Author Topic: religion & NPD  (Read 8425 times)

Ellie

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religion & NPD
« Reply #30 on: November 02, 2004, 02:02:18 PM »
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Lost

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religion & NPD
« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2004, 03:04:49 PM »
I guess one of the hardest parts of this is that Ndad has somehow turned the whole family against us (myself and my husband).  Now the attacks come not only from him, but actually usually through the proxy (mom, sister, brothers), so we feel that if we do break from Ndad to protect ourselves, we will have to break from the rest of the family since they are being used as his proxies and we can't take the verbal blackmail/abuse from them either.   :(

I talked with my mom the other day (I think she is an inverted N), and she basically said that Ndad is "afraid" of my H (because my H won't let him run over him, so he doesn't get his way), and that Ndad was "only doinf what he thought was best growing up" (I guess, verbal and emotional abuse is okay as long as you think you're right) :roll: When I tried to tell her the truth she still wouldn't listen and continued to propogate Ndad's view of reality.  

It got so bad a few months ago that my H threatened to get a harrassment restraining order against my Ndad.  Ndad backed off for awhile, but sent in the sibling/mom proxies saying that my H was sinning to "take a brother to court" and that he couldn't contact us because of the threat to "seek reconciliation" so we told him we were sorry for "hurting his feelings" then confronted him with some false rumors we had heard from the proxies.  He denied that he had started the rumors, and has made no attempt to admit any wrong doing in the two months since supposedly wanting to seek reconciliation.  He's so good at spinning his tales, that the rest of the family believes him and are unwilling to listen to us.  

I have always dealt with his abuse in the past by remaining silent, because I believed that was the best thing to do.  But now that I am married and we have a daughter, I believe they are my first priority and I/we cannot allow this kind of emotional abuse/blackmail to continue.  My H comes from a wonderful loving Christian home where there is complete, unconditional love and acceptance.  It is such a stark contrast for me, having never experienced that in a family relationship. (I have had friends like that, but it's different in the context of family.)  

My sis is one of the worst proxies, and may in fact be an N herself, as she is unwilling to listen and has an answer before I even finish my statement.  She is a very angry person.  And I hate to say it, but I do not want my daughter around her thinking that it's okay to act that way.

You are right, in the end, each one of us has to answer to one person alone and that is Christ.  He knows our hearts.  He knows our hurts and He is the Great Physician.  He alone can heal the open wounds of a broken heart. And in the end the wicked do not prosper.  I find a lot of comfort in Psalm 37.  I know that my H and I have sought only to resolve the conflict in Christ honoring ways and our attempts have been branded as "sin" and "evil" and a "sign of unrepentance", so be it!  We are not responsible for the thoughts of others--we are only responsible for our own thoughts and actions and will give an account for what we have done.

The finality of leaving/vanishing/not talking to the family is hard (there are nieces and nephews that I will miss terribly), but the constant barrage of degrading comments and back stabbing is CAUSING us to sin (we are stuggling with anger and bitterness now, where as, when this all started, we were far from angry and bitter).  My H and I both feel that we should leave if only for the sake of cutting ourselves off from something that is causing us to sin. :(  We have sought counsel in this and that counsel is divided.  some say stay and work it out, but those who know about NPD say "get out", but that doesn't make it any easier for me.  I guess deep down I am an optimist, and even though I know that nothing has ever changed in my relationship with my Ndad--he is always right--I keep hoping and praying that someday the Lord will get a hold of his heart and he will realize what he has done and that he will actually CARE about me, about my H and about his grandchildren (not as sources of N supply--but truly care/love).  I believe that NOTHING is impossible with God and I know that He can change even the vilest of sinners!  I just pray that we will live to see His hand at work in our family and that He will be glorified in all things.  We don't hate these people, in fact we love them (and have forgiven them for all the emotional and verbal abuse and the lies) and long for a genuine open relationship with them, but right now that seems impossible.

Thanks for listening and for caring.  It is comforting to know that there are others out there who do understand and who will listen.

Ellie

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religion & NPD
« Reply #32 on: November 02, 2004, 03:21:56 PM »
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Overcomer

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« Reply #33 on: November 02, 2004, 04:53:02 PM »
Hi Ellie and Lost:  Sounds like we all have a lot in common!  It's funny, because I now am involved in a Christian business, my children go to Christian school and we don't regularly go to church.

I went for years to my parents church but then if I chose not to go, I got phone calls asking me why.  It was a constant scrutiny on my attendance that wore me down.

After my divorce I started taking my girls to another church.  My nmom was so mad at me!!  She wanted us to be with them and go out to eat every week after service.

When I got remarried my new husband put a cabash on that since he didn't think we could afford to go out every weekend.  Plus we never developed any friendships with other people - we spent all our time with family.

Then our lives became so busy and we decided that God had stated that the sabbath was a day of rest - but it was becoming one of the more busy days what with church and then eating out and then practices for my girls later on in the day....................It got to be too much.  So now my parents just consider me the worse parent because we don't get up and go to church on Sunday mornings.  My mom still picks up my little ones to go to Wednesday night service but my senior in high school doesn't go.  But remember - she has gone to Christian school since kindergarten and they have chapel every week and this girl does not drink, smoke, cuss or anything else like I did!!!  (The girl who went to church every week because I was made to............................)  Still a Christian - but so much different then my nparents wish I was.  I have gone from being a phoney who went to church every week to an authentic christian person who doesn't!
Kelly

"The Best Way Out is Through........and try laughing at yourself"

Ellie

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religion & NPD
« Reply #34 on: November 02, 2004, 05:08:19 PM »
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Anonymous

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religion & NPD
« Reply #35 on: November 02, 2004, 05:23:22 PM »
Kellydckm here:  Wonder if there is something there.  N people who find the rules and regulations of organized religion an easy way to wield their N ways upon us!

