new phase

[sKePTiKal]

So, a month or so ago I finally had my "aha moment" about how/why/where in my feelings - and why again... I was one of those people who was OCD about self-harm and self-sabotage. After all those years picking up and looking under rocks... and moving on to the next rock... it was like a switch had finally started to shift. And while I had (and still have) my tredipations about the unknown... I knew I was finally entering into the time when I could finally "do" something different and still be me.

Well, go figure! There are side effects.

I'm one of those who express feelings that weren't allowed to be voiced, physically, with psychosomatic symptoms. Since this "phase" began I've had a lot of pain in an ankle (but recall no injury)... and an ugly, itchy rash that's just loads of fun in extreme heat. I've been actively treating both of these issues at home and making progress. Finding what works for relief and healing.

The other side effect might just be beyond me right now. For a week, I've been processing something in my dreams - and I've been waking up feeling as if I've just spent 8 hours struggling to survive; fighting tooth and nail and not always winning. I've dreamt horrible images of physical medical torture; continuous bullying and browbeating cruelty; of being surrounded by a person(s) whose mission in life is to make every conscious moment of my life sheer mental, emotional and physical agony. As if I were a donor for Dr. Frankenstein (or Frawnkensteen... if you prefer!) or thown into a group of people, who've decided I'd make a wonderful sacrifice to some particularly nasty god.

I've woken up hubs, talking in my sleep. My dream memory was of screaming at myself... or some representation of myself or maybe those people around me, hurting me, in my dreams. I don't know. For once in my life, my ability to remember whole sequences of dreams isn't working right now. I can only remember snippets - single images - and some of those are so gory I can't inflict them on you all. There are gross things; lots and lots and lots of "symbols" - both societal and personal symbols - and here's the really ODD thing: I don't wake up emotionally upset or with any "feeling" other than being tired of the subject matter; maybe emotional exhaustion - like "oh THAT again..."

Perhaps I'm a little unsettled; my "normal" reaction is to worry about things like this and pick it apart until I derive what's going on with me. But with this I'm not sure where to start - nor do I "feel" that there's anything to be "done" about it... more that it's a temporary phase that I sort of have to pass through; put up with and then, when it's over - I'll feel like my work is finished; done.

Anyway, I wondered if anyone else had ever had an experience like this during their work/journey. I guess part of my brain is telling me I feel kind like a weirdo for going through this... but ultimately, I am strangely sure that it's all part of a "good thing".

[Hopalong]

((((((((((PR))))))))))

The thing that comes to mind is when a trusted writing professor said to us: "There is no such thing as a 'bad' dream. A nightmare is a safety valve for your psyche. Your subconscious needs to process something, and the dream state is how it can do that..."

It's not psychosis, but it sounds disturbing and hard.

I'm glad you have such faith in the journey, and trust in your own processing.

A hurricane blowing hard in your mind. And this weather will pass.

So many physical things, maybe your body is calling you for you to be IN it.
Maybe the intense brain activity is out of balance, and the thinking is racing, almost?

Gentle swimming, an hour twice a day? Might not help the rash but probably everything else?

Just thoughts, gently...

Hops

[BonesMS]

I'm also experiencing similar stuff with dreams and, IMO, I think it is the psyche working out all the old issues of being trapped in a Hell-Hole with the Rage-aholic NWombdonor for years.  What I started doing was writing down the images I saw then going back to sleep.  I've found it helps taking all of those notes and writing a story where the abused person WINS in spite of the abusers.

Does that make sense?

Bones

[Guest]

Had a couple of dreams a week or so ago which made some sense; wandering around a luxury house of criminals, CCTV in every room and hallway, I was trying to 'save' someone or something, got caught up with them temporarily, somehow it all worked out and I had my opportunity to tear a strip off them for their criminal ways. I think some were criminals, others were 'not realising what they were doing' and were therefore innocent. Made some sense at the time. I felt pretty much in control (of myself) which is a lot different to dreams of years ago. Thankfully I don't talk in my sleep, except to argue that I am, in fact not snoring (quite vigorous arguing, apparently).

