Gossip

[Izzy_*now*]

I think it had something to do with apologizing for getting ourselves caught gossiping...

vs......

owning up to gossiping and promising not to do it again.

::scratching head::

Thank you lighter

I am glad that you can tell the difference.

Many "sorrys' handed out are more related to being caught, than for committing the act.

There is another incident in my life that happened some 4 years ago. I have forgotten it, for the hurt, but not for the fact that it makes for a funny story. Because the other party didn't apologize, she has voiced to another person that she is 'afraid' of me. I expect she wouldn't feel that way, still, had she apologized. (It was about the possibility of her being charged with assault.)

One day, too, I will be laughing at Ami. Perhaps I can start right now and get it over with.

Izzy

[lighter]

It's OK, Leah.

Extending the same grace,  we, ourselves would like to receive....

is a lovely concept.

I just don't beleive in forgiving people, who haven't asked for it esp if they intend to keep commiting the same offense, without pause.

I think I've niggled all the clarity out of this I'm going to get.

Thanks.
Lighter

[Certain Hope]

I am pretty sure you have, Lighter.

I hear you.

[Leah]

Thing is Lighter,

We don't know -- just maybe this incident with spark off a change -- "all things to the good"  

Sometimes it takes something like what has occurred to cause a person to reflect deeply, and that can be to good effect.

Well, that is sincerely my heart and hope, always.

Ami did apologize and even openly proclaimed that she is flawed and wishes to build character.

So, yes, my heart is filled with grace and compassion -- for ALL not just one.

Love, Leah

[changing]

Deer Izzy-

You are such a Brainiac- not only regarding computers , but you discern the mechanics and dynamics of situations so well- I often feel foolish and grateful when I read your posts , as your exceeding good sense is quite an education!!!!

Your explanations of views and insights, without heat, are compelling. And your self-appraisals powerful. We are blessed to have you, and I want to emulate your exquisite example of mind, heart and good manners - showing respect, thoughtfulness, good manners and sincerity- we all need and deserve this.

You are not simply a Brainiac but a precious person with dignity and humanity, deserving of respect and fair play, in all aspects of your life.

Love and Respect,

Changing

[Gabben]

I'm not taking sides...just wondering if anyone here has stopped to ask Ami how she is feeling right about now?

I know how Izzy feels.

I know how Changing feels.

I know how others feel.

We all gossip, fact we all make mistakes, myself included, fact.


So, what about Ami...At the risk of having tomatoes thrown at me, I still ask, is she not entitled to some dignity?

After all...We are only human .....Well, at least us non-N's.


Lise

[lighter]

Izzy... I know that lady who grabbed your chair and pushed you, really upset you.

You never received an apology for it, and.....

you deserved one.

You may deserve one on this thread...  

and perhaps an explanation.

I don't think you'll recieve it.....

and that's a shame.

Which brings me to.....

part of our journey is giving up hope.

Hope that we can make sense, out of non sense.

Hope that people can do better than they're doing.

At the end of the day....

I calm myself with the belief, that everyone is doing the best they can.

::shrug::

If they could do better...

they would.

And so, it's true for us all.

::slapping self::

Sorry about that, Izzy..... sometimes I take the long long way round.

Lighter

[changing]

Lighter you are right- and COOL!

Hope you get a sunny nap in your garden tomorrow- you deserve it!!

C.

[CB123]

Question:

Is the actual activity of gossiping about another member of the board (any member of the board) helpful to the board as a whole?  Back to Darren's post:  is this activity for the purpose of joining or dividing the group?  Or, to speak in Biblical terms, is this speech for the purpose of building up or tearing down?

For anyone to get caught in the embarassing position of gossiping about someone else is a SEVERE MERCY (to quote C.S. Lewis).  Every opportunity to turn one's life around is a severe mercy.  A necessary mercy.  Ami's belief system teaches that everything that has transpired on the board up to this point was designed to bring her to this very place--because the damage that gossip will do to her inner self is far beyond anything that any one person on this board can do to her. 

Well meaning friends cannot bear to see friends hurt.  We want to rush in and stanch the wound, instead of letting it cleanse itself naturally.  I can imagine that Ami is feeling badly--but it isnt a wound to the death.  Unless her friends rush in and cover it up and let it fester.

Do you all realize how truly malignant this kind of stuff is?  I see a lot of whitewashing of something that is very insidious.  Izzy is putting it out there for the sunshine to show it up.  How else does it get cleaned up?  Ami is caught up in something that is going to sabotage her future happiness unless someone confronts her with it.  How is it love to not do that? 

I am serious, you guys.  I am really serious.  This is not an attack on Ami.  We are all grown ups here--it's time to act like it.

CB

[Gabben]

I am serious, you guys.  I am really serious.  This is not an attack on Ami.  We are all grown ups here--it's time to act like it.

We are also all wounded here, perhaps it is time to show some compassion, I know God would.


Lise

[Certain Hope]

Lise,

I don't know how to show compassion to someone I don't trust... that's part of it...

and I also don't know how to show compassion without enabling more damaging behavior.

What can we do?

Love,
Carolyn

[Overcomer]

My point earlier was................this whole sordid thing has gotten so out of hand you either laugh or cry.  I laugh............but it is not funny ha ha laughter...it is OMG you have got to be kidding laughter.  It is why oh why would this "thing" keep going and going and going...........this energizer bunny take on a life of it's own gang war on a emotional healing board???

[Izzy_*now*]

Didn't G_d say

"My thoughts are not your thoughts and My ways are not your ways"

I would like to leave G_d out of this and
as far as I am concerned...... Ami can stew in her own juices, if she is truly sorry, for committing a sin against me and not apolgiizing for it!
Ami's belief system teaches that everything that has transpired on the board up to this point was designed to bring her to this very place--because the damage that gossip will do to her inner self is far beyond anything that any one person on this board can do to her.  
Thank you CB, for that wording.

Izzy

[Gabben]

Carolyn,

You have the gift of tact and grace...did you know that?

Anyways....I know exactly what you mean. I have been suffering from the same question with my own lifetime enemies.

It seems that we are in a quagmire here. There are people on the board who we do not trust because they clearly violate us time and time again.


So, then what do we do?  Especially, when we want to trust someone?

My guess is that I have to reach to love them...I have a feeling that many here have reached to love...but, it did not work.

Perhaps, I am just projecting....when I make a mistake I am in the confessional confessing it and asking for God's Mercy as well as for His grace so that I will not hurt others in the very ways that I have been hurt....and, yet I still fall and have to accept that others are not going to be as merciful with me as God is.

I completely understand.

How do we trust?

There was much in CB's post that I applauded to. I also just know that hammering someone with the ganging up approach and the shoving with shame into a corner can actually work against that person rather than for them. (in some cases.)

I dunno....I just dunno.

These are just my thoughts and words.

Lise









 

[lighter]

CB....

brilliant.

Truly.

How is it helping, if we enable our friends to remain mired?

If we relieve the shame, that may turn catalyst....?

How will they ever transcend self defeating behaviors?

Lighter