It is so much easier for folks to make your life miserable under the guise of the church then under the guise of abuse!

Anonymous

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religion & NPD
« Reply #36 on: November 02, 2004, 05:25:41 PM »
FFPCP  "Fanatical Fundamentalist Phoney Christian Parents"

Hopefully I will NEVER be a part of that club - I'll settle being a poor abused victim of one..........................

And never perpetuate those lies.................

Dee

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religion & NPD
« Reply #37 on: November 04, 2004, 09:46:17 PM »
My nmom purports to have religion and always says she'll pray for me. Well, I guess her praying worked because I'm much happier now that we don't have much contact!

It's funny (ironic) that so many Ns purport to be men and women of God and you wonder how that can be so, or at least I do. Gosh, these are the same people who can't apologoze to save their life or be bothered to be humble once in a while. How does anything related to God get through at all?

I'm going back to the "types of Ns" list to see if this phenomenon is listed. And can an N ever really be saved? It seems like you would have to submit to the God or higher power and I don't think they can submit.

Oh well. Rambling now.

Dee

Anonymous

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religion & NPD
« Reply #38 on: November 05, 2004, 07:54:19 PM »
I believe in a higher power but not in organised religion and I was raised in a very orthdox manner by my parents who are Hindus even though my ndad would deny it. He is a rationalist in his own words.

For my dad, he is God and religion is only a reaffirmation of what he already knows and is preaching  :roll:  He would twist and turn every religious texts he reads and claim they say what he says. he would use religion as a weapon to gain 'power' over the 'lesser souls'

For my mom she is goodness and nothing less, and me and others ( especially men ) arent that pure :roll: Her relationship with God is also somewhat special.. it is kind of special private space which she has created for herself free from all the tortures ( my ndad ) and burden ( myself ) in this world

and in that context ' honour the father, honour the mother' it is so hard to take in at face value and need NOT be taken as such but I think it still holds good meaning to me...

do not disown anything..father could symbolise power, authority, strenght etc and mother- nurture, warmth elegance etc.. in Jungian terms the shadow and the anima/animus. We definitely need to honour each and every aspects of ourselves !! Just because the parents are not ideal or the world being a conflicting and divided place does not mean that we should lose faith in OURSELVES !

Anonymous

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religion & NPD
« Reply #39 on: November 05, 2004, 07:56:31 PM »
the abocve post was by me

Spirit

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« Reply #40 on: November 07, 2004, 03:55:17 PM »
The comment about "how can a N be a Christian?????"  struck home with me.  You are right when you say that they cannot apologize (because they cannot admit that they are EVER wrong.......) or be humble........my nmom is soooo prideful, it literally makes me sick.  How can they submit to a higher power?  

For my nmom, the higher power gives her the authority to judge and feel disappointed in me and others.  My whole life there was this look of disapproval on my nmom's face whenever I did or said anything.  Because I was rebellious as a teenager and beyond, my mere existence was a disappointment to my mom and I suppose she considered me the worst kind of sinner!!!

Oh, I think organized religion only feeds into the N.  It gives them fuel to be pious and judgmental.

But the good news is I think I have finally shook that inner voice that made me feel guilty every single day of my life if I didn't agree with my mom.  I finally pushed her out of my life sufficiently to make her realize that I mean business and that I will not be guilted into submission, or manipulated in to doing what she wants........................kelly
Kelly

"The Best Way Out is Through........and try laughing at yourself"

Anonymous

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religion & NPD
« Reply #41 on: November 08, 2004, 03:29:18 PM »
Hi Kelly,
This is Ellie....

I enjoyed my weekend by riding my motorcycle with H. It was beautiful both days and we got 80 miles in.

I had a bigger grin than usual and it took a while to realize I was thinking about how livid Nparents would be if they could see me riding down the road on my bike - a few miles over the speed limit just for fun - feeling confident on the bike and grinning so big.

Here's the sins they would say I commited:
1. Riding a motorcycle is a sin - because they hate them
2. Dressing in black leather is a sin because it was worn by hell's angels and such.
3. Riding over the speed limit is a sin because it is breaking the law.
4. Grinning from ear to ear is a sin because god never meant for human to be so happy - they must be miserable to be a christian.

So today - on a Monday - I am happier and more content with my life that I have been in months!

Oh, plus H and I planned a ski vacation for Thanksgiving again. Nparents used to get so angry that we would dare go somewhere for  the holiday except their house. Sure I would rather be at their home watching Ndad yell at Nmom because she wasn't waiting on him enough. Nmom yelling at the dog because she needs someone to yell at. Nmom making a little 5 lb. turkey breast for my family that can consume a 10 lb. for just us alone. Ndad has the heat up to 98 degrees in the house so Nmom is fussing about that. Niece (actually adopted sister) ignoring all and acting 5 years when she is 18. My kids miserable because there is nothing to do at their house. Nmom refuses to let anyone help but after dinner complains that we are all ungrateful....

Yep, I'm going skiing this year!  :lol:

Nony

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religion & NPD
« Reply #42 on: November 08, 2004, 05:45:12 PM »
Hi Ellie,

Yeah!!!!I will miss step dad having CNN up so loud, it would wake the neighbors and having it on practically 24/7 babbling about his political junk. And My Mom's too cold house and her hard beds. And having to help in the kitchen all the while listening to her be cross about one thing and then another.

Oh gosh. This year will be so much nicer just home with my H. Peace, quiet and eating and doing what we want.

Enjoy your motor bike!