Author Topic: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....  (Read 4639 times)

Gabben

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Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« on: August 12, 2009, 04:10:38 AM »
This past year I was laid off my job of 4 years, but not because of a slow down in the investment banking business that I was in but rather because there was cheating by my bosses, padding their expense accounts in large amounts, I refused to be a part of it; they, in turn, slowly orchestrated my lay off with the excuse of "company restructuring." I cared about my bosses and liked my job - it was a loss, it was sad, but I was OK with it just being life on life's terms.

There was severance pay but that eventually ran out. I was told that I could receive unemployment benefits along with the severance pay, so I filed a claim and was approved for money....BUT, then, unemployment fouled up , they neglected to follow through in sending me money, someone made a mistake and my claim was overlooked. For over two months I have consistently not been able to receive money from them. I submit resumes, weekly, getting a few interviews but not getting the job.  

In the last month I received no money from EDD , zero checks. I have had to take distributions from my retirement account (I'm only 41) to stay on top of paying bills and just to cover basic needs. I've called them, there is absolutely no way to get through their message system, they hang up on you with a message that they are too busy with calls to handle your call. I send emails with their delayed response telling me that I need to wait until the end of August to receive a call from them to determine eligibility, again, for benefits even though I already received a call from them, way back when I first filed, I have already been awarded benefits. I have sent letters, no response... and then finally a response that gave me hope but then they once again someone neglected to follow through in sending the payments to me and my hope was smashed to receive money. It is triggering wounds....

As I write this out I can see that I am not REALLY bothered by the lack of money although it does help to feel financially secure when you are deep in FOO pain, but it is mostly the being denied benefits that is triggering my baby wounds of Neglect.

Ami/Helen wrote on another thread that the pain of neglect is such a hard wound to see and take responsibility for because it is so invisible, especially if the emotional neglect was the first and most of the reality that you experienced as a child, how could you know or comprehend another reality?

After having expressed my pain here on the board I received an internal message, MN introjection, that my pain was too much, that I should lighten up and stop talking about it, writing it out and deeply owning that deep hurt of what it was like to be neglected as a baby and child, not just for a day but for years and years, day in and day out. The message that I tell myself is that I already wrote about the pain once or twice here so I should just shut up and forgive in order to not suffer the pain, but forgiveness is a process, not an idea that you apply in one moment of reflecting or understanding. The heart moves slower than the mind. I'm afraid that I will bother people with the "recycle." But, that is exactly how I felt as a child, afraid that I would bother my mom with the recycle of my needs, I needed once and that was enough, I cried once, and, for the N that is more and enough.

I can hear my mom saying "enough!"

So I am still in the deep wound/memories of child neglect but I am afraid to write about it and just take good care of myself around the wounds because I feel ashamed for having old baby rage and old baby needs...I feel ashamed for being in pain, I am afraid, just like when I was a baby, that my pain is TOO MUCH for you, too much for life. That is exactly how I felt as a child, that my VOICE of expression of need, was TOO much for my mom. So I shut it all down out of fear, and now, I have repressed anger that needs a channel, but I feel too ashamed to be in anger, so then the anger gets acted out in self-abuse.

Bleh....writing this out is helping me see and take ownership for my pain, which was not my fault, but I still hang, or cling, to the belief that the pain was my fault; since I was just a baby and my needs and pain was how I identified myself. I feel like one big blob of self blame who punishes herself for being "bad...............because I need too much."

Lise


« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 04:35:23 AM by Gabben »

Meh

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2009, 04:57:57 AM »
That is too bad about your job! Unemployment process sucks. I got it but my company threatened to take me to court over it, they set up a court date, stalled for a second court date and then those bastards didn't show up for the second date. I was soooo ready for them!!!! I wonder if they were just doing it to be jerks. The judge told me that the truth comes out in the end, and the company probably realized they didn't have a case against me. I got the unemployment but I had to go through a lot of hassle.