I don't have nightmares any more. Vivid, sometimes violent dreams, but not those where you wake up drenched with a racing heart wondering where the predator is. But then I did give up cheese before bedtime. As for psychosomatic symptoms, I've had atopic eczema on my calves and feet for maybe a year or so now, but then it does move about the body. I've not been completely free of it, as though it has to come out somewhere. I used to get shower hives; still do sometimes. I guess my skin is sensitive. Insects love me. Maybe that's why I don't like too much close contact? I was reading that sometimes people can get hives from vibrations. That amazed me. Sorry PR, off topic, so:

Yeah, oh that again, I recognise that. And:

more that it's a temporary phase that I sort of have to pass through; put up with

Most things are temporary (and feel like it to me).

and then, when it's over - I'll feel like my work is finished; done.

I don't know if we're ever finished. I'll let you know if that happens!

Oh wait:

thown into a group of people, who've decided I'd make a wonderful sacrifice to some particularly nasty god.

I had those dreams years ago. I remember one dream too, about my mother sacrificing me, which was spot on, this was years ago too. I don't dream about her any more. Interesting.

Maybe I have administration rights over my own dreams these days.

  Frawnkensteen, for sure.

edit

I am strangely sure that it's all part of a "good thing".

Once I got past that stage, it didn't matter. It's passing time. What's important to me is to know the difference between what helps and what hurts. So long as it doesn't hurt, oh I don't know. My base line for 'bad thing' is so damn low, most things seem not too bad. I don't know, but I don't mind that I don't know. Such crap happens in the world. People are so awful. Anyway.

[sKePTiKal]

Thanks all. I'm not emotionally affected by the dreams - they've been going on for awhile now. Not a lot of old anxiety symptoms, either... or at least none I don't recognize before I go rolling off down the slippery slope. I immediately just STOP and sit the energy out... or like Hops suggests - go get some exercise and move my body. I have been very much more in my body - thanks to the itching (damn it!) and hobbling around with my ankle. I've also been connecting a lot with people - more than ever, it seems - just for the pleasure of it.

I guess I wondered if this might be sort of the "end of the journey"... where "the work" shifts from daily awareness to the unconscious, and the processing there is only noticeable to me like this... dreams, physical symptoms. And I suppose the overall tenor of helplessness, powerlessness against the "torture" is something I've unconsciously been clinging to - attachment and all that. And now, I'm unconsciously going through the "story" again... while my unconscious self decides: cling or let go. Hmmm. Guess I won't try to influence its decision - as if that were possible!! Perhaps just wait it out. See what happens next.

Hives from vibrations, FW? Like negative vibrations causing hives? That sounds a lot like my hive reaction to overwhelming anxiety -- which was brought on, you know by massive negative vibrations in my Greek FOO Tragedy. My mom told me at the time, I was allergic to chocolate. LOL.... funny, because when I would go on a chocolate binge... it never brought on hives. But any time I went through any kind of HUGE life change (and there have been successive ones)... yup; I'd break out. Especially, when I "dared" to do something that was just for "me, myself and I"... and there was a good probability someone else (like mom) would make me pay an emotional price for it.

As far as I know - I'm not involved in anything like that at the moment. I've even put the brakes on pursuing getting untangled from my bro for the time being -- giving myself a break from pressure of making that huge a decision/taking that huge a risk. Checking off things elsewhere on the list - LOTS of things.

Maybe I'm just being TOO NICE to myself!!!! LOL......  actually, that's not bad as a theory. If I'm not allowing myself to feel guilty about resting my ankle - instead of slaving in the yard and then needing hours of ice & elevation - maybe my unconscious is all freaked out about "breaking the rules", you know? Maybe my unconscious is having an anxiety attack...   or -- maybe I have no friggin' clue what's going on with me!


LOL. I just wondered if anyone else had a long stretch of these awful dreams... processing out something toxic in one's system. That's what I really think is happening - dreams and body sloughing off poisons.

[Guest]

Yes, I've had the stretch of dreams, in the past. And yes, it's processing. Now I don't know what I might dream, or if!

