and allowed to talk it out when pain suddenly rears it's ugly head - flashbacks so to speak - and if a friend or family member cannot relate to the pain, they have no desire to hear about it. Therefore, they ignore your cries for help. Past history has taught us all to back off when we become voiceless - it is the measure we have learned to deal with for so many years.

So is the healing really only acceptance and learning to keep moving through life keeping the pain inside, but knowing the source. Does anyone ever recover?

[Singer]

Wow, that’s a really good question. I don’t think that healing is just accepting your fate. That’s giving up, not healing. On the other hand, I don’t think it’s necessarily about finding someone who’ll listen whenever you need to be listened to either, although that would be nice. The problem there is that you’re still putting the ability to heal into another person’s hands, which is good if you find a person like that, but not so good if you don’t.

For me there have been two problems. First of all I felt responsible for my N mother’s unhappiness, because that’s how she deals with it, by blaming others. Secondly I’ve had to find a way to live with my own hurt and feelings of rejection.

I’ve had to recognize that I’m not responsible for my mother. If I disappeared off the face of the earth today she’d still be unhappy and still find someone to blame. I love her, but I can’t fix her. That’s where faith helps. I’m not the creator of all this, and if I don’t always understand what’s going on, it’s because I’m only human and there’s only so much I’m meant to understand. Although I do think we’re supposed to do the work and try to make sense of things in order to grow.

As far as the pain of feeling voiceless, that’s a matter of expectations. If I demand to be heard by a family that will never hear me, then I’d better reconcile myself to a life of pain and frustration. Take it out of their hands and find your voice somewhere else. I can’t tell you where, and I haven’t found out for myself yet either. But I’m working on it.

Those are just a few thoughts. I hope it doesn’t sound too complacent, or like I think I have the answer, but you’ve posed a big question and it’s hard to give a short reply. I look forward to hearing what others have to say.

Singer

[mighty mouse]

Hi Ellie and Singer,

I used to feel like "little voice" but decided that was my problem to deal with as I would never be heard by certain individuals.

I have accepted my fate. And I found different places to have a voice. I in fact have found that just raising my voice a bit, looking people in the eye instead of away, having empathy (an issue I needed some work with) for someone, and just not expecting things from people makes it all easier to have a voice.

As for bringing people into my life, I now have internal standards and boundries that I enforce and try to get to know someone before they are allowed in. The difference is that I now trust myself. I think that is the key.
With Ns you are always being second guessed and invalidated. I have had to cut that malignant tumor, and boy has it been good for me. I am now starting my second year of being N free...sounds like AA a bit   Hi, my name is MM and I have been N free for 1 year and two weeks.

I also found I needed to work on my sense of humor. I now laugh out loud. It is a good feeling. I think being silly is good too.

I hope that helps a smidge.

MM

[Anonymous]

Is the real healing just the point at which we simply accept our fate, that we have been voiceless and will remain voiceless?

For me healing meant improved interactions with others so I wasn't miserable all the time. One gets a "voice" when more in command of one's life.

I have come to the conclusion that I know what has happened in my family - but I cannot change them - therefore I accept that I will remain voiceless to them and must move on.

You may now be aware that some people are limited in functioning, you accept this sad state of affairs, and adapt to it (find ways to strategize so your life will run smoother).

I realize that there is no cure, I will be cautious of meeting new people, and never let down my guard to let them into my life for fear that after they get to know me, they too will realize ignoring me is the simplest way to deal with me.

I think caution is totally wise. But rigidly guarding yourself seems a bit much.

I realize that my H has spent 17 years learning to tune me out when I need attention the most. I shut down when I see he has heard enough.

Well, this is a major relationship issue. It's probably a dynamic between the two of you that's pretty complicated.

The problem I see is that continuing the process of healing is being able and allowed to talk it out when pain suddenly rears it's ugly head - flashbacks so to speak - and if a friend or family member cannot relate to the pain, they have no desire to hear about it. Therefore, they ignore your cries for help. Past history has taught us all to back off when we become voiceless - it is the measure we have learned to deal with for so many years.

