Mindfulness and codependence thread

[lighter]

Thanks, CB.

It wasn't me worrying about the girl's safety, bc of a neighbor.

It was the 2 hours of driving through 3 States, the mountains, at night.... DD19's vehicle is the color of the road, which might explain why people seem to veer into her at least once every time she takes to the road.

She's a fearless and very capable driver, but she's always always frustrated at other drivers. I think I posted about the truck driver who was brighting her and maybe trying to pass when he started steering INTO us and DD19 was so confused and upset.... this was a couple weeks ago, I think.

I just told her wer'e on the road with all kinds of people... crazy people, upset people, people in crisis.....not to let it bother her, but easier said than done, for sure.  She put several cars between herself and the truck and that was the end of it, but..... I don't know what she would have done on her own.  I assume handle it in similar fashion. 

Once my mom and sf watched an 18 wheeler truck drive off the side of the mountain, almost taking them with him...must have fallen asleep.  I doub't he survived.  They just kept driving.  If my kids get swept off the side of a mountain by a sleepy trucker.....I want to know and find them. That's more the worry for me. 

Lighter

[lighter]

Just when I think my friend is super woman she has a little crying jag catch her off guard.  We need to make a keepsake box of all the lovely things.....notes.....dh's glasses....touching little silly things blindsiding her all the time...little many numerous things.  She can sit and visit them when she's ready.

I feel pretty strong and by they I mean able to sit with her without breaking down too, though I have and feel no shame.  I do feel she does better when I hold steady.

I'm changing AC filters, finding frozen coils, tightening cabinet doors, cooking all the accumulated Sun basket meals  and cleaning, which she expected and appreciates.


Sometimes it feels like we're 29 yo and roommates again....a respite.

Lighter

[lighter]

I begin posts, when I have a scond, then forget to finish them, so erase and begin again.

My friend is sort of like a sister in that.... we're super honest with each other.  Last night I went and took a time out int he kitchen while she and her step son and his wife finished dinner.  My friend gets upset when he brings up his bio mom, which he'd just done at the table as my friend was opening another bottle of wine we DID NOT need..... and I didn't have the patience or nervous system to hang around for ANY of that, so I got up and did my own thing (instead of trying to make nice and cleaning.)

When they all started cleaning the kitchen, asking if I was OK.... I WAS ok, bc I was doing what I needed to do to stay level.  They cleaned up and I finished once they went to bed. 

I  noticed how I've set things up so everyone EXPECTS me to do whatever needs done to keep the peace or keep things rolling or keep everything level and..... I noticed what it felt like to step OUT of that self created role and STOP doing, bc it's not my job, not my responsibility, not my place, honestly. 

It was friggin amazing.  No guilt. No upset.  No stress or awkwardness AT ALL.  What an amazing expereience, whoo hoo.

I'd shopped for a beautiful dinner,  picked up fresh foie gras from  a restaurants in Atlanta with a little food shop out front and were kind enough to part with some, since they didn't have any in the shop. I scored, seared and served it to just us 3 girls, since step son went out.  We had  a tiny portion of sautern wine..... just like it was served in France. For dessert we enjoyed sour cherry almond dark chocolate and a citrus dark chocolate served with a Tawny Port once the step son came back home.  Just a leisurely, decadent evening.... I really like the step son's wife, who had a little terriier chee wow wa mix in her lap most of the time.  I got to hold that dog ONCE.... just NOTHING like a pug, who'll do pretty much anything for food.  Nope. This dog wasn't swayed by crunchy minchies, not at all.

My imperatives.....to get the medical equipment out, along with all the foods bought to entice J to eat when he wasn't hungry... had to get it to the food banks....the tons and tons of unopened meds to the drug depository at the Country Health annex, the small things laying around that knock the stuffing out of you when you leaast expect it..... a dumpster run, bank runs, eye glasses run to get new glasses ordered for friend..... she picked out two amazing pair matching her red hair.  Just lovely on her face.

We made a run to Home Depot....should have walked...what a magnificent evening it turned into. Breezy and cool.... we got a new kitchen faucet and cut flowers on the way home.  Hydrangea...... then spent the evening on the porch with candles, since the lights didn't work.  More to do, but the evening was lovely and relazed and included more port and chocolate, along with Thai lettuce wraps and fresh Thai basil from her little herb garden. 

