Why Does Boundary Setting Feel so Traumatic

[Overcomer]

I know!!  I am on a roll.  I just hope it will all work out.  This morning my h came over and gave me a big hug.  I know he would be devastated to lose me..............he was so lonely before me.  Came home from work, listened to music, watched a little TV...no one to talk to.  I know his former wife probably left him due to his alcoholic rages - or at least that was a part of it.  He thinks he can just beat it.  All the literature I read after going to the meeting last night says alcoholism is a disease, just like diabetes.  They said you would never divorce your husband over diabetes, so why divorce him over alcoholism??  Problem with that, for me, is that he brought his alcoholism into my home and presented himself as a non-drinker.  It wasn't until he had me that he started the Jekyl/Hyde routine.  In fact, the first time I saw the flip was on our honeymoon.  All of a sudden, this angry, brutal man came out and I just couldn't believe it.  Then for the next year he drank and became Mr. Hyde on a regular basis.  Now he does pretty good at getting drunk but keeping his mouth shut, but occasionally that sinister man comes out.  So - I'm done - and if he doesn't get help, it's over!!  Plain and simple.  And my children will hold me accountable because I outed him this weekend!!

[penelope]

hi kelly,

wow.  something must have been eating at the back of your mind for awhile to make these decisions so [seemingly] suddenly?  remember that throughout this process, it may seem like things are getting worse, but they always do get better, k?

I am rooting for you.  You are worth it, you deserve to be kind to yourself and find a safe place.

hugs,
p bean

p.s.  When I stopped drinking almost 2 years ago, it was hard to be around drinkers and say "no thanks.   But now, people just accept it and hand me a soda.  They can think whatever they want, but they're the ones getting drunk, not me.   

[Hops]

Hey Kelly,
I apologize for coming out with this after all that urging, but I do need to add something. This is the only thing that worries me about AlAnon, but it's a serious concern:

They said you would never divorce your husband over diabetes, so why divorce him over alcoholism??

It's a vast over-simplification and it is NOT for them to judge that anyone "should" stay married in order to "work the (AlAnon) program." You deserve support and understanding, but I am very leery of some groups that impose an underlying religious judgement on someone else's decision about a marriage. (I actually disagree with that premise, pretty vehemently. What alcoholism does to a personality and a relationship is far more pernicious, emotionally, than a physical disease. Although certainly diabetes due to uncontrolled eating is self-destructive...alcoholism destroys not just one body, but whole families at the same time.)

So take what is useful and leave the rest! (Sorry to say boundaries are needed there too, but it's all about trusting yourself. You can do it!)

Hops

[Overcomer]

Well, Penelope, all this HAS been eating at me for years.  The nmom thing and the husband thing.  You guys actually got me to think and ACT!!  Thanks!!

And Hops?  I totally agree with you!!  He came into our marriage under false pretenses.  He told me when we met that he did not drink.  The truth was that he had been sober about two months when I met him.  We were married six months later.  Dr/Mr came out on our honeymoon!!!  Can you believe that?  On his best behavior until the honeymoon???  Suspicious.  Drunk.  Accusatory.  Jerk.  I put up with it the whole first year and told him "there's the door."  So I have watched him be pretty good for the last 4 years.  Still drunk but not raging.............until Friday!!!

So diabetes, I can deal with.  Raging drunk, I cannot!!

[penelope]

hi again kelly,

I cannot believe it!  That is very strange behavior indeed.  Also tough, for an alcoholic...(my T would probably say I bet he was sneaking drinks!  She is also a substance abuse counselor)

When I lived with my alcoholic b/f only 4 years ago, I was in denial about his alcoholism (and didn't completely understand it) because he was such a good convincer, so I know how convincing an alcoholic can be.  Especially when we think we should "love" them..ie, coverup, enable, etc.  He even convinced me that his high blood pressure due to drinking excessively, probably, was "OK" since he didn't plan on living past ~65!  If that wasn't a warning sign that he was bad for me, I don't know what was.  Why did I think it was OK to "let" him slowly kill himself everyday in front of my eyes, and that it was OK for me to put up with it, as he became more and more distant, and eventually completely emotionally unavailable?  How could I think this wasn't damaging and influencing me, and changing my whole person?

Since learning to trust myself, I hope I couldn't make those same mistakes about a person again.  I hope you will get stronger fast too.   

bean

[gratitude28]

So.... if you had a bad disease... diabetes or cancer, say... would you seek help?????? Of course you would. One of the guys at my AA meetings always says, if you had AIDS or cancer, and someone reached out his hand and said, here is the cure... all you have to do is follow the 12 steps... what would you do???
So, yes, your husband has a disease. I don't doubt that we alcoholics have a compulsion for alcohol and a reaction that is not "normal." But we can choose to get help. Sadly, many of us wallow in the I-can-do-it-myself thoughts that your husband still holds.
Kelly, you are doing marvellously... I am just so thrilled to read everything you write every day. And... by the way... some of the ideas in Al Anon can be used for dealing with your mom as well.
Love you,
Beth

[Overcomer]

Penelope:  Thanks for starting this thread.  It has gone from here to there and I think I kinda highjacked it.  But for me it was all about setting boundaries.  I am so thankful for this thread (and a couple others) because I have got some excellent feedback.  This is definitely cheaper than the $100 per 45 minute T.  By the way, my mom and I are going together tomorrow!!  That should be interesting.  I have to remember to keep my cool because she makes me crazy and sometimes I fly off the handle!!