Vibratory angioedema, apparently. Do check out the "Wikipedia" scratched into the skin of someone with dermographism on this page. Who needs tattoos?!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Urticaria

I wish my body was sloughing off poisons, but I've had this all my life. It can go in 7 year cycles too, oddly. With me I guess it moves around the body every 7 years or so.

[sKePTiKal]

I "think" - my skin crap is more associated with voicelessness - and curing it. I noted the reference in one of the wikipedia citations to the parasympathetic system. Except for the childhood episodes brought on by extreme stress, trauma and it's buddy anxiety (and the blatant lack of acknowledgement thereof)... I didn't start experiencing skin issues, until my body forced me to start looking for emotional/psychological causes of my lifelong conflicts. A few years back, I had horrible psoriasis symptoms on my palms and the soles of my feet. Except for white spots left behind - a lack of pigmentation in scar tissue, I guess - there's no trace of it now. Hasn't been for years.

It's difficult to say, whether there is an actual physical cause -- something medically treatable. I really have no desire to become a mystery patient who is passed around the system and a guinea pig for people's "educated guesses". Been there, done that. There are a few possibilities in that line of inquiry. Nerve issues, neuro issues, Lyme disease, allergies, etc. OR... if my body-brain connection is such that there is a stronger "expression" avenue from something internal to external via my body when I'm not able to verbalize what's really bothering me... or when I'm sure it's dangerous to say a thing... or when I'm highly discomfited - as in the case of "breaking taboos" when something is right for me... but was against the "rules" of who I was "allowed" to be.

The role of the parasympathetic system is calming, smoothly flowing energy that is soothing to mind, body and spirit. I have been in an internal negotiation with myself about reviving my tai chi practice - just for me, a type of "wellness" practice to counter just such crap as I'm dealing with physically. Just for the proven benefits I know I experience. My inner "slave driver" has so far thwarted beginning this... with the usual types of distractions that are tagged with artificially inflated "importance". I haven't acknowledged to my teacher yet, that I am involved in this kind of rediculous struggle with myself; it's highly embarrassing as I was a potentially really good student and I know she's a bit disappointed in me. There is an easy way out of the dilemma - just start practicing again... but... (???? but WHAT???)

If I can just "spit it out" (!!!!!).... I have a concurrent TERROR response joined to doing anything that "feels good" (or is supposed to feel good or is good "for" me). Like the saying: Love hurts. That's been engraved on my brain through repeated experience. And yet I know that it's the perversion of the truth - if it is love, it doesn't hurt. ETC examples... all connected to the progress I've been making on self-harm/sabotage. It's as though my brain won't accept the reality of an unconditional GIFT - here is a cookie, and no, there is no conjoined "price to pay" for accepting the kindness of a simple sweet. And then there's the awareness of damn, if it's really is TRUE... no awful price ALWAYS associated with the good stuff in life... oh, what a loss I've imposed on myself.

I have been able to "push through" and actually do/experience a different equation lately. Breaking the Taboo. In lots of little, insignificant ways... and a few bigger ones. And I wonder... if my unconscious (via my body connection) is trying get me to "pay the price"... the old pattern of trying to ward off even worse pain/abuse, by hurting myself FIRST. Some things remain intractable struggles of "will".

Perhaps, that also explains the odd awful dreams, too.

[Hopalong]

((((((((PR))))))))

I felt, reading that, that I was suddenly understanding the difference between self-love as defiant and self-love as natural.

Feeling the struggle you go through as you get from one to another.

It's not easy and natural yet.

Mine, neither.

But even if it's never ALL-natural, it's still the thing to do. Self-love, self-care. Not the same as selfishness. It's like taking care of our bodies (I'm doing a crap job this month) paves the way for everything else good. Skip that, all of it's undermined or off focus.

Preaching to myself,

Hops

[sKePTiKal]

Maybe that is so - the nature of the struggle - Hops. Maybe it is an attempt to get to "natural" self-love.