The plumber and HVAC guy show up im the morning.   I'm up for maybe one more night, then heading back to the world.

Sometimes our stuff rubs up against each other and....
it's still OK.

Lighter

[Hopalong]

Good for you for not going into co-D mode!
I hear you vibrating to every current or small sentiment
associated with her loss. That much empathy is hard sometimes.

I felt sad for friend's block over forgiving stepson's mother
(assuming the usual story there) and for stepson who is
made guilty for speaking of his mother. It's a shame.

Sad all around.

hug
Hops

[lighter]

Ya, sad BUT my friend has an edge.....she is a taker of heads, ime.  Always has been.  In martial arts class.....she was.....sheer focus where I was maybe more focused on care for others.  There were incidents, one involving me, but we always work it out....she decided she didn't prefer me taking shots at her face while she was unguarded, for instance, when given the choice after punching me hard with the result being us the only ones in headgear during a training session.  There was a "chat."

Salt of the earth, she's compassionate and will jump in and get a job done as she did in all my trials, child care, trial prep.....setting up my father's outdoor moss covered memorial service with green wire wrapped trees filled with old photos and floral arrangements on posts, tables and the entire potting surface where BBQ feast was served.  She DID all that and would do anything a mission required. 

My point is.....she has the ability to go very flat and take heads as well as be warm and amazing.  I saw her face and eyes as step son brought up his mother...... honestly it was almost provocative in that he stupidly restates his bm's absurd requests and stated nonsensical reasons.....and he started doing it in the hospital room before removing the respirator......and there was wine at the dinner and SUCH awkward anticipation I sure did not have to be a part of, which is a game changer.  I see how boundaries work.  Am exceedingly grateful friend is on my team and know she's grateful I'm on hers. 

Maybe I can walk away without disturbance, bc I now understand the going flat and scary piece of her inner world, where my inner hamster wheel people pleaser previously could not.  Maybe it's......oh lawd......just a woman asserting boundaries and taking zero BS?

And I guess it's pretty common to view firmly assertive women that way.....and I did, but have come full circle to not caring how I'm viewed?

In any case, I didn't have to figure out or fix the bio mom piece, whatever was going on.  They had to figure it out on their own, without me as  witness in the splash zone.  It very easily could have turned into them against us, or me trying to calm my friend, which I'd done the night before while comforting her....I don't have much patience for......  I'm not doing drunk.....intentional conflict.  No.  I've used up my quota.

Loving people the way I need to and not the way they require has taken up residence in my chest.  This feels like another notch in the ratcheting down of shoulders and stress.

Today sub contractors arrive to get her cool and dry before her mom and sister arrive with J's ashes and comfort they've been straining to give my friend.

I think things have gone as well as they could have, particularly bc friend does cry and mourne and have her moments of dropping control. 

I'm trying to enjoy an Epsom soak before starting the follow the water leaks puzzle, remove sheetrock, turn off valves, dx damage, etc.

I realize....   I lost a bit if skin on left elbow falling down the stairs.   This shower door, installed backwards and at the wrong end of the tub, has to come out, yup.  There's a plan for that, along with master bath renovation bc water damage and mould.

I'm moving into the fridge clean out phase.  Will be nice and organized for her mom and sibs.

Oh dear.  Throwing out the apple sauce and old food upset her very much......she cried.

I wish she'd just taken my head.

Lighter

[Hopalong]

Eeeesh, going flat and taking heads sound intense, for sure. Not the personality type I'm drawn to, but I'm a wuss.

I feel badly for stepson who seems to feel internal pressure to carry messages or try to intercede for his mother. It would be nice if parents didn't groom their children to serve as (two metaphors alert: choose your own) their seconds or as messenger pigeons under fire. Drunk duelers or pigeons would be even worse.

Glad you kept your cool, Lighter.

So sorry to hear you fell down the stairs!!

Hugs
Hops

[lighter]

i guess you wouldn't say our personalitites are drawn to each other.  I guess you'd have to say we've been room mates, worked together on the Saudi hotel project, she joined my martial arts workout and trained law enforecement officers with us...... she's been my very good friend and supporter, even when things were very scary and she and her husband felt in harms way, bc the In Laws knew I was staying with her and sent peole to put the tracking device on my truck at her complex. I could see the fear on their faces and just as quickly I saw them straighten their spines and draw their circle of safety around me..... they didn't ask me to leave, though it wold have been easier for them.  She walked me out of the courthouse after the acquittal and she fended off the paparazzi.... she would have fended off an agry, armed, violent person with me/ffor me..... I can say this...... her strengths are not mine. Mine are not hers. Between us we are a force, but we aren't drawn to each other's personalities, though we can enjoy each other's company very much. 