I agree, Beth, that Al-Anon should help with all my issues.  I think it would work if you were dealing with an N (my mom) or a sexual addict (my ex) or an alcoholic (my h.)  Geez.  I've got them all around me.  (In fact, my 19 year old daughter is a lot like my nmom, when I get together with just those two I am ganged up upon and it is an icky feeling.............)  And I won't allow them to "make" me stay with my husband.  He's an alright guy when he's sober.  He's a little boring (as in he repeats himself over and over and over - almost like he is rehearsing something to me, to say to others..............like he just gave his two weeks notice and he told me he was going to say......blahblahblah................and he told me the story like 10 times!!)  And we really don't have much in common.  He is stuck on a rock group from the early 80s and listens to them over and over and over again.  He's obsessed with them and I find that boring.  So if I can deal with him boring me to death without being a raging drunk, I'll stay.  Sometimes I think I should get my ducks in a row so that if I decide to go, I will have an exit strategy......

But between you guys and Al-anon, daily Bible reading and self help books, I should do ok!!!

[gratitude28]

That'll be $100  hee hee.

You HAVE to tell me... what rock group is it???????

One thing they say in the program is not to make any life-changing decisions for a year while you get your ducks in a row. It's amazing how much clarity you get over that time and how you really do figure out how to deal with and solve problems!!!! The people around you are still the same, but they annoy you less when you are lloking at them differently

Love and more love, Kelly!!!
Beth

[Overcomer]

Well, he's obsessed with Journey.  I mean, it is over the top.  He has that CD in his car and that's all he listens to.  Whenever he has me in his car, I'm trapped and he plays that same CD.  Then he says, "Listen to that, Kelly, TALENT!!  I've got goosebumps!"

And I am not kidding.  That is word for word what he says and has said for the last five years.  It's like a broken record and is extremely exhausting!!

Oh, I don't think I'll leave him if he can stay sober.  And I am going to say this but will probably get some flack for it - I don't even care if he drinks on special occasions.  It doesn't bother me if he parties like say at a Christmas party for work.  We stay at this hotel.  No driving......I know I could do it and I hope he can............................does that sound stupid?

[Gaining Strength]

Yep.  The problem is .... there is no such thing as Just the Office Christmas Party.  As they say in AL-anon, "keep coming back."  That's the best way to learn - or the hard way.  I've experienced it both.  Hate to tell you - it's all or nothing. 

My late husband thought he could drink socially after 8 years sobriety.  He did - for a while and then it was all the time.  Pretty nasty.  Very sad.

yours - Gaining Strength

[Plucky]

Hi Kelly,
good luck with your mom and the T.  There are lots of people up here who have tried this (I have) and it wasn't pretty.  Has your T had enough time to know you and be on your side, or is there a possibility that your mother the N will convince him she is alright?

Others can counsel you better on this, I  just want you to be prepared for the risks of doing this so soon into your therapy.  It sounded like your T was ok and a safe place for you to go and vent and more.

Plucky

[Plucky]

Hi Kelly,
just saw your othe rpost where you went and it was ok.  This is good!  I think!  So your T was parroting what your mother said?  How did that go?    You ok with that?
Plucky

[gratitude28]

Have to add too that we of the drunk variety can't drink just sometimes. We can for a wee bit... but then it takes us over yet again and even worse.
You know, if he becomes the person he is, without the chemical enhancements, you might begin to even like Journey... or at least begin to start teasing him for being a dork. My husband is a dork a lot of the time, but so am I
Love to you Kelly,
Beth

[Overcomer]

Beth, I have totally lost that cool thing, too.  I still think I'm cool but I'm not!!

And Plucky?  No, I am not alright with the T.  She has him snowed (as usual....)  I believe that he thinks I am over dramatizing the extent of her persona...................he doesn't have enough first hand knowledge to know her or understand her.  The last T we went to said, "Well, all I can see is that Kelly doesn't like you................"  Well, we will never going back to him.  (Even though it's pretty much true, my mom cannot hear such truth........)

And my mom is so delusional that she thinks the problem is a two or three month thing - something we can counsel away.  So I told him, this is NOT a current situation, this is the same problem I have been dealing with for 12 years..............it is NOT going away.  We are at a stalemate.  The situation HAS to change.  Either she leaves or I leave or we sell...........................isn't it interesting?  She won't leave.  She would rather sell than give me the chance to do it on my own - no trust.  Problem for her is - I would be great and I don't think she could handle me making it successful without her!!

[Plucky]

Hi Kelly,
it sounds like you are trying to change the relationship with your mother by going into therapy with her.  My opinion, right or wrong, is that you are wasting your time, your money, and throwing away a perfectly good therapist. 
The only thing you can change is your own reactions to your mother.  Any other endeavor is a waste.   You do not need the T to second your opinions about your mother.  You just need to heal yourself and extract yourself from this unhealthy relationship.
Plucky