As many words that now seem to be spewing out about it, I'm a long ways yet from being able to peg it that simply... I need to let it play out, willy-nilly, and see what does "make sense" looking back at it. You could very well be right. I'm not ready to "tag it" yet, though.

I'm learning a whole bunch of new things, for sure. New approaches based on other things that worked for other purposes. Like, it's OK Hops if you couldn't keep to your chosen self-care for awhile. Acknowledge it. Pat it on the head and hug it. Tell it that it's OK and you'll try again starting tomorrow. That works way better for me than determined, fierce insistence on some draconian idea of "instant change". For me, the "old ways" have something nostalgic - akin to a security blanket - about them. You know how hard it is to take a 2 yr old's security blanket away to wash it? uh-huh... that's what I'm dealing with. I have to trade it not just A cookie... but something to keep it occupied longer than that.

It's also like trying to gentle a feral cat... gently break a horse to ride... gain the trust of an abused dog - that kind of thing. Even that kind of approach can set up waves of "threat" and fear, at least initially. I'm just not scared off from my approach anymore by the nasty growls, superfast swipes of a paw or the ears laid back. I just slow it down even more.

Overall the progress is forward for me - even with these moments of resistance; maybe over time they'll become more half-hearted; maybe I'll win my unconscious self over... patience, repetition, and acknowledging that this part of me has damn good reason to be wary based on the past; but it's no longer "the past" and much has changed. And when weird things like the dreams and physical stuff come up... it doesn't permanently derail forward motion.

Try again tomorrow (((Hops))).

[sKePTiKal]

So, it's tomorrow:

and progress is S-L-O-O-O-O-O-W. The dreams took a couple days off... and came back again. I have the sense that I'm being taunted, teased by them - dared even... to get emotionally upset one way or another, through outrage, fear or anger. YAWN.... I've already seen Clockwork Orange & a couple versions of Alice in Wonderland... this plot isn't original or interesting and isn't making any relevant points about anything.

Thankfully, there are plenty of things to "do" today in 3-D. And some of them are fun even.

[Guest]

Chopping wood is always fun?

this plot isn't original or interesting and isn't making any relevant points about anything.

PR, does there come a point where nothing, OR, everything, is relevant?

We choose what interests us, by being interested, or not.

And then we die!

[sKePTiKal]

Interesting, FW...

the question of whether it's all or never relevant at a given point. I don't know. Never asked that question!

Also don't know, about how much intention there is in what interests me. Maybe I'm OCD curious or something like that. I can be fascinated and engrossed in observing, studying, watching things without ever making a conscious choice about whether I will do that. I think that's kinda connected to a habit that SL mentioned over on Overcomer's thread: being programmed to always be conscious of other's well-being -- even if it's at my own expense. I never ask myself: self, is this something I really want to give attention to? I just do. There's a lot to be interested in, in this life.

And it's possible, that I could frame some of the aspects of this phase in terms of intentionally choosing what I will spend time, energy, and attention on... and setting some limits - boundaries - on that for myself. And that would be totally abandoning the "rules" of my zombie-foo... disregarding the "natural FOO order of things"... blatantly transgressing those perverse "laws of nature"...

... I can see where that might freak out my poor unconscious self who is probably waiting to be struck by a lightning bolt for even daring... to think... much less DO something so against the "rules". As if I'm not allowed to determine who the hell I think I am... or want to be interested in or do.

As if other people's idea of "who I am" is way more important than my own idea or definition...and I'm not allowed to deviate from THEIR idea.

Hmmmm. That kinda makes everything relevant, doesn't it? And irrelevant at the same time? [oooops! Zen Koan time again!!]

[Guest]

Hi PR

well, I bet there are lots of things that don't interest you, without you noticing? I like the idea of OCD curious, but think that would be pretty unfocussed, monkey-brained-curious.  I'm not always programmed for others' well-being, just when I pay attention. I guess that's a decision I make, yeah, I do (there's control freakery in there, watching other people do stuff and thinking...I can see the pitfalls, you can't, I will take notice because I choose to make you important to me).

Would it be nice to get the point where you don't have to think about setting boundaries (they are simply there). Esp if it's something you want to do.

