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21

Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Mindfulness and codependence thread

« Last post by lighter on April 22, 2026, 01:45:57 PM »

Unexpected fruits of planting.....
smelling straw.....bc childhood ponies, puppies and barn kittens.

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: The Lake House

« Last post by Hopalong on April 22, 2026, 12:28:39 PM »

The UU campus here has a stone path labyrinth, Lighter. I'm no good at it (squirrel in head will not meditate) but I think it's a lovely idea for your lake place.

I like the idea of using broken stones like I did for my patio, which really has a beautiful visual texture, if there can be such a thing. Weed cloth beneath, plus sand.

Create away, your joy is audible!

hugs
Hops

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by Hopalong on April 22, 2026, 12:24:47 PM »

Exactly. Feet stomping. Taking toys but breaking them on the way out. I shouldn't have responded the first time.

I have had all sorts of jargon zip through my head but I think her fury is defensive. Like the aftermath of a narcissistic injury. I feel sad about telling her a couple things that pierced her defenses and likely caused her pain. But I also know that stubborn truth telling from my own perspective is the only thing I can do.

Body still feels it some today, Lighter, but better. Dropping shoulders. Happiness is a warm Pup, who's faithfully squashing my feet so I don't ooze off the bed.

Poet really has become a tragic figure to me. Tragic with fangs and claws. I think her terror of not being famous (like parents) is escalating as she ages and that's why she's writing so much and worrying about being relevant and recognized. (Instead of happy.) I'm the opposite, not better or worse. For me, the tedium of getting things out for publication is so unappealing I just...don't. But readings make my poems feel alive.

I've lost track of how many times I've sincerely and gently wished her well, peace, contentment, etc. Genuinely. But she hunts for offenses and finds them easily. If she allows me to draw and hold a boundary, however gently, something breaks for her. So I do think she feels hurt, or feels the real pain of her perceived authority not working on me any more. Reminding me so much of M's behavior at times, and maybe you're right Lighter, that PD behavior cuts across the variations.

I am calm again. Amazing to me how primal my stuff with her got. My own stuff gets in there, a lot to do with Nmom I'm sure. I don't have claws but am pretty good with words. I just felt unheard repeatedly and finally stopped placating. Sadder but wiser and overall, wiser matters more to me. Sad will pass.

hugs
Hops

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: The Lake House

« Last post by lighter on April 22, 2026, 12:03:18 PM »

The driveway has a central planting area, where the drive goes around at the house.

We cleaned out lots of the dead things.  Will clear out more.  3 pink hydrangea will go near the overgrown azaleas.....but then.... I'd like to use the beautiful big terra cotta baseboard/assorted other til s, to lay out a meditation garden.  Trails to walk.

Any ideas, ladies?

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: The Lake House

« Last post by lighter on April 22, 2026, 11:58:29 AM »

The "dummy arch", as my brother's friend calls the 💍 arch, is planted with micro clover, and 32 Creeping Jenny plants...... they'll eventually cascade over the stone retaining wall.

The clover seeds are tiny, so mixed with 3 parts sand, 1 part seeds.

Water morning and night.

The sun is burning, so cover with straw.

Water morning and night.
In a drought, so not enough water pressure for sprinklers.

All things considered....will be ok if everything grows.

We have beautiful ferns, and wild growing forest things to transplant in the rain.....this weekend?  Hopefully.

The lake's SO far down. 

The dummy arch has an old bell mounted inside....must have been in my family 100 years.  It's big and has a lovely patina.

I'll start another post regarding choices on walking meditation garden, using old tiles.

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by lighter on April 22, 2026, 11:50:07 AM »

I agree, Hops.  Poet's ticked off, bc you didn't let her control the narrative.

It would have been more peaceful, but for her continued stomping of your stated boundaries. 

I guess we accept what is offered, from disordered people, or we limit contact/withdrawal with love.....but we make the different choices.

The PDs have only one script.....one pattern, IME.

How's it feeling, in your body, today?

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by sKePTiKal on April 22, 2026, 10:33:06 AM »

Man. She sounds like if she doesn't get to make the rules of how people act, think & feel about her she must adamantly proclaim she's taking herself and her toys home. Did she stomp her feet too?

But it was too late; she couldn't claim breaking things off - you'd already done that. Part of her realized this, I guess, and threw a rediculous hissy fit full of threats of denying access to her wonderful, but struggling self.

I hope ice cream was an adequate antidote to that level of ick. I know bourbon is!  <wink wink>

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by Hopalong on April 21, 2026, 12:43:28 PM »

Ugh ugh ugh. Her response was a lot of instructions about how we'd continue to be "email friends" only because she wants to "stay in touch" but even if she comes to town she wouldn't see me because it would be too "uncomfortable" and on and on....but she'll email again, unless she doesn't, etc. She says "uncomfortable" a lot.

Stupidly, I responded again. She'd mentioned seeing "old Hops" in my friendly, first response to her unexpected email. I wrote that "old Hops" had been ever-ready to support her intensely in all things but now I realize it wasn't quite reciprocal, but my codependent attachment that needed to loosen. And now it has.

Longer story shorter, she built up to fury again. "Goodbye. I will now resign from the poetry group. If I'm ever in your town again I will visit the other poets individually."
Blah blah etceterblah. Her last email was to announce that I wrote her "intentionally to hurt her" -- and she would never read an email from me again. Good, since I won't be writing one.

I think she's in a hot fury because I was blunt and direct. I said I believe that only sitting with "uncomfortable" in therapy would be truly freeing. It was unpleasant to feel her trying to reel me in again, so I'm glad she's spitting nails at my refusal to cooperate with her narrative. I hope her anger spurs her to leave me alone and I feel relief that she's leaving the poetry group.

Yeeessshhhh. I feel sometimes that one has to be hypervigilant with N-ish people, even those who were at one time close friends. I went out and bought a pint of ice cream and ate the whole thing to calm down.

But it was Cherry Garcia, so that doesn't count, right?

hugs
Hops

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by Hopalong on April 20, 2026, 02:49:07 PM »

Thanks a lot, Lighter. You taught me a lot during all that. Very strengthening.

hugs
Hops

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Voicelessness and Emotional Survival Message Board / Re: Friendship Moments: good or bad

« Last post by lighter on April 20, 2026, 02:41:37 PM »

Makes sense to me, Hops.  I'm just proud you added that post script.....amazing to notice absent emotional charge!!