I think what you're saying is that your needs overwhelm and then trigger other people's stuff. They can't give what you need. And they withdraw for self-protection. So you feel abandoned and retraumatized. I can't remember if you're in therapy, but this is exactly what therapists are there for!

So is the healing really only acceptance and learning to keep moving through life keeping the pain inside, but knowing the source. Does anyone ever recover?

Healing is not about keeping the pain inside. It's about finding ways to express it, manage it, and move through it, so that you can remain functional and have a pleasant life.

bunny

[lynn as guest]

Hi Ellie,

my heart goes out to you.  I can feel the uncertainty and sadness in your post.

So is the healing really only acceptance and learning to keep moving through life keeping the pain inside, but knowing the source. Does anyone ever recover?

I'm early in the process... So far, I feel quite similar to you... that perhaps acceptance and awareness is the best place one can get to.  I think that being voiceless may be a vital part of who I am, that maybe at some level I will always be voiceless, and maybe I got caught up in N relationships because I wanted relationships with distance.  It's sad to think that this could be true.  And I hope that time will prove me wrong.  Despite these nagging negative thoughts, I do leave myself open to the possibility of something different, a new joy.  

Perhaps one finds acceptance in this area of ones life and with that acceptance can build a stronger foundation, a greater wisdom in other areas.

I remind you that with or without a voice, you are a valuable human who can love and be loved.

All the best,

lynn

[Anonymous]

Hi Ellie,

I read your posts and I have empathy for the adult who writes them as she pours her heart and soul out to share with us.  For the child that you were never allowed to be, the one who struggles to find her way out of the emotional dungeon she grew up in,  there are no words or feelings that I can express that would comfort that child.  

Ellie, for some reason God created most women to bare children.  Even those who were not fit to be mommies.  We can not help who we were born to, as much as I wish it were possible, it just doesnt work that way.  Your mother did not give you the nurturing that you so needed to work your way into being a woman.  You lost your childhood hun.  Emotionally you lost out on all of the blocks that you needed to pave an easy path into becoming a woman.  Please hun, let that little girl that longed to be, who  hides deep inside of your being, let her grieve and let her figure out her innocence in the whole N world that she grew up in.

You did not chose to live in that environment nor did you have the ability to change it when you were younger and ya know what, there isnt anything that you can do as an adult to show the level of dysfunction in your family.  You took everyones burdons upon your shoulders as a child and the weight was to much to bare.  Perhaps that is why you feel so bogged down as an adult.  You have that little girl inside of you who is silently screaming for help.  Let her screams be heard and as an adult you find the ability to listen to those silent pleas.  Once you free the burdens of that little girl, I truly believe that by reading your words, there is a very capable women waiting to introduce herself to the world.

If you try to talk to a friend or your husband, heck whoever you try to talk to Ellie, if they don't listen to you, then you spin your ars around and turn to the next person Ellie.  Keep searching for someone to hear the words that you desire to speak that come straight from your heart and soul Ellie.  You are worthy and by god if you find those who don't have the time nor the desire to listen to you, then you go hun, go on and I promise you that soon you will find a person who would love to hear your words.

I have often pondered which situation would be the worst of two evils.  Growing up in a N environment or growing up oblivious to the fact that it even existed.  I grew up in a NON-N family.  Now, lol, I didnt say functional family, just NON-N.  When I was hit in the face with narcissism, I had no clue as to what hit me.  I think the only way I pulled myself away from that trap was the fact that I know who I am and I know who I should be.  When it got to the point that I was being brain washed about who I was or what I thought or said, the little girl inside of me pleaded to not forget her.  I knew who I was, who I inspired to be and that little girl helped pull me back into reality.  You were not allowed to build yourself emotionally, heck the N had all of your emotions all planned out for ya Ellie.