We are both lacking and searching for more balance..... we learn from each other.  I noticed I never ever saw her go flat during her 14 year marriage...... that relationship provided balance in her life and I was always surprised by it.  I have to say.... I didn't like being limited....and I was in that.... her husbad wanted to DO things in the house himself and I'd show up, grab a caulk gun or want to and he'd get defensive.....I had to sit on my hands quite a bit though we painted the trim, kitchen, I caulked everything (eventually) and tore out the built in shelves in their master, throwing them out the window as I went. They had to leave while I did it, bc his discomfort was so intense.... he wanted to do it all, but wasn't too motivated to DO it.  I'd walk in the door and my motivation was through the roof.  I wasn't used to being limited by a man's tender ego or his permission....like that.  I was always shocked at her prioritizing his feelings and ego...... I honored it...... I appreciated they had each other's backs, but she KNEW I bent over backwards to make things go smoothly and she appreciated it.  In both my marriages I'd always swung a hammer, taken on multiple large projects with husbands EXPECTING me to work.... with babies on my hip in the second one. 

I was touched by my friend's husband's desire to shield her from that kind of work, yet.... it meant we couldn't bond and DO things the way we used to.  I had to learn to navigate it WITH her and I had to watch her struggle too.  I helped her hide her stuggle, in fact.  I saw it. I pretended it wasn't going on in front of him.   My friend was in the middle, all those times. Me staring at obvious easy work I COULD DO in a second..... while sitting on my hands, while her dh insisted HE do it when he got to it in a month or a year or never.  THAT was frustrating...... and she was ME for the first time..... trying to keep everything on track and going smoothly... all her sharpness gone, but feeling my discomfort pressing in..... going back and forth, placating.

 Interesting.  She pretended.  They figured it out.  Hmmm.....my father's voice is tapping on the inside of my sternum, asking for permission to give his opinion, in his words and I calmly told him it's OK. I know what he'd say. He doesn't need to say it out loud..... I know.  That was interesting.  Usually it just pops out. 

  She's going to be a adrift for a while.  I never had a chance to feel adrift or mourne the end of my second marriage.  There was sadness, for me, around the loss of the dream/perceived safety/family/husband and father, but only for a minute.  To my horror, he quckly became THE danger.  Assaulting me and threatening our children.  Maybe putting his hands on them in anger... whatever the Judge insisted he get to do... I'm sure he did.  I think I processed it in dreams.... never with consciously or with purpose. 

This morning I woke up with some pain in my body....almost impossible to put my finger on.... it was an undercurrent..... chest/shoulder/neck..... difficult to put a finger on, bc it wasn't sharp or the usual, familiar things.  Thinking about it now, I'd almost say it was moving around, like a pulse or electric current in a general area.  Left shoulder popping a bit....

I decided to spend an hour, not going to say meditating, but focused on breathe and the discomfort.   Will post about that later.

Lighter

[lighter]

My niece and I chatted during my drive yesterday. That was 2 hours.  To my surprise she wanted to keep chatting until she went out the door at dinner time... she had a date with her bf..... in a restaurant located inside a couple's home with seating for very few people during this Covid time....... and it took her a week to get that reservation. She was excited.  He had the duck with cherry sauce. She had the fish stuffed with crab.... she sent me pics. There were candles and clean white table clothes.  it looked very nice.

The main thing was....... she's navigating her role, her dreams, her future and making plans for it while piecing together traditional roles, non traditional dreams and her ambition...... she has ambition.   She wants a career..... to have interesting experiences in her twenties BEFORE marrying and having children.  She's seen what it looks like to skip having a young person's life and experience... skipping right into adult care for a home, children and marriage without being single and free.... traveling...... building a career first,which is what my mother told her to do.... it's what my mother told me and my sibs to do. 

I guess I'm saying her bf has been pushing for marriage for a while....... and he's likely a good choice for her...... but she's discerning and finding her worth and footing with boundaries.  I couldn't be more proud of her.  I'm amazed and happy to see her do the work to know and understand herself...... figure out a career path and seek out new experiences to discover exactly what she wants to build her world around.  So wise. 