I'm currently unemployed, that is part of how I came to this board. My job loss was not due to the economy, this event increased my depression and brought up all over again stuff that I thought I had already healed from. I was so physically in shape and spiritually light and mentally sweet when I started that job, it changed me, my self esteem plummeted. I've also gone through my "life savings". Not to complain about paper money but I worked hard for it and there were some hopes and dreams in there....

I've never felt so much anger in my life. I know my anger is real but I think it has lingered too long for my own good. 

One step forward..and two steps back...   I had planned on writing about this but haven't gotten that far yet. I'm not sure if I want to relive it one more time, I already went over the story in my head too many times. That story is going to have a lot of *bleeps* in it.

Wow...I think I can relate on this one!


Ami

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2009, 05:26:34 AM »
Dear Lise
 I have that feeling a lot--- that I will be TOO much for s/one and they will reject me. I had it last night with the person I talk about who helps me so much. I felt like I was too heavy and too needy and I started feeling weird and pulling away.
 A FOO pattern feels real to present life but it is a replay,as you know. However,  we must play it through but with s/one who won't repeat the abuse and will help us to see that we are OK having these feelings.
 I did that last week with a similar pattern.I was sobbing that my guitar teacher was "good"(white, perfect) and *I* was 'bad. I really saw it as true b/c he was not screwed up from his FOO.
 I sobbed and the person said,"No, it is not about good or bad. You had different experiences than he."Later, I saw the distortion from both crying and a person giving me a different path than my M who told me I WAS bad if I was not perfect.
 I think you need to be needy,needy,needy and have people love you and say it is OK. Then, it will break and you will see the truth under it.
 I think you see the truth intellectually but STILL feel you are "bad" cuz you have needs. That is my feeling. Reject what doesn't fit.
 I don't think your little girl is being too needy or in too much pain. She is in pain. Let s/one else go through what you did.Then, let them judge.
        XXXXOOOO   Ami
 
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2009, 05:33:11 AM »
Dear Lise
 I have that feeling a lot--- that I will be TOO much for s/one and they will reject me. I had it last night with the person I talk about who helps me so much. I felt like I was too heavy and too needy and I started feeling weird and pulling away.
 A FOO pattern feels real to present life but it is a replay,as you know. However,  we must play it through but with s/one who won't repeat the abuse and will help us to see that we are OK having these feelings.
 I did that last week with a similar pattern.I was sobbing that my guitar teacher was "good"(white, perfect) and *I* was 'bad. I really saw it as true b/c he was not screwed up from his FOO.
 I sobbed and the person said,"No, it is not about good or bad. You had different experiences than he."Later, I saw the distortion from both crying and a person giving me a different path than my M who told me I WAS bad if I was not perfect.
 I think you need to be needy,needy,needy and have people love you and say it is OK. Then, it will break and you will see the truth under it.
 I think you see the truth intellectually but STILL feel you are "bad" cuz you have needs. That is my feeling. Reject what doesn't fit.
 I don't think your little girl is being too needy or in too much pain. She is in pain. Let s/one else go through what you did.Then, let them judge.
        XXXXOOOO   Ami
 

I love you Ami -- that was a comforting thing that you wrote to me..so helpful. It is 2:31 AM here and I have been in stabbing pain for hours, I cannot sleep. After reading your post, which I will take to heart, I think that I can finally fall a sleep. Just like a baby...I am up, crying in the night and in pain....needing.

Your post is very insightful, I will dissect it tomorrow to see more what you wrote especially the intellectual part, that is true for me. I need to reflect on that.