We can not chose who our families are, we can only chose how much of their CHIT we have to take.  As I said, my family was dysfunctional Ellie.  My mom, I have no mommie, I have a women who gave birth to me.  I chose to walk away from the chaos in order to save my emotional well being.  

You know who you are Ellie, you know who you want to be, and You can only share that with people.  If you don't speak for yourself Miss Ellie, who in this world do you think will do it for you?  I have come to the conclusion that nobody guards my well being better then me.  I know that I am a very outspoken person and there are reasons for that.  I too was not allowed to be heard as a child.  I just chose as an adult to rid myself of those people who refused to listen to and to share their most personal thoughts and feelings.  I call it "weeding my garden".  

Oh my does things grow better when there is not alot of weeds surrounding it smothering it out.  Ellie, rid yourself of those weeds from your garden.  I never felt as free as when I decided that for my emotional well being, those weeds had to go.

I surrond myself with people who give as well as take.  Takers bleed you dry whether it be emotionally or physically.  I am by no means saying that I am selfish, I am just saying that I need to have people who give back as well as receive.  It makes the hard knocks in life seem not so hard

You are worthy and if someone doesnt think you are, then who needs them?  What do they have to give you emotionally that will benefit you?  Eventually when you keep giving and never replenish your soul, pretty soon your soul is nothing more then an empty box, an empty storage box to hold everyone elses desires.  Fill them up with the ellie you long to be.

I have faith in your ability to express Ellie.  You express wonderfully to me and I dont know ya from Adam.  Ellie, you can be anything you want to be.  Inside of you are all the answers to the questions you have.  Seek them out and let them be heard by others.

I happen to see a wonderful women when I read your posts.  I know that women is yearning to be accepted in this world.  Seek out those who are willing to greet you with open arms.  Wink, YOU ARE WORTHY Miss ellie.

[Jaded]

That was me Miss Ellie, Jaded.

[Ellie]

Singer, MM, Lynn, Jaded,
Thank you all for the wonderful responses. I appreciate the time you took to try and answer my questions. I know that I need help, I am seeing a therapist, but it's probably way too little - sometimes only 1 hour a month. But she is very busy and I do not like to push.

I can be agressive when it comes to my children or my family's desires and protection, but have been way too conditioned to push for ME.

I am in a situation right now where I have stood up to my N family. My parents have always used closing me out as punishment. As I grew into an adult if I did things they did not approve of, they simply cut me off for a period (til they got over it) and then let me back in. So I knew what I was getting myself into when I stood up to them all. I am now in a vaccum, no word from Nmom, Ndad (haven't spoken to him other than hey in over 5 years), 2 sisters who refuse to acknowledge I am alive. It would not have mattered if I hadn't stood up for myself, they all let me into their lives only when they need something anyway. And god forbid I refuse to oblige them, I get cut off again!

So there's no communication whatever. If I try to call which is stupid on my part, they will talk, but they refuse to acknowledge that I stood up for myself - sweep the ugly family secrets under the carpet - ignore it and it will go away. They will only talk to me if I allow them to use me as their sounding board. I must listen, answer the way they want to be answered, agree to everything they agree to and then they call it a good phone call and allow themselves to talk to me again in the near future (6 months or so).

I'm having such a hard time dealing with their ways that I cannot get it off my mind at times. Days like mothers day and fathers day are really hard to get through, but I put it all away for the day so my kids and H will have a great day. Then afterwards it creeps back in and I'm sorely depressed and my immediate family does not know what happened.

They are so used to me always trying to bring everyone else UP that it is not allowed for mom to be down. I am the vacation planner, the events planner, the dinner planner, the pick me upper, the home decor designer, the one whp keeps everyone happy in the family.

When I started seeing a therapist, I told her I was tired and couldn't find the energy to plan the next fun thing for everyone because I am not happy anymore about myself. There is no time in the family life for me to take time out for myself without severely upsetting the family. My H sometimes says I need to find something for me, but when I persue that, it is apparent that my desires will get in the way of everyone else's fun, and without saying so, I know they all feel it is more important to keep their fun going than to make mom whole.