Lighter

[lighter]

I just spoke with my sister and noticed something obvious.....upbeat caretaker souls Ben in solving other people's problems can be exhausting to be around.

I
Am
Sure I am THAT, esp when under stress and striving to make a painful situation bearable....
And I sort of got it.

I can dial that down, decrease the tension I myself create and still be myself

Whew.....it will be relief all around.

Will talk to my sister about it later today.

Lighter

[Twoapenny]

Lighter I'm clipping through posts trying to catch up a bit - this really caught my eye:

Loving people the way I need to and not the way they require has taken up residence in my chest.  This feels like another notch in the ratcheting down of shoulders and stress.

I think that is just so important - and yet so hard to do.  But I really think that if you've been raised or in relationships where you had to put other people's requirements first it's really hard to stop doing that and just be you - not what they need you to be.  Huge.  I really liked that you didn't fix that problem over dinner and just got on with what you wanted/needed.  It's hard not to be the fixer, but necessary, to fix yourself?

It was interesting reading about the messaging/not messaging thing on arriving home.  Here, it's very normal to let someone know you got back safe if you had a long journey.  Not usually even asked for, it's just done as a courtesy.  In the old days (before texting) people often would call the landline, let it ring three times and then hang up.  That was the sign that you'd got back okay.  Funny how things are routine in some places and not in others.

I was interested reading about your friend and your problems with her hubby and wondered if you could advise me?  Where do you think the line is between an intervention (I think this man is doing seriously dreadful things to your life and I think you should leave him) and just accepting that everyone's different and some people's idea of a perfect relationship is different to others?  We stayed with friends after crazy guy kicked off - I won't go through all the details but the boyfriend is disgusting.  I bit my tongue for four days but on the last evening lost it with him a bit and told him to f off (he went to bed in a sulk).  It was just interesting that you kind of chugged along with the friend you were talking about - where do you think you would step in and where do you think it's best to just keep quiet but be there if they say "I'm done with this fool"? xx

[Hopalong]

Lighter, that was such an intense chapter to bond through with your friend. Makes total sense it's a relationship that you feel pulled deeply to be involved in. What restraint you showed in respecting her own marriage chemistry. And how loyal you are. (Below, you'll see I'm struggling with the same Co-D theme.)

Your niece sounds amazing, healthy and free to think her own thoughts and trust herself to move ahead in life, making choices. How lovely. She'll get derailed at one time or another as humans do, but sounds like she has a very balanced nature.

Wondering back about the friend, want to say any more about what "going flat" means to you?

Lastly, Tupp I was glad to read your comment too. I've been getting over-involved in poet friend's crises in her relationship. She does repeat the same patterns over and over and I'm not sure my advice or insight is actually helping. I notice stress and tension building in me after I've tried to help. I want to recommit to just deep listening and offering more neutral comments like: "That has to be painful/frustrating/draining etc. What do you think you want to do?" It was a big struggle for me initially to take in that she was bringing him along as she moved away, because I've seen how toxic he can be. But the reality is that at that time she absolutely could not conceive of being alone, even with family now around the corner. Her abuse history left her very vulnerable and childlike at times, which I think comes out most in how she interacts with men. So she brought him along and now their relationship is spiraling down. I hate to see her so miserable but need to detach with love. Keep listening and caring but stop getting triggered when I hear her repeating the same communication or logic mistake.

hugs both,
Hops

[Twoapenny]

That's interesting, Hopsie, do you feel like you can just keep listening? And do you feel like listening helps or does it just stop the other person doing something about it?  I keep wondering about it.  It's like my friend has been brainwashed.  She's intelligent, well educated, has a very good job, she's good company, attractive, etc etc. And this out of work, alcoholic, ugly, boring, controlling and lazy man has got her asking him whether or not she should wear a coat and praising him to the rafters because he's managed to put a pizza in the oven.  She doesn't really talk about it because I don't know that she actually knows?  I feel like it's happened slowly and subtly and what started out as appropriate support (because he was out of work) has turned into enabling and co-dependency.  I hadn't realised how bad it was until I stayed with them.  I didn't know whether I wanted to shake her or punch him.  I can't stand to be around him, which makes it hard as she's never on her own now he doesn't work - even when we speak on the phone he's in the background.

[lighter]

Tupp:

My friend's dh was about 12 years older..... very sweet and his language of love was the same as mine.... acts of service.

