Daughter Update

[Hopalong]

Well, lordybove, I am going to try to summarize this.

I'm pretty sure my D got the M.S. as she sent me her resume to proofread and is meticulous about describing things and she put it on there. I don't want to ask though as I was nagging too much about her last class and she said she didn't want to talk about it any more. If she didn't polish off the last class, the earth won't stop turning and she'll just have to deal with it as she sees fit. I think/hope she DID though.

Other news:
Just as she was settling into her new house-sharing, job hunting, etc... her car died. $4K to repair. She can't, I can't.
Email exchange ensued: she got snarky in her panic. I set boundaries. Told her I can help her with shelter. VERY worried about her situation (money enough for a month, unrealistic fantasies about coupons and bicycles).
Her relationship with her landlord/housemate deteriorated under the stress. She finally twigged she's out of options. Decided she would come home. I offered a very limited amount of money which, added to what she has, will get her a 1-way UHaul home. 18 hour drive. Hard but no other thing to do. We got in a pretty good place by email anyway.
Meanwhile, she'd months earlier bought a very cheap ticket to visit friends. I was concerned about her going but since it was nonrefundable and she'd have free shelter and food while there, thought it would be good for her to be with friends who love her, as she's been so stressed and isolated. She went.
Today she called to tell me that SHE SLEPT THROUGH THE RETURN FLIGHT.
So that means several hundred more are needed to get her back down there, to rent a truck and make it to safety (which is pretty much what it's about right now).
I am stunned she did that.
I sympathize, I know she was exhausted...but we had a tiny tiny window of opportunity, financially, that was pushing us both too far already...

And this is
just
about
too
much

I'm restraining myself from rescuing her outright but kind of in shock.
She was against the wall, reeling, and just shoved herself right through it.
Now she's sitting under a pile of bricks.

Hops

[Izzy_*now*]

OMG Hops,

Seems the first that came to mind was "We are responsible for our own actions" and all this is about oversleeping. I, too, am stunned!

I feel like I am under a pile of bricks in offering anything but--

I am so sorry this has landed on you!

Love
Izzy

[lighter]

So..... what are you going to do?

Does her bf not work?

Do her friends, who love her, and didn't wake her for her flight,  work?

You can bail her out again, but you set a boundary, right?

She finks out bc she can?  Or do you think it's something else?  Passive aggression?  Self sabotage?  Did she drink too much? What do'ya think?

Mama's always been there and she's probably pretty sure you'll be there again.

How awful she must feel about this: (

Sorry.

Mo2

[Hopalong]

Her friends are home with a new baby who's ill...two chronically ill childen.
That's why she went to see them. She was very excited because she'd been able to buy them 10 glucose monitors inexpensively with a coupon she found. (I think it was glucose testing kits or some such...)
I believe they, or the Dad, are working...

I don't think her friend is really a bf, but I'm not sure...he's a sweet slacker as I understand it. Don't know if he works but he sure doesn't have his life together.

I don't know what happened, maybe drinking was part of it...she said she was exhausted. I believe that. She's been stressed to the max for weeks and ws probably finally feeling safe. But I really don't know.

I don't know what I will do or should do or can do.

I'm worrying...as usual, she said, I'll call you back (after I get something to eat)...and didn't.

I did say to her right away, You don't have the money and I don't have the money.

It's terribly discouraging. No point heaping coals.

But then.

Hops

[bearwithme]

Oh geez Hops.  You are in a quandary for sure.  Have you heard from her?  I guess my only input would be is to let it ride out.  Let's see what she's going to do and if she begs and pleads and is really, really stuck, then you go with your gut.  You go with your gut and it won't steer you wrong, albeit, it won't feel like the right thing to do because she has blown it royally and there is not way for you to stay out of it unless you decide that's the way to go.  If there is no money, then there is no money.  On both sides, end of story.

This is challenging I know.  But it's beautiful in the same tone.  I don't know why I say that but I really think the situation is magnificent, in the poetry sense of the word.

I wish you the best Hops!!!!

Bear. 

[CB123]

Jeez, Hops.  What was she thinking????

I like Bear's outlook.  It really is poetic.

I know you feel bad and want to help....but what if you were to just sit tight and let her find another way?  At some point in her life she is going to have to do that....you won't be CAPABLE of always being there. 