The friends I have are so used to this same philosophy that if they see me not happy, Up, high energy, they don't know how to take it and are uncomfortable around a less joyous person.

I have put on quite a front for people all of my life. I do not let them see when I am hurting. I lived in survival mode for so many years that I realized that letting someone know you are not 100% is a very dangerous position, kinda like the wounded animal in the jungle. Only my philosophy is "be happy or be eaten". I tried to convince myself that if I could convince everyone that I was happy and content, I would eventually believe it myself. Now I get mad at myself for not believing anymore. And sometimes, I'm the worst enemy when I refuse to let myself listen to ME. I also make me voiceless.

I have put ME where I am today. I do not know a way out. I cannot do a 180 with my H and kids. They are all very happy and content the way things are. H just says he kinda understands - doesn't really because he has never had to live around people like my parents. He has ignored them since we got married, and didn't even know them until 2 days prior to our wedding. We had dated for 2 years, were engaged for a year. That's how invloved my parents are in my life. He says he wants to help, but thinks I should just forget about my family and move on. He is very active with his family. He has a 10 day vacation alone with his brothers every year. He spends time on the phone with them all every week. We take vacations with them occassionally. They are great people, but it just reminds me of what I have missed all my life.

How do you just forget it all and move on? I am alone in all of this except for my 3 kids and H. I live a life of solitude sometimes. I feel inprisoned at times. I feel punished becaue I will not conform to my N parents ways.
My life is happy when I plan things for my immediate family that makes them all happy. Then when someone doesn't like what we are doing, I take it as a personal hit - I did not do it right somehow. And all the time, I am too busy trying to make it right for all od them, that I do not have fun, get a rest, or enjoy my time. I come home feeling slighted.

I have been away from my 3 kids for a total of 3 days since I beame a mom. H travels for business and goes on a vacation once a year without us. Our family vacations require a lot of work from me, while they all go have fun. I am back in the working world by choice and soemtimes I do not want to leave work. It is my escape. I have been offered business trips but they always conflict with something H has going and I am not allowed to trump. Don' t get me wrong - he's a great guy, but he has gotten very used to me being conpliant, and is not ready to see me change - even it it means me being happier. I believe he and my kids are content with the same ole same ole mom,  and they are willing to take the depressing moments in lue of changing tbeir ways. It is just too much for me to handle.

[Ellie]

Bunny, I didn't mean to leave you out. Thank you for your thoughtful response also.

[Singer]

Ellie, I hope you can find a way out of what you're going through. If it's any consolation, and it probably won't be, I can tell you that I've been in a situation similar to yours particularly with the H.

In my case when I stopped pretending to be happy 24/7, he walked right out the door. Basically gave me an ultimatum. Either I shape up my attitude or, as he put it, it would be out of the frying pan into the fire for me. I chose the fire, but went through over ten long years of financial struggle, loneliness and humiliation while I tried to keep up the illusion of a civilized, friendly divorce. And in the end there was no applause, no gold watch. Got the kids through college, but there were times it was very tough for them and maybe what they learned from all of it was just to keep up appearances. Not exactly what I set out to teach, and I hope that's not what they've taken away from it.

Bottom line, I don't think I had a choice. I wasn't a robot and couldn't be happy on demand. My family blamed me even though I wasn't the one who left. I had been the one who put together all the family gatherings, hollow as they turned out to be. But I found out that he was the one they respected. He was the successful corporate executive, and I, of course, had screwed it up.

I hope you keep trying to find help and that you can work things out within the family you have created. Sometimes just putting things in writing so you can actually see what you're thinking can help.