I THINK he felt a bit defensive about ME doing the things he wanted to do for her and their new home, as well as a bit shamed by the fact he was a procrastinator, which my friend and I understood and stepped around so as not to hurt him.  There would come a time when she'd say..... I NEED this or that done, so we're going to press it this trip.... like her and I painting the trim, me caulking around the double oven or ripping out the bedroom built ins...... she'd give me the wink or have a word earlier.

If she was still hemming and hawing about pushing something, as to avoid upsetting her beloved, and he was beloved and cherished by her.... he felt the same about her...... I'd offr to do something then let it go if he said NO, not now, I'll get it, which he normally did, reflexively.

I also want to say he had 6 Catholic sisters and a very strong mother, so it was super easy to overwhelm him with what was large female energy aimed at him. Certainly, I hid my light a little less than my friend, who was invested in being cherished and cared for in a traditional way, even though she earned as much as him and was every inch his equal..... she wanted the traditional marriage they agreed on and built.

Had he been a beligerant drunk..... I'm sure I would have said it in front of her, where he couldn't hear, and hoped she sorted it out herself.  HAD SHE CONTINUED to put up with behavior I couldn't put up with.....I would likely have spoken my piece then removed myself, as you did.

From that point on..... it would be difficult to continue listening to the friend complain, let her talk then bounce over it without giving advice, even if asked for.  Once I get the feeling I've said everything I had to say 10X or more..... I need to say it a different way OR just remain compassionate listener if it doesn't compromise my own mental health.  I think it does, at times. 

I'm learning just how important boundaries are, bc I think it builds a framework of safety for me..... takes the guess work out, awkward moments and most of all..... any mystification around what's happening in a relationship like this.

I know it takes me a while to GET a lot of concepts, particualrly when my heart and nervouse system are involved.  I don't want people I respect and care for to give up on me...... I also don't want them to stop trying to help me understand something I truly would benefit from understanding.  Since I sometimes have to hear something 5 different ways to understand and internalize it..... I think about presenting information differently, or accepting the person just isn't ready to make a change.... and that has to be OK too.

It's OK for your friend to carry on with the pig.  That's not your job.

What IS your job is to state your boundaries, the consequences of not honoring them and then follow through without hesitation if the boundary is breeched.  You don't have to be around the pig, for instance, but you also don't have to listen to her complain endlessly, to the exclusion of all else, over and over again after you've said everything you can think to say...... more than once, IME.

If you can think of a way to say it..... differently..... maybe your friend hears something that pings for her.  Other than that, it's not good for you to force yourself to sit silently and endure the complaints, IME.  You can say that, with compassion, while restating your concern.....
she's worthy of better... better treatment, of safety, a reciprocal relationship with a partner and.....
maybe this is the most difficult to wrap one's mind around.....
of feeling safe and at home in her own skin without a man in her life.

You can't save her from herself.  Sometimes I understood a message when people stopped trying to convince me and let me feel the weight of carryng a bad relationship on my own....... once I understood they were done trying to save me, I freaked out and ended one of my relationships, bc I was suddenly alone...... everyone around me stopped stepping up and making me feel they were helping me carry the responsibility. They did it with shrugs.....
"We guess you really do love this unstable, violent man.  Let us know how that works out for you."

BAM!  like a lightening bolt..... I got it.  All their words and reasons did NOTHING to convince me where stepping back.... did.

Hops:

I've learned a lot about myself, how I view women and about my friend..... my own family... dysfunction and how important boundaries are.  How simple everything gets if we know what they are, use them and enforce them.  It's been a process and all the fear, obligation and guilt built into my nervous system has to be quieted long enough to pull pieces out of the eair and get an eye ball on them, IME.

Learning how to be gentle with myself and TRY to stop judging is part of figuring out things I've nevr made sense of before.  Getting comfortable with acceptance is certainly helpful.  Such a relief..... like putting down a big weight I never had to carry and resisting the urge to judge myself for picking it up or my parents for not teaching me to do better. 

My sister and I spoke anout all this earlier and decided our parents DID model healthy boundaries a lot of the time. They were mixd in with dysfunction and difficult to tease out, unfortunately.