Ami

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2009, 05:40:23 AM »
Dear Lise
 I got up early and am  glad I put on the computer. It takes a special person to help us out of our shame. I found it with the person I talk about here. Most people don't have enough stability themselves to help a hurting person still in the FOO shame. They push us away b/c they feel weak inside and don't want to  look at themselves.
 That is why it took Alice Miller 20 years ,I think , to find an Enlightened Witness . Look at the resources SHE had and still it took so long to find the right person.
 I think I am realizing I am not bad but it took s/one loving me and letting me pour out the baby shame, needs, tears and baby thinking and not re-shaming me.
  ((((((((Lise))))))))))             XXXOOO Ami


PS Alice says that you need another person to walk with  you when  this shame and pain comes out b/c it is too hard to bear alone. They do what the good M would do----NOT re-shame us.
 
« Last Edit: August 12, 2009, 05:42:51 AM by Ami »
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Meh

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2009, 06:47:59 AM »
Lise don't do the the self abuse ok?
I'm ok with you writing about any of the needs that you think are too big or too many or recycled.
I figure if people don't want to read it they don't have to open the post.
No fear is too small to write about.....
Gosh people write about their fear of spiders, losing a job is a big deal. - and then the old feelings on top of the current event
I'm sort of new here on this board but as far as I know there is no rule that says that you can only need one thing, one time, and you can only write about it once. I did not see that rule.

Here is a stress scale, you have probably seen it before, job loss is near the top, I like to look at it sometimes, it helps me put things into perspective. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holmes_and_Rahe_stress_scale

Every single person has needs. Needs are pretty darn universal. Needs never go away, you can't reject yourself enough to make your needs go away.


Ami

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2009, 07:00:19 AM »
*I* am with Helen. Talk about needs, shame, pain, all of it. *I* am here and I won't get tired. If people do, they can ignore. If they harrass ,you can get a NC and then you will be around the people who will encourage your baby to heal once and for all.        Love you very much,  Ami
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Ami

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2009, 07:19:22 AM »
 I am finally getting a more solid sense of self like I had in my teens. The NM demands that you become an object. Your value is in what you do for her. You get punished when you don't meet her needs.  I took this paradigm out in to the world.
 I did not feel like MY self was a valid entity.
 The main ingredient in my healing was letting my terrified little girl show her face to s/one.
 Whe you have an NM ,you have a certain set of experiences and you must let them go at a deep level in order to reclaim your right to live as a human being, not their object ,still. We deserve that. Don't let anyone take it from you!
        XXXXOOO  Ami
   
 
No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Ami

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2009, 07:38:39 AM »
I think that what happened to us at a bodily level was we could not attach. So, there are parts of us that ARE still  the little baby . We want to heal so keep letting them out in the cry for s/one to help us heal but many people reject us b/c the needs are past and the people don't know what to do with them.
 Maybe,people who could attach have no idea what we are talking about. I had been rejected for years until I gave up. When I came on the board ,I was crying from this deep part which couldn't attach.
 Many people did not understand but I did find a person who did and I did attach--over time.
  Attachment was so much more visceral than intellectual. It was my body learning to trust. 
  It was God.        XXXXOOOO    Ami
 
 

No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.        Eleanor Roosevelt

Most of our problems come from losing contact with our instincts,with the age old wisdom stored within us.
   Carl Jung

Hopalong

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2009, 08:00:00 AM »
Hi Lise,

I am so sorry about the unemployment and the bleeping bureaucracry's inconsistency and terrible performance. I can imagine how that would re-trigger feelings of neglect. As to:

Quote
The message that I tell myself is that I already wrote about the pain once or twice here so I should just shut up and forgive in order to not suffer the pain, but forgiveness is a process, not an idea that you apply in one moment of reflecting or understanding. The heart moves slower than the mind. I'm afraid that I will bother people with the "recycle."

Bracketed by the self-judgment is the truth. Nobody else has your healing timetable, and you are not going to neglect yourself.

You've picked a wonderful place, imo, to write and process and describe ad infinitum. It harms no one for you to say things as repeatedly as you need to say them, or to look at them from new micro angles.

It is what it is. You have identified a little girl in need, you have even come to identify with her. And there's no creature more repetitive in this world than a loving mother who is nurturing and determined to protect and love her child.