Singer

[Ellie]

Singer
I hope I do not have to follow your path. I don't think I'm strong enough to go it alone. I admire your strength to have made it to where you are now. I see times when I think my H could say that. He approached me this morning asking if I was feeling better. I told him I just felt like I was living to make all of them happy and so he was going to change his golfing plans for the afternoon. So the guilt comes crashing in, I say he must go, I can handle taking the kids to their sports. I always insist he do what he wants because I just can't live with the guilt that my feelings could possibly stand in the way of another's good time. The fact is, I would be going to the kids sports events anyway, why not do it alone? But I never get away from the 24/7 parenting like he does. He says I can take that time away anytime I want, I just have to do it. But I don't have friends calling inviting me to join them for things. I had to put off friends for 14 years to take care of my kids while my H persued his interests. I can no longer nuture a friend relationship because I do not even know how. I had to stop the telephone calls because if the family needed me they admonished me for ignoring them. H goes away for a week at a time for business, I take care of the kids, meals, activities, etc. But if I want to be on the phone during dinner one evening, I don't hear the end of it. He just keeps calling me to dinner and interrupting me telling me everyone is waiting for me and I'm holding up their dinner. I feel they cannot breathe without me there, taking care of them, but I know the truth is that they can function perfectly well without me. I'm just sooooo confused!

[bunny]

Ellie,

I think you would be greatly helped by learning about boundaries. I suggest you get hold of this book, *Codependent No More* by Melodie Beattie. The book is in the library and available cheap (used) from amazon.com. Don't hesitate one minute, get this book. It will give you a roadmap.

bunny

[Anonymous]

Hi Ellie and everyone,

My daughters are now 24 and 22. I often think about a photo I have of one of them sitting on me and I am twisted in pain but not conveying this verbally. I also think of Flo - a very tired old chimpanzee who simply didn't have enough energy to get her son off her back (literally) and so dragged around with this huge overgrown son  on her for the rest of her life! She just dropped in her tracks. At some point, a mother needs to encourage children to manage on their own more - it's good for them. (tough I know when you are driving everyone everywhere) I now see that it isn't just for me that I should've taken care of myself ... it's just as valuable for the children to see that their mother is actually a person with needs and feelings.  And when some of those needs are met you can return to the nest with a little more balance.

I think too about the "role" of mother -I  thought it was to take care of everyone, show them they were loved and that's it. What I didn't realize was that I wasn't fostering my children's independence. I'd love to go back and let the children make dinner one night a week etc. no matter what it was.

Could you start small - just one thing. My neighbour has 3 children 2,5,7. She goes to yoga one night a week.  She says it helps her so much. It's also good for children to see their mother taking care of herself.  Good for H too. Make it something regular, so people can begin to plan around mother not being there. They might moan and complain at first - an indication really of how much they need to learn to value you for you. Let them moan a bit. It won't hurt them.

When you take care of yourself , think of it also as a wonderful learning opportunity for your children. You are demonstrating reality - not some plastic version of what a mother should be. Our N parents weren't real. As children being real wasn't encouraged. Image was all. Time to break the mould. Please take care of yourself.  This is very different from being selfish. You are restoring yourself that's all.
Les

[les]

Still don't seem to get my postings right. last post from Les, or Less or Les(s)

[Jaded911]

Ellie,

IMHO, you are not a lost soul, you are merely an exploring soul.

I agree with bunny, until you set boundaries for yourself and your family, the cycle will continue to repeat itself.  

You mentioned that your family will dump you for a bit when you piss them off.  This used to bother me with my family and suddenly one day I realized, who really gives a chit if they dump me forever.  When they are in my life I am a miserable human being.  My ability to think this is probably not a healthy way of thinking to some, but to them I say this, better my emotional well being then my parasite families emotional well being.  Some people just suck you dry emotionally.  My mom walks into a room and my entire demeanor changes.

Lifes challenges are supposed to help us discover who we are.  They are not supposed to paralyze us.  I had to learn to set my boundaries and when my family member repeatedly crossed those boundaries, I refused to move the lines that I had drawn.  Oh well, their loss, not mine.