Ah lightning bolts: they don't happen, or they happen randomly, and probably not to the 'right' people! As for the rules...you can only rely on your own. I know what you mean though.

Hmmmm. That kinda makes everything relevant, doesn't it? And irrelevant at the same time? [oooops! Zen Koan time again!!]

Yup. Easy 

[river]

Oh God Phoenix, it me again.  YES, I went through somethin rediculously similar. 

You talk about this as if its ok, not really troubling you and that could be right.   When I was going trho that is WAS  troubling me.  The dreams were so laced with horror.  No other way to put it.   
But maybe yours IS different.  You could be getting something called 'the triad'.  Its like when you move forward, the disorder counter attacks.   Once you understand whats going on, its easier to deal with it.   
Mine was so the same that I also had exzema.   It sooo complicated to explain it all here, and sort of intricate.   

I have a suggestion, ... or 6.   You're v. intelligent, I could suggest what to read that'll give you loads of knowledge and insight into the disorders/ mine/ yours theirs and etc.

Sorry, again, I just read the first post, really should be doing other stuff, but love to talk with you. 

r.x

[sKePTiKal]

Thank you so much, river! It's comforting to know others deal with some of the same things.

I am resolved at this point, that there is really only 1 way (for me) to approach this "problem". Problem is in quotes, because really I've been dealing with this since I was 12... I have done all the emotional forensics and memory archeology... I've read a ton about attachment difficulties and how that affects neuro development... experienced ways to deal with and influence that mind-body connection... (sort of like a serial dieter who never really loses the weight... until they stop dieting)

and this new place I'm in, is one of accepting that: hey - this is who I am and I understand why and it's not "bad", just embarrassingly inconvenient some times but it will get better over time, if I pursue this one single-minded and concentrated approach:

which is to love the part of me that's so fearful it's either fleeing or fighting or trying to harm itself... until it stops. Hug it till it it's not in panic-mode... it's relaxed... and it finally hears me saying that "it's OK, it's all right - I understand". That "other" part of me which has a form of will of it's own and feels separate from me... only needs mothering to stop. A "good enough" mother.

This works... and I can't really explain why or how... but it works. So, I'm rolling with it! After having so many other approaches start out so well... and eventually lose effectiveness or fail flamboyantly... this seems to be different. And it solves the one main functional problem in my attempts to sustain "changes"... which is that intense and uncontrollable resistance.

My goal isn't to "get rid" of that part of me... my goal is to heal it and integrate it back in a whole me. This part of me isn't the prettiest part, or the smartest... but it's fierce, determined, shrewd and calculating and very, very, very good at surviving... and that can and should co-exist with the daydreamer, the playful imagination, and the "marshmallow" sweet, sticky and gooey self that wants to adopt every puppy and kitty in the world. I guess that makes me complicated, but we'll just blame that on Mother Nature's way... or the Force... the Tao... whatever.

One thing I've noticed lately, is that this resistance has a knee-jerk reflex when another person tries to tell me "don't be like that"... "don't phrase it that way"... as if they are trying to define me and mold my expression of my feelings and self into something that THEY prefer me to be or want me to act like. Well, duh: that's kinda the most basic boundary, isn't it? I'm me... and you're you. And we ARE different, feel different, and act differently. End of explanation. And it's perfectly fine if people are uncomfortable with some of those expressions of me; if they don't like that. I'm generally more complicated than that; I'm not just that one thing 100% of the time... I can be happy... then I might be sad; angry... analytical... or passionately ranting. It isn't possible... it's an unrealistic expectation of others... that they are going to be exactly what you want them to be at all times. [Within certain socially agreed upon limits, of course! I'm not describing the rageaholic, sociopathic, rampant ego thing here - just the individual self.]

If that were the way people and relationships worked, my hubs would be an immaculate housekeeper, chef, landscaper and building maintenance man! LOL... he reserves the right to disappoint those expectations of mine a lot of the time, you know? And I still love him anyway. So... why can't the same thing apply to that feral cat part of me?

I guess, in a round about way, I've talked through to what "this" phase is all about.