So one way of looking at all the restatement of your reality is that you are mothering. A child cries over and over, eats, messes, cries...many cry daily. The mother listens to see what the crying is about, does what she can to ease the distress. Eventually, your inner child learns she will always be heard and always be loved.

You're just catching up, and the board is a very absorbent, entirely voluntary place. Don't punish yourself for something that is victimless.

I think that little girl, when she's past babyhood, is going to look at you with trust and she will relax. I don't know when, but I think that's the inevitable result of good self-mothering.

And it takes whatever time it takes.

Hops

"That'll do, pig, that'll do."

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2009, 11:31:28 AM »
Helen, Ami and Hops, thanks for all that you wrote...it helps, I'm still trying to digest will have response later, maybe.

There is a voice in me that says I need to read the threads here and posts to connect with others, getting out of self.

But, honestly, the pain and memories for me are just getting worse and worse, it is as if my defenses were just being stripped down to expose a peek at the rawness of child neglect wounds, giving me a short preview of what to expect, easing me into the intensity of the pain. My chest is burning in a stabbing pain as well as I can feel raw terror running through my head and heart - it is old terror, there is in reality nothing to fear in the present, well, maybe, if I do not get a job or money, but I just have a really hardtime believing that God would leave me so stranded for so long....but then lately I am starting to wonder....things could get worse. AND, that is exactly how I felt has a baby....stranded.

We can repress every emotion except love, love will never stay down. The memories of repressed terror and stabbing pain is up for me....I have no idea how long or how much worse it is going to get AND that is exactly how I felt has a child.

As far as having an enlightened witness, I have no one...except God, who I know accepts me (ALL of me even my smoking and chair throwing angry self), I am just turning to Him.

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2009, 11:54:41 AM »
I'm ok with you writing about any of the needs that you think are too big or too many or recycled.

Thank you Helen...this is very affirmative for me to read, it helps me to stay with the pain rather than try to avoid it. I knew from reading your thread that you had a big heart.

Lise

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2009, 11:57:46 AM »
Whe you have an NM ,you have a certain set of experiences and you must let them go at a deep level in order to reclaim your right to live as a human being

The letting of these old experiences is exactly where I am, I am stuck in the pain, and, as you said somewhere else here that it is so hard, partly it is hard  because the pain is immobilizing pain, incapacitating pain. Helen reminded me that I do not have to incapacitate myself.

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2009, 12:03:00 PM »
It is what it is. You have identified a little girl in need, you have even come to identify with her. And there's no creature more repetitive in this world than a loving mother who is nurturing and determined to protect and love her child.


Hops, all that you wrote was very helpful. This line above sticks with me most though, because it affirms the need to have a mother, a need for me that was so squished, when I can fully allow myself to experience that need, fully, then I feel hope, the hope that even if I can't get money or a job there are resources and I am not money or a job, which is a no brainer for me, so I will survive. But that is part of the pain too, that instinctive need to live, not just survive.

We all want to live, to be emotionally well enough to take in the goodness and beauty that surrounds us rather than caving in on ourselves in order to JUST survive. That is exactly what I did as a baby.

I'm hearing her, I am listening to her pain and what her experience was...it is just coming up and out.

Thank you...thank you.

Lise

Gabben

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Re: Denied, Denied and just frustrated....
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2009, 12:07:40 PM »
I think you see the truth intellectually but STILL feel you are "bad" cuz you have needs. 

Ami - I feel bad for having the need to LIVE, not just survive. I want to live, not just survive. Living means fully alive, alive to all of life, people and life on lifes terms...but then I do not know...I feel like am still just awakening to the pain of what it was like to have my soul, or spirt murdered in childhood, instead of being fully alive, having spirit, I was fully squished into survive mode....life was about surviving the pain, surviving the abuse. So here I am, surviving, just surviving.

God does not want me to just survive, does He?

Lise