Like I said....my parents did what they could, regarding my traveling with little kids, then released outcome.  I might still need a text or 3 rings, bc I would be the person who sent out the search crew IF someone I loved needed help.  I'll always be that person, even if I need to find healthier ways to express it..... and remain authentically myself.  I get to do what's important to me and I know depending on exterior things to be at peace isn't helpful.  I'm striving for balance, here.  Likely always will.


About your friend.... you are committed to deep listening, but it shouldn't cost you your equilibrium.  For me, that's about balance, again.  I think it helps our loved ones when we're able to be compassionate AND honest. Show them how to say difficult things without inflicting more harm..... maybe they can use that particular skill to help solve the BIG problem they've been dealing with through the years without change?

Interesting you talk about my friend "going flat."

My thoiughts are..... she knows me well and has listened to me shift into default savior problem solver mode...... and I move fast, fix and clean and suggest things she's already thought of..... it's frustrating for her, or anyone, to BE at the end of that, IME.  I know, bc my sister aims that fixer/savior/clean work SERVE reactivity at me....
and I recognize going flat, myself.  It's a defense mechanism.   I can block my sister's efforts more quickly, shut down her reaction and steer things back to things I CAN solve or work on or address without dissociating.  Maybe it's..... just losing all ability to pretend, Hops.

I want to say I haven't figured out all the fine mechanics of being nice, keeping things flowing, making things OK..... esp in social settings where I used to NEEEEED everyone to get along and create good memories for the kids..... whatever or wherever we are.

We're all grown arsed adults now.  It's time everyone learn how to state a boundary appropriately, enforce it and not blow everything up or go flat or take heads, IMO.

My father was a taker of heads.  My mother was too, come to think of it.  Golden Children.  They were scoffers and laughed and ridiculed and I don't like it.It doesn't belong in relationships I care about and I'm working on creating new languages.... for asserting boundaries with love...... but asserting without compromise when necessary. 

I'm brought face to face with consequences..... your friend and Tupp's friend likely fear losing their relationships with the problematic men in their lives.  They're not just thinking about what they deserve or are worthy of... they aren't thinking about teaching people how to treat us..... they're likely thinking about losing those relationships, of being alone, of what that fear will feel like and that brings up mor and more fear, IME.

WhenI think about my friend and my family..... I have to accept also the consequences of doing so.  I might not get what I need or deserve.  I might get shut down and told I'll never be honored or respected in the way I require. 

There's the possibility relationships and family will change in drastic ways I didn't intend or want to live with.

There's the possibility I'll be cut out, or discarded or abandoned...I chose those words, bc I think those are the words my nervous system would choose when fear''s driving my boat.

If I'm relaxed and thinking clearly..... I might not receive peace or respectful treatment over boundaries, but I see alternatives.... not endings to relationships I value.  There can be all sorts of solutions, when I can see what's there and not worry into the future or ruminate int he past.

Your friend and Tupp's friend.... might always be stuck in past or present and NOT be able to problem solve creatively.  Maybe that's the biggest problem....not the men, who'd likely be turned in for similar men IF the freind's don't figure out the root of the problems..... or symptoms, IMO. 

If I allow a man to behave badly, and I don't require better or remove myself....
if I continue living with an abuser.....
if I make excuses and allow bad treatment......
that's a different problem than adjusting my expectations in a difficult relationship.

Understanding I'm free to require better treatment is different than doing it while feeling safe and confident enough to be on my own.

In order to GET what I deserve, I have to state my boundaries AND consequences I'm willing to follow through with........
maybe I have to first accept the possibility the relationship would end..... being alone/losing the upsetting relationship would have to be something I've made peace with and that's a whole nuther piece of the puzzle.  Some people would never leave a relationship, ever... esp a marriage they're committed to. 

in that case, they have to learn a new language of self care, I think. Of acceptance and withdrawing with love in order to find their own peace and joy and emotional distance within the chaos of the relationship.

I accepted my friend wasn't willing to push beyond a certain point with her dh.  She and I had an understanding about her dh's procrastination, which got much worse in the year his health began declining.  I'm glad she was gentle with his ego.  I loved him too...he was kind and gentle and a truly good human being.  They deserved the tenderness they extended to each other.

But whew..... the condo needed attention..... the HVAC vents and plumbing and more caulking..... it was good for my soul, bc it allowed me to express my love..... acts of service.  The thing is..... I can't always DO and act and fix. 

I look for balance with recommitting to compassionate listening too. 

I know it's necessary and good and right, but it can't cost me my own stability.  There have to be limits.  Boundaries are good.