Think of all the GOOD that is going on in this...she is in  a safe place, with friends, she finished school (so she's not missing an important exam).  She's NOT stuck in an abusive situation and cant get away, or starving, or on the street. 

Maybe, subconsciously, she wanted to miss the flight so she could stay with her friends longer.  She has to put up a show of being panicky, and if you jump at that and bail her out, it might not be what she's really after--or maybe even what is best for her.  I can see how a couple of weeks with a family that deals with two chronically ill kids could make her see the world with a different perspective.  Ask me how I know  .

I dont think is such a terrible situation.  Be careful that you arent stepping back into the caretaker role too quickly.  It is familiar, but maybe not in a good way.

CB

[Twoapenny]

Hi Hops,

I remember reading a thread you posted about your daughter a while ago.  Sorry to hear things aren't much better at the minute.  I feel for you; my son is only seven but I'm dreading the time when he's grown up and I can't just make it better or keep him hidden from the world and how bad things can get at times.

My thoughts on the situation are this:  I firmly believe that we all have a path to follow in life, and other people aren't able to influence that path or the choices we make along it.  We have things we need to learn at certain times and it's a process we need to go through.  It's tough and the lessons are often harsh, but there's usually a good outcome somewhere further along the line.

i was in a situation in my early thirties that seemed pretty desperate and then I was rescued.  I was moved into a nice house, in a nice area, within easy walking distance of the things I needed to get to.  There were good schools nearby, the transport links were good and I had friends in the area.  All of that sort of fell into my lap, it was a real gift.  What happened next was a whole new thread so I won't go into the details, but I screwed up and six months later I'd lost the house and a good friend in the process.  It's taken me five years to get back to that place again, although I never got the friend back - we speak but the closeness we had is gone and we see each other infrequently now.

I learnt a lot from that experience, although I didn't know if for several years after.  People were bending over backwards to help me but it made no difference; that was what I had to go through to learn what I needed to learn.  I can't imagine how tough it must be for you, but I agree with CB - she's safe, she has food, clothing, shelter.  Maybe there's lesson learning going on here and that lesson needs to be learnt, no matter what?

I hope you are feeling better about things soon xx

[lighter]

::Raising hand::

I'm thinking bus ticket or calling around to see if any car dealers or rental agencies need someone to drive a car back to Florida.

She can solve this..... it's not the end of the world.

It's another opportunity for learning, but you can't be the only one learning lessons here.

Right?

((Hops)) 

[Hopalong]

THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH.
I can't tell you how much your posts have helped.
Right to the heart of the trouble, not panicking with me, steadying me.

Thank you, thank you. I really am so very grateful for your thoughtfulness and support.
Izz: We are responsible for our own actions...
Bear: Let it ride out...
CB: Sit tight...
Tupp: Lesson learning going on...
M02: Opportunity for learning...

And how deaf would I have to be to not hear you?

I trust this wisdom. You wise people.

I haven't heard from her and that's probably a sign she's figuring out what to do.

Thank you for caring, please send my stubborn daffy prickly girl some light.

xxoo
love
Hops

[HeartofPilgrimage]

Hopalong, I really really feel your pain (I know that sounds like a cliche but I mean it). I am in the same spot with my adult son. His circumstances are different but it all boils down to loving them deeply and wondering where the boundary lies between helping them and crippling them with our help. When you didn't have many (or any) decent examples in your own life of good boundary-setting, and you are learning it all from scratch, it's all uncharted territory ... can I use the metaphor "boundaries" and "uncharted territory" for the same situation? 

Everyone that has posted to Hopalong ... you have been helping me too. I am deeply grieving over my son right now. And I am hesitant to give many details because I am paranoid about people in my 3D life finding me here and using it against me. Or maybe it's not paranoia when they're really out to get you ... LOL!

I am the LAST person to have anything useful of my own to contribute to the conversation concerning your daughter ... but I do want to say that I don't think what is "average" in our society is necessarily "normal." There is increasing evidence that narcissism is on the rise. I have also read where the generation that grew up in the Great Depression (speaking of the U.S., of course) have the highest levels of self-efficacy of all the population (self-efficacy being the belief that you can do whatever you set your mind to do). This is thought to stem from the fact that they had to contribute to their families' survival from early ages. Yet of course none of us would choose for our 13 year old to quit school and go to work and give us their paycheck just so he/she could develop self-efficacy! So I guess what I'm saying is that when life throws our kids curve balls and they have to rise to the occasion, it hurts us horribly but maybe it's not as bad as we think.