I spoke to my friend today and didn't talk about all the things I shared with my sister about this stuff. 

I don't need to have this chat with her and she has a lot on her plate.  I might bring up the conflict over my touching the fridge, and I get it. I wouldn't want her to touch all my little piles either, when I think about it.  I'll own what's mine, explain why I do some of the things I do, why I want to change them and what I'm working towards so she understands we don't have a problem between us.

I have a problem figuring out how to assert boundaries, discern the difference between greasing social wheels...... overstepping..... reacting vs responding.

She did nothing wrong. Going flat is and was a necessary reaction to boundaries being stepped on, IME. Yes, compassionately speaking about the boundaries would be prefereable, but we do what we have to do to protect ourselves.

We do better when we know how.

I want to end this with a time I told this friend "don't do that," very calmly when she went flat with me over something I couldn't fix.  I made a suggestion.  She went flat and took my head.... a small snarky taking, btw.  I simply met her gaze and stated that boundary... "don't do that."

She stopped.  Simple. We went back to having a lovely dinner in a lovely restaurant.... in our twenties at the time.

There was a time we DID handle things more quickly, more effectively, but we're carrying so much baggage by now.... the kids, the marriages, the siblings the parents.... Lord...... sometimes it's hard to find the thread.

If we had healthy boundaries in place..... things would have been so much easier, IMO.

Lighter

[lighter]

I drove home without taking ANYTHING from friend's very full fridge.  A mistake, I realize, as I opened cans of tomatoes and cooked off frozen grassfed beef to make....
chili... pasta sauce without onions, garlic or greens.

It smells amazing, however, with powdered and dried herbs alone.  Maybe,bc this is the first meal I've cooked for JUST myself in a long long time.

No one else to please or gain cooperation with. 

It is MINE and I am enjoying every inch of the smell, taste and choices..... a can of beans is ready to go.  2 packages of rice noodles are standing by..... refridgerated and requiring ONLY to be warmed. Cooking them makes them too soggy.  Easy and tasty and warm and perfectly suited to this windy cool day with many windows open in the house.

I feel like I can breathe.... almost fully.

I have a tendency to hold my breath...... have to pay more attention to that.

Lighter

[Hopalong]

So "going flat" as just stopping all pretending sounds really authentic.
I was watching the same scary TV about killers that Tupp had been, so I was imagining something like the sociopathic stare just-before-violence one always hears about. Glad you cleared that up!

I think you're spot on about the listening and the boundaries and the letting go of saving friends from their own bad relationships.

I think with my poet friend I need to get used to stepping out or away more rapidly. I focus hard on what she's saying, and damned if it's not a bit triggering. They are locked into a somebody's-gotta-WIN this argument stance, and it's exhausting just to hear about.

About her/their fears of being alone, boy can I relate. I spent a year after breaking off the future-commitment-pretenses with M and trying to be his best friend anyway, out of residual love and affection and some dependent fantasy he'd still view himself as a future security for me as "his best friend." And he often tried to encourage that with little remarks now and then... But since I wrenched myself through the NC decision, the amount of freedom and peace and energy to do new things and meet new people has been coming through VERY clearly. Don't miss M!

It's hard not to project that positive result onto friends when we see them spiraling. I actually feel as sorry for him as for her...he's out of his depth and she can be very condescending because an academic tone (lecturing and "educating" him about sexism, etc) really sets him off. Then he says something belittling about her that she takes as a sexist-pig insult, when I often think it's just he doesn't have her depth of language or education, and speaks like an older regional southern man from a brutal family. She has many right points but presents them always as his "homework" and he is condescending in turn because he's very insecure about who he is as a man in this confusing new social world.

Also, he has a felon son with bipolar and dangerously high BP who's pulling at him constantly for money and that pisses her off too, because he's contributing economically and she's watching him just bleed away his savings to try to rescue the son, who may not be salvageable. (That's where some of my compassion for him comes, because I know the desperation with a spiraling child.)

He's frantic on the phone with son all day and then she wades in and gets all furious about his comments and remarks that always begin with "YOU...never/always...etc."
I think they're in a very sad kind of cage match.

Meanwhile, you also remind me how important it is not to let my advocacy and love of my friend damage my own mental health. Thanks for that and I couldn't agree more, calm boundaries and stepping back -- NOT so much leaping in.

hugs
Hops