Of course, I am feeling like such a hypocrite writing this. It has never been hard for me to say "no" to my kids when they wanted something that was bad for them, but I always agonize when they want something that's good and I have to say, "No, I can't give that to you."

Your partner in parenting, Pilgrim

[Gaining Strength]

I am so sorry Hops.  I cannot imagine how stressful all of this is.  I am thinking about you both.
Wish I had a decent suggestion.

[sKePTiKal]

BREATHE, Hops! 
She has more resources than either you or she knows.

Case in point, another story from my crazy-kid archive...

H was independent from the time she got her driver's license and her first car was a '61 Olds; V-8; huge hunk o' steel on wheels. We lived in the middle of nowhere WV and all her friends were in Ohio - she made regular trips back & forth... at 16-17. One trip, in the days before cell phones, I got a call from her on the night of her return trip. She was about 200 miles from home in a sparsely populated area of the mountains; the fan belt broke and of course, the car wouldn't "go"... what should she do?

And for once, I didn't have any advice! I was stunned & trying to sort it all out. I was a little angry she waited so long to get started on the 5-6 hour trip, that it was now the dead of night... she couldn't really explain in a way I could understand just where she was stranded... and I knew it would take me hours to reach her, in any case. About the time I'd decided to get dressed and call her back at the number she was calling from, she called again. She'd made it to a truck stop and they put a Mack truck belt on the car. She'd be home in a couple of hours, after another cup of coffee. How did she get to help?

She used pantyhose in place of a fan belt!

My point being - that years from now, this kind of stuff makes great stories (as well as making us gray-haired!!). It will be OK, Hops. One way or another, it will be OK. God knows, we will always have a PTSD reaction where our kids are involved... there should be a subset classification for kid-induced PTSD... it never feels good when you're going through it; but each time you're both learning a bit about how to do it "better"!

[Hopalong]

What a strong resourceful daughter you raised!
Mine is, too, in many ways...strong and tough but not practical.

She is flying back to So. FL today and will call me and we'll talk about the numbers.
Because I want her to get to safety, I think I will have to increase my contribution
to her UHaul. I'm thinking through ways to make it all right...only one I've come up
with so far is:
--I donate the $250 I had already said was my limit
--whatever is over that, she must pay back or "work off" by doing house things (apart from ordinary cleaning that we'll share)

I'm not sure that's a good idea though. I don't anticipate the idea of negotiating or nagging her about helping at home and would like to be in a position with her where our relationship doesn't become about that. Anyway, she still owes me $500 from the prior debt.

She spent a couple nights at the home of a friend of hers, her age, who was diagnosed with Lou Gehrig's disease about a year and a half ago. She wrote me that she feels better about her situation after that, which I took to mean she got some perspective. And her email was an adult message.

I think I would like to also see how she responds here -- if she hustles, finds work, and behaves responsibly, well then that would be wonderful.

I remember being "stuck" at home after college when I had no plan and how much I felt I'd gone backward. It was a major motivator for me to earn money, find a shared place with friends, and ultimately I went to grad school. So if she really wants a PhD (which I think is a good idea for her), then she can work very hard for a year, save up for a car and some living expenses, and it could work out fine in the end.

Thanks for caring Amber...what's your brave D doing now?

love
Hops

[sKePTiKal]

She's learning to weld (jewelry for now - machinery later)... unpacking the quilt materials she's stored for a year, in the latest new "place" and trying to decide what her next "phase" is going to be, where, etc. She is barely getting by... but she IS getting by and digging herself out of "old holes"... mostly on her own... and closing old chapters of her life... and repairing damage to her self. This has taken a year, so far... and will likely take a little longer... but she doesn't want much help.

I don't get to help often or too much, on the latter... and apparently I'm not a huge cause (like I feared I was) of that "damage". We are able to talk through this... when it comes up... but the time/opportunity - or need - is diminishing. She's becoming self-sufficient, emotionally, too. (Fingers crossed!!)

[Hopalong]

You are the cause for her turning into the kind of person who rebuilds her life.

xxoo
Hops

PS--welding, wowzers! Hope she winds up with a Union card. I'